Backhand Rakza 7 vs C1 vs G1 vs Vega Korea vs Vega Japan vs D09c

[Zezima]

Hello everyone,
I currently play Rakza 7 2.0mm on my BH. My FH is a G1 2.0mm. My racket is ~200$ Long 5 90g
I like to play with a lot of spin and 3rd Ball attack. I mostly block, flick their service (only backhand side), or loop. I dont really counterloop on the bh side.
Are any of those listed in the title same speed (not looking for more speed) but more spinny? It takes a lot of effort to loop spinny with Rakza 7. And the opponents dont really struggle unless I topspin forward. But I also want to have the option where I can do a slow high spinny ball to buy myself more time and just be more variable (lets face it we dont always stand properly to the ball to send rockets to the other side).

This is a 6months old video of me playing. Today I loop more with a more open racket on my FH side but I think my bh just got like 10% better since this (Improved more on the fh side).

<--- slow spinny BH loop I was talking about. Its my prefered "passive" shot to get back into the game. Sadly I have lots of slippage on the BH side because the rubber doesnt grip the ball if I hit it too thinly. And I think I read somewhere I am supposed to hit more "flat" with this rubber. Would it also help to go for max thickness instead of 2.0mm? Rubbers are new. It doesnt happen very often but like 1 in 10 I think.

New Season starts in 1Month and since we played 1 Tier higher up last season I feel confident to be Top 10 atleast in the singles standings for this year.
Idc about the money I am already 28 and want to play with the best equipment available as long as I have the right skillset like (fast enough arm and the technique). I also started training multiballs and work on my technique each session. Oh yeah I also play since the age of 20 so its been 8 years.

 

[JJ Ng]

Let me address your question. You look to be pretty high level already. And you are getting multi-ball training now.

Rakza 7, I have used. It is a jack-of-all-trades. It performs everything very well but also nothing too strong. But it is a good rubber because it is grippy and last like forever (similar to Mark V).

C1 would be a downgrade in terms of speed and softness. I used C-1 on my backhand now.

G1, I have played with. G-1 (like Rakza 7) lasts forever. G1 might be a bit gripper than Rakza 7. However, G-1 is heavy. Like very heavy.

Vega Korea, I have not played with. But it might play similarly to Vega Japan and Vega Asia.

Vega Japan is very similar to C-1. So it might be a downgrade in terms of speed and softness. But I like that. I use Vega Japan on my backhand on another blade.

D09c is a true hybrid. It has a grippy topsheet so if you are looking for light brushing, high arcing loops, by using the tacky topsheet to pick up the ball with minimal engagement of sponge, then D09c might be what you are looking for. However D09c is not that catapulty at the lower end of the hitting speed. D09c will become faster if you hit the ball harder. So switching from Rakza 7 to D09c might take time for you to get used to it.

Those are the pro's and con's.

 

[Zezima]

Let me address your question. You look to be pretty high level already. And you are getting multi-ball training now.

Rakza 7, I have used. It is a jack-of-all-trades. It performs everything very well but also nothing too strong. But it is a good rubber because it is grippy and last like forever (similar to Mark V).

C1 would be a downgrade in terms of speed and softness. I used C-1 on my backhand now.

G1, I have played with. G-1 (like Rakza 7) lasts forever. G1 might be a bit gripper than Rakza 7. However, G-1 is heavy. Like very heavy.

Vega Korea, I have not played with. But it might play similarly to Vega Japan and Vega Asia.

Vega Japan is very similar to C-1. So it might be a downgrade in terms of speed and softness. But I like that. I use Vega Japan on my backhand on another blade.

D09c is a true hybrid. It has a grippy topsheet so if you are looking for light brushing, high arcing loops, by using the tacky topsheet to pick up the ball with minimal engagement of sponge, then D09c might be what you are looking for. However D09c is not that catapulty at the lower end of the hitting speed. D09c will become faster if you hit the ball harder. So switching from Rakza 7 to D09c might take time for you to get used to it.

Those are the pro's and con's.

In what way would I need to adjust to D09c. 3-4 years ago I tried a used Tenergy 05 and the faster I did my backhand topspin the more "secure" it felt. In terms of I knew its gonna land on the table which I didn´t experience with any other rubber since then. But because I couldn´t tell how used that rubber was + expensive and I was still learning I didn´t go for the new sheet. And now I heard ppl that used that switch to D09c and not looking back. Since it´s gonna be only on one side I can afford it now if its gonna be an upgrade to my game (and if my current blade would support that).
I don´t really want to go for a downgrade, since my backhand technique is really good. You can´t really see it on those videos but in yesterdays tournament I swept everyone but in finals 3-0. And Rakza 7 definetly helped with building that confidence. Now I realized since I am also getting older and older that I want to use my Backhand more and more and not rely too much on my fh on the bh side. How is the throw angle compared to Rakza 7? I also read that some rubbers you can/should brush some others you should hit it more directly. Otherwise its gonna be a one off thing and I will switch back in January. Since I can still rely on my fh to win games its not gonna be a big risk taking for me. How long would it last me? I train 2-3 times a week currently. Always want to fit in multiballs from now on + focusing on getting the backhand topspin fast, since I can do it controlled (slower) already.

 

[jaghaimo]

I'm in a similar place to you - choosing rubbers for the next season due to start next month. I'll limit this post to the rubbers you are interested in. All rubbers I mention were used on a Long 5 blade, and I asked my sparing partner for comment. Rubbers were used on the BH with focus on loops and banana flicks, tested during the same session. Exception was Dignics, which I used on both FH and BH (so also did FH flicks and loops).

Subjectively, my partners feefback:
Vega Korea: slower and less spinny than G1 and R7
Fastarc G1 and Rakza 7: good spin and speed
Dignics 09c: hardest to return (spinny and deep balls); on my end it felt easier to control and that I had the largest safety margin (BUT I had to commit to a stroke - this rubber hated passive play)

Objectively, numbers:
I have a shore 0 durometer. Shore 0 is meant to measure at least 10mm materials so keep in mind measurements of a 2.2mm rubber is not accurate (and you also measure topsheet indirectly). But it's good enough for comparison, so I measure all my rubbers woth it.

Vega Korea - 42 degrees, 50g cut
Rakza 7 - 45 degrees, 48g cut
Fastarc G1 - 45 degrees, 48g cut
Dignics 09c - 48 degrees, no idea about the weight yet (friends rubber, had no scale, gut feeling is it's a bit lighter than the other 3)

All rubbers were cut to 156x150 blade (Long 5 is 158x150).

I can swap between R7 and G1 no problem, the differences are subtle. Korea needed short adjustment period. Adjusting to Dignics took the longest but still withing few minutes (but to be fair I played with this rubber on an Ovtcharov blade for 20h beforehand). Once adjusted it was a pleasure playing with it.

I'm leaning towards:
BH: R7/G1 or 09c
FH: H3 (testing this week) or 09c

 

[blahness]

09c pairs really well with Long 5, it was one of most enjoyable setups to play before my Long 5 got stolen in a club

It was a real spin monster which can churn out heavy af spin easily.

 

[Aizen]

You don’t need to consider other than 09c, the rest of rubbers won’t give more drastic spin increase than r7.
Your options for more spin:
- hurricane like Chinese rubbers,
- hybrid rubbers or
- Tenergy or dignics (05 etc) -> you stated want no more speed

So The Only option in your list is d09c. (ofc it's hybrid rubber it has own disadvantages like hardness and weight etc)

 

[blahness]

You don’t need to consider other than 09c, the rest of rubbers won’t give more drastic spin increase than r7.
Your options for more spin:
- hurricane like Chinese rubbers,
- hybrid rubbers or
- Tenergy or dignics (05 etc) -> you stated want no more speed

So The Only option in your list is d09c. (ofc it's hybrid rubber it has own disadvantages like hardness and weight etc)

The other BH rubber which is really underrated is H3 37. I used it on a friend's blade and the spin output was insane, and it also had lots of gears.

 

[K.K]

maybe just try rakza z? a little harder and slower with a tacky topsheet that grips the ball super good with slow brushed spins that isn’t super fast and doesn‘t cost a fortune to try. if you like it, but even need it harder you can still go deeper into the hybrid world with d09, bluegrip C1 or even hurricane 3. but i can image rakza z will solve your problem easy

 

[JJ Ng]

maybe just try rakza z? a little harder and slower with a tacky topsheet that grips the ball super good with slow brushed spins that isn’t super fast and doesn‘t cost a fortune to try. if you like it, but even need it harder you can still go deeper into the hybrid world with d09, bluegrip C1 or even hurricane 3. but i can image rakza z will solve your problem easy

Rakza Z is slow.......

Just go with D09c

 

[SlowPower]

Hybrid MK...

 

[jaghaimo]

maybe just try rakza z? a little harder and slower with a tacky topsheet that grips the ball super good with slow brushed spins that isn’t super fast and doesn‘t cost a fortune to try. if you like it, but even need it harder you can still go deeper into the hybrid world with d09, bluegrip C1 or even hurricane 3. but i can image rakza z will solve your problem easy

I played with Rakza Z (Extra Hard) on Long 5 on FH. Personally I didn't like this combination, too slow. My partner found it easier to return compared to say a Battle 2 (which was actually on a Viscaria, so apples and oranges).

This week I will be checking 3 rubbers on Long 5:
- H3 NEO 39d boosted (2 layers of Seamoon yellow) for BH
- H3 NEO 39d unboosted for FH (to be boosted with1 layer if I find it unplayable)
- Dignics 09c for FH/BH (only played with it on BTY Ovtcharov blade, but really liked it)

I'll report back in few days. Had I not have H3s to test I'd have already pick D09c on both sides.

Idc about the money I am already 28 and want to play with the best equipment available as long as I have the right skillset like (fast enough arm and the technique).

D09c then, on both sides - you will not look back. And if you want to experiment more, try H3 on FH once this upcoming season finish?

 

[Zezima]

I am very unsure about chinese rubbers. I have no clue about boosting and such. I sometimes don´t even realize when the rubber loses its effect because I can adjust to the setup really well. And from what Timo B. said with D09c I don´t have to worry about that like H3 rubbers. But for now I am happy with my fh. Might go max G1 instead of 2,00 again, since I can control it well already. The good thing is when I loop well even the best blockers block it out, since they are prob not used to this much spin and underrate it. But they dont really struggle as much with the spin from my bh. And I think one change at a time is better than changing them both. As you said I might look into that rubber and see if it needs a lot of work with booster and such and what their duration is (if reglue is needed and so on) and do it mid seasonbreak maybe.
Then I am gonna go with one red 2,1mm sheet of d09c for my BH on long 5 and g1 super thick again or max on fh. That setup should be an upgrade again hopefully the money not wasted on the bh.

the Rubber will cost me 85€ with shipping fee(5€). Kind of a bad taste that they dont even cover the shipping fee but whatever..

 

[Abbimmael]

Maybe try to improve your technique since I also use Rakza 7 on my backhand with long 5 and I find my loops against backspin consistently very spinny and quick

 

[Amayzde]

If you want a rubber thats more spinny on the backhand, pick G-1 on backhand as well. If G-1 is too hard, then try the P-1.

As for the footage. Most mistakes that you do make are footwork and timing related. No different rubber will fix those things.

 

[Aizen]

I am very unsure about chinese rubbers. I have no clue about boosting and such. I sometimes don´t even realize when the rubber loses its effect because I can adjust to the setup really well. And from what Timo B. said with D09c I don´t have to worry about that like H3 rubbers. But for now I am happy with my fh. Might go max G1 instead of 2,00 again, since I can control it well already. The good thing is when I loop well even the best blockers block it out, since they are prob not used to this much spin and underrate it. But they dont really struggle as much with the spin from my bh. And I think one change at a time is better than changing them both. As you said I might look into that rubber and see if it needs a lot of work with booster and such and what their duration is (if reglue is needed and so on) and do it mid seasonbreak maybe.
Then I am gonna go with one red 2,1mm sheet of d09c for my BH on long 5 and g1 super thick again or max on fh. That setup should be an upgrade again hopefully the money not wasted on the bh.

the Rubber will cost me 85€ with shipping fee(5€). Kind of a bad taste that they dont even cover the shipping fee but whatever..

You should also consider d09c will be relatively slower actually less bouncy than rakza 7, which could be love/hate situation. When we consider you fh will be faster than bh, it might happen. Most ppl choose d09c (or hybrids) for short game or more effect on harder shots.

 

[blahness]

I tried vega series on a clubmate's bat today too and was super unimpressed by the topspin capabilities, I am not sure why so many ppl are loving it. The ball leaves the rubber way too fast and the topspin arc generation is weak and insecure compared to top rubbers like dignics and hurricane.

 

[Way Zooted]

I ordered a Tibhar K1 47.5 (not Euro or plus version) to try on BH.

 

[jaghaimo]

I am very unsure about chinese rubbers. I have no clue about boosting and such. I sometimes don´t even realize when the rubber loses its effect because I can adjust to the setup really well. And from what Timo B. said with D09c I don´t have to worry about that like H3 rubbers.

Fair enough. Do note that D09c is harder than R7/G1.

Have you flipped your bat and used G1 on BH? Maybe all you need is a G1 MAX on FH and G1 2.0 on BH?

 

[Zezima]

Fair enough. Do note that D09c is harder than R7/G1.

Have you flipped your bat and used G1 on BH? Maybe all you need is a G1 MAX on FH and G1 2.0 on BH?

First of all I ordered one "test" sheet of D09c red 2,1mm for the BH.

I never really flipped my bat. Is that a thing? I thought there is a FH side and the Bh side and it plays "different" if I just flip. Or maybe it was with certain other blades idk. If its identical then I would try and give it a shot.

I actually tend towards going max thickness from now. Just because appearently its easier to spin and since I can loop Topspin with the rubber I want to get the most out of it. I don´t like long rallys. I wanna finish mostly with 3rd ball attack or the next Ball after. The longer it goes the more footwork is required and I get tired -> My shot gets worse and worse. So I want to focus on the first 3x balls in the rally. And with Rakza 7 I could block really well which made me block shots more than looping hard which is gonna get blocked effortless.

If I can flip the bat with the same characteristics if it actually doesn´t matter, then I would also test it for my FH and if I like it only on one side I would clap the G1 to the other side. That would be ideal.

 

[jaghaimo]

I never really flipped my bat. Is that a thing? I thought there is a FH side and the Bh side and it plays "different" if I just flip. Or maybe it was with certain other blades idk. If its identical then I would try and give it a shot.

Very few blades will have two different sides. Long 5 is symmetrical, you can flip it around and play. It might feel a bit uncomfortable, as you've probably rounded down wings with your grip on one side by now.

If I can flip the bat with the same characteristics if it actually doesn´t matter, then I would also test it for my FH and if I like it only on one side I would clap the G1 to the other side. That would be ideal.

Yes, this is essentially how you can quickly test rubbers - put two different sheets on your blade, play some strokes, flip, play same strokes, compare. Repeat on FH. Ideal would be to have a partner who could give you their impressions on receive.

Personally, I focus on one wing first (say BH, both rubbers) instead of doing one rubber on both wings. Doing one wing (rubber A, flip, rubber B) lets me directly compare them, and my opponent can quickly comment as well.