I'm not saying it, but I'm thinking it.

TTFrenzy · Aug 5, 2014

fais said:
Muscle growth takes A LOT of time...especially for his legs to go from the size in the before pic to the after pic. This assumption is based on the fact that his physical growth reflects the effects of anab. steroids. i.e swolen jaw, thick neck, thick and waist, abnormally large hips and legs, swollen head. He looks like a rock and floats like a feather. If you didn't get get the chance too, do Look at the article I postd earlier.

Muscle growth takes a lot of time when you are an adult. FZD is steel a teenager and, perhaps you didnt read or didnt pay attention to my previous post but, being a teenager means your testosterone and growth hormone levels are very high so you can actually build a great body in a short period of time (compared to an adult, of course im not saying you can be a monster in 1 year only)

As for the photos, again you dont pay attention, the 2nd photo is 1.5X zoomed compared to the 1st one so this is not a valid comparison to make and come out with solid conclusions

Finally I will agree back with Tony

, 1st you talk about steroids and then you change your mind about "performance enhancing drugs"

Last but not least, check ZJK legs and compare them to his upper body does the difference in size (legs/torso analogy is highly disproportional) really means anything...?????? Same thing for Wang Hao, Ma Lin,Kishikawa

I hope you got my point

Der_Echte · Aug 6, 2014

Hard to see from my crappy old video, but the J-Pen dude in shorts is 5' 5" and a SOLID 185 lbs, I tried picking him up from the floor once, ALL his weight is low. He trained as a TT athlete in middle school. Korean TT training is brutal to put it nicely.

The young lady coach who pops in the scene at :28 has HUGE upper legs, but the long sweat pants are covering them.

This 50 yr old dude from my former club has big upper legs.

fais · Aug 7, 2014

I'm not changing my tune guys, perf. enhance drugs can be specializd anab steroids (http://www.cnn.com/2013/06/06/us/performance-enhancing-drugs-in-sports-fast-facts/index.html).

But i do agree, his growth can be completely natural, though not very common.

fais · Aug 7, 2014

TTFrenzy said:
Muscle growth takes a lot of time when you are an adult. FZD is steel a teenager and, perhaps you didnt read or didnt pay attention to my previous post but, being a teenager means your testosterone and growth hormone levels are very high so you can actually build a great body in a short period of time (compared to an adult, of course im not saying you can be a monster in 1 year only)

As for the photos, again you dont pay attention, the 2nd photo is 1.5X zoomed compared to the 1st one so this is not a valid comparison to make and come out with solid conclusions

Finally I will agree back with Tony , 1st you talk about steroids and then you change your mind about "performance enhancing drugs"

Last but not least, check ZJK legs and compare them to his upper body does the difference in size (legs/torso analogy is highly disproportional) really means anything...?????? Same thing for Wang Hao, Ma Lin,Kishikawa

I hope you got my point

I do get your point, I'm just saying it "could" mean something when there is uncanny performance that comes with it. While i find it suspicious for a 16 yr old to rise through the ranks so quickly, you guys have reminded me this isn't completely new to ping pong, and that with every generation we do find performance improvements by leaps and bounds in this sport.

Tony's Table Tennis · Aug 7, 2014

fais said:
I'm not changing my tune guys, perf. enhance drugs can be specializd anab steroids (http://www.cnn.com/2013/06/06/us/performance-enhancing-drugs-in-sports-fast-facts/index.html).

But i do agree, his growth can be completely natural, though not very common.

Waiting to see CNN update that list with FZD's name on there
ITTF, ATTU, CTTA must all catch a wake up
There must be some new undetectable drug out there as TTD forum member Fais is pretty certain about it!

mahomedy13 · Aug 7, 2014

Put it this way:

if the ITTF thought that the rise of Fan Zhendong is very suspicious,wouldnt they have tried testing him for every substance available???

Tony's Table Tennis · Aug 7, 2014

mahomedy13 said:
Put it this way:

if the ITTF thought that the rise of Fan Zhendong is very suspicious,wouldnt they have tried testing him for every substance available???

Answer is pretty simple - ITTF already tested it, and it came out clean.
But no one said ITTF think FZD is very suspicious, it is our forum member Fais lol

Maybe Fais should smuggle into one of the world tours and steal FZD's urine sample and have that tested

mahomedy13 · Aug 7, 2014

Tony's Table Tennis said:
Answer is pretty simple - ITTF already tested it, and it came out clean.
But no one said ITTF think FZD is very suspicious, it is our forum member Fais lol

Maybe Fais should smuggle into one of the world tours and steal FZD's urine sample and have that tested

Lol.

I really enjoy watching him play.

The motivation he gives me!Someone the same age as me can achieve these outstanding results!

Tinykin · Aug 7, 2014

Tony's Table Tennis said:
Answer is pretty simple - ITTF already tested it, and it came out clean.
But no one said ITTF think FZD is very suspicious, it is our forum member Fais lol

Maybe Fais should smuggle into one of the world tours and steal FZD's urine sample and have that tested

Agreed. AFAIK, winners especially are drug tested at every major tournament.

Der_Echte · Aug 7, 2014

Maybe it is the special regional rice you get from Asian tourneys...

Tony's Table Tennis · Aug 7, 2014

Fais, your "before" picture was taken in 2013
Here is a video of fatty in 2012

BTW check out both these guys on steriods, both fatties

perniciousnc · Aug 10, 2014

i think many members already pointed out how unlikely and irrational this is. if it is true. then logic will lead us to think that all chinese players are basically dopping. success just simply doesn't come with trying steroid with one member, and then that member happening to win a lot of technical and mental games. deducing from the wins to steroid is not good as well, so if you're deducing doping from leg size, then one should comment the same on many players. but the thing is, why would anyone do that? given it is not usually physical endurance that costs you the game, and previous winners like ZJK is doing well without the drug. one last point. remember OVTCHAROV was tested positive? i believe it was a german institue testing him, but it seems testing is not uncommon. i don't know why i can't use the "enter" function using my laptop at home.

Tinykin · Aug 10, 2014

Is FZD performance all that outstanding compared to predecessors

fais said:
I do get your point, I'm just saying it "could" mean something when there is uncanny performance that comes with it. While i find it suspicious for a 16 yr old to rise through the ranks so quickly, you guys have reminded me this isn't completely new to ping pong, and that with every generation we do find performance improvements by leaps and bounds in this sport.

Let's start a list of 16-18yo superstar
Table tennis - Stellan Bengtsson, won the TT wc at 18yo
Tennis - Boris Becker won Wimbledon at age 17yo
Football - Pele at age 16yo was a star player on the Brazilian team that won the WC in 1958

Now, what has FZD done to even come close to those guys at 16-18yo? Or are you saying that Bengsston, Becker, Pele, Maradonna all took steriods as youngsters?

fais · Aug 14, 2014

Tony's Table Tennis said:
Answer is pretty simple - ITTF already tested it, and it came out clean.
But no one said ITTF think FZD is very suspicious, it is our forum member Fais lol

Maybe Fais should smuggle into one of the world tours and steal FZD's urine sample and have that tested

Ha ha ha ha! I don't need such an elaborate excuse to smuggle into the world tours. Just to watch them would be reason enough!

fais · Aug 14, 2014

perniciousnc said:
i think many members already pointed out how unlikely and irrational this is. if it is true. then logic will lead us to think that all chinese players are basically dopping. success just simply doesn't come with trying steroid with one member, and then that member happening to win a lot of technical and mental games. deducing from the wins to steroid is not good as well, so if you're deducing doping from leg size, then one should comment the same on many players. but the thing is, why would anyone do that? given it is not usually physical endurance that costs you the game, and previous winners like ZJK is doing well without the drug. one last point. remember OVTCHAROV was tested positive? i believe it was a german institue testing him, but it seems testing is not uncommon. i don't know why i can't use the "enter" function using my laptop at home.

I agree with everything you've said, but now I question about the case re. Dima

(no, I'm not accusing dima either). The use of steroids/perf enahnce. drugs (and getting away with it) in all the major sports across the US and ESPECIALLY in the olympics is sooo widespread, IMHO to think no one in TT is doping sounds improbable and there fore not as unlikely and irrational as everyone is making it out to be... Also, many, many, many professional athletes have doped and beaten the system. Lance Armstrong for one (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Lance_Armstrong_doping_allegations) comes to mind.

To the person who laughed at my idea of steroids in TT... well guess what, someone is probably using it or they wouldn't be testing, would they?

Many people openly accuse the chinese team of boosting their rubbers, why is what I propose so far fetched? When I said i'm not saying it, but rather thinking it, I was deliberately NOT accusing FZD of doping, because I'm not convinced that he is (I'm just not convinced it is impossible for FZD or any uncannily gifted player to never have doped, nor should anyone else here be convinced). Just watching him play (and staring at that massive jawline of his stired the idea in my head of doping in the world of TT.

Competing at such a high stage with so much riding on the line is the exact reason for these athletes dope. Avoiding controversy or destroying an organization/athlete's image is the exact reason for said organization to cover it. Everyone knew March McGuire was doping, but it didn't stop him from entering the Hall of Fame. If Germany's poster boy Dima did juice, don't you think Germany (or even ITTF for that matter) would want their images sullied or would a quick slap on the hand and behind the curtain fix be the way to go. "Oh yeah, he wasn't roiding... its just some chinese rice he ate.. not the rice the rest of the chinese players eat tho!", I agree, that is completely rational </sarcasm>.

Tinykin · Aug 14, 2014

Fais, stop being a sleezy lawyer/journalist type hiding behind carefully chosen lawyer/journalist speak.
Be a man, and say clearly what you mean, that is, openly accuse the CNT of doping. That's what you are all but saying isn't it?

johnbhoy72 · Aug 14, 2014

Tinykin said:
Fais, stop being a sleezy lawyer/journalist type hiding behind carefully chosen lawyer/journalist speak.
Be a man, and say clearly what you mean, that is, openly accuse the CNT of doping. That's what you are all but saying isn't it?

There appears to be something of an agenda emanating from the OP's fact deprived opening gambit, what it is I don't know?
It couldn't be that the player in question is naturally powerfully built?
I'm sure over the course of all our lives we've met people and thought 16??? He looks about 21.... It's not that uncommon.

Circumstantial evidence, conjecture & deliberately obtuse wording do not a convincing case make.

Sent from my D6503 using Tapatalk

Mr. RicharD · Aug 14, 2014

It's less about the steroids and more the fact that ages are refixed on legal documents. It's very common for TT players in China when they're picked by coaches for provincial teams to go get their legal documents changed. I've had many U.S. players train with players when they were younger and find out when they come to the U.S. they're all of a sudden 3 years younger even though they trained in the same age group in China.

So if there's any issue it's probably more to do with the age fraud rather than the drug abuse.

TTFrenzy · Aug 14, 2014

fais said:
I agree with everything you've said, but now I question about the case re. Dima (no, I'm not accusing dima either). The use of steroids/perf enahnce. drugs (and getting away with it) in all the major sports across the US and ESPECIALLY in the olympics is sooo widespread, IMHO to think no one in TT is doping sounds improbable and there fore not as unlikely and irrational as everyone is making it out to be... Also, many, many, many professional athletes have doped and beaten the system. Lance Armstrong for one (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Lance_Armstrong_doping_allegations) comes to mind.

To the person who laughed at my idea of steroids in TT... well guess what, someone is probably using it or they wouldn't be testing, would they?

Many people openly accuse the chinese team of boosting their rubbers, why is what I propose so far fetched? When I said i'm not saying it, but rather thinking it, I was deliberately NOT accusing FZD of doping, because I'm not convinced that he is (I'm just not convinced it is impossible for FZD or any uncannily gifted player to never have doped, nor should anyone else here be convinced). Just watching him play (and staring at that massive jawline of his stired the idea in my head of doping in the world of TT.

Competing at such a high stage with so much riding on the line is the exact reason for these athletes dope. Avoiding controversy or destroying an organization/athlete's image is the exact reason for said organization to cover it. Everyone knew March McGuire was doping, but it didn't stop him from entering the Hall of Fame. If Germany's poster boy Dima did juice, don't you think Germany (or even ITTF for that matter) would want their images sullied or would a quick slap on the hand and behind the curtain fix be the way to go. "Oh yeah, he wasn't roiding... its just some chinese rice he ate.. not the rice the rest of the chinese players eat tho!", I agree, that is completely rational </sarcasm>.

Its more than obvious that you didnt make your research buddy. Type in google about ovtcharov's case and you will see why he was innocent. I dont understand why you persist so much about this issue. If FZD was taking steroids his face would change also (acme/facial hair and voice changes dramatically), and it is clear to everybody I think that FZD has a baby face

Tinykin · Aug 14, 2014

..................... I've had many U.S. players train with players when they were younger and find out when they come to the U.S. they're all of a sudden 3 years younger even though they trained in the same age group in China.................[/QUOTE said:
I know that youvre highlighted something serious, but I couldn't help laughing when I read that

I'm not saying it, but I'm thinking it.

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