Different types of Butterfly Innerforce ZLC blades - Franziska vs Apolonia vs Harimoto vs Innerforce ZLC

[Koichi]

Hey guys, I've been wondering if anyone has played the blades metioned above and knows their differences. I currently play the Freitas ALC and love how it plays on backhand. However I recently acquired the Franziska ZLC in hopes it would play similarly to it but boy was I wrong... it even plays very differently compared to the regular Innerforce Layer ZLC I previously owned. Based off my experience the Franziska has a very soft touch and it feels like you have to work very hard for every single ball whereas you can play with more wrist on BH with the normal Innerforce ZLC and the ball just lands. It also appears to be quite a bit harder. Closer to the feeling of a outer layer carbon blade with Limba outer ply.

So here is my question to people who have played these blades and possibly even the Freitas. I am very happy with it but I feel like the Forehand of the Innerforce ZLC might fit my playstyle a bit better. How do these blades compare to one another in terms of hardness, speed, spin and dwell time? Potential of kill shots, maybe? Please, please let me know. I'm very close to buying a new Innerforce ZLC otherwise. But I feel like the Apolonia or Harimoto might be a better fit if one of them feels slightly harder and more similar to the Freitas ALC.

Looking forward to your answers.

 

[Scarfed Garchomp]

If you tried and liked the IFLZLC then you should just get one and be done with it

 

[h3llary]

I have played with freitas alc and apolonia only once but it was enough to see the difference between them and my franziska innerforce zlc. Apolonia is pretty similar to freitas except it is more head heavy and has more of an arc with the same rubbers compared to flatter traejctory from the freitas.

Speed wise: Freitas 9/10, Apolonia ZLC 8.5/10, Innerforce Franziska 7.5/10 (at least my blade because it's super light, 80g only. I imagine 88-90g franziska would play differently)

 

[Koichi]

I have played with freitas alc and apolonia only once but it was enough to see the difference between them and my franziska innerforce zlc. Apolonia is pretty similar to freitas except it is more head heavy and has more of an arc with the same rubbers compared to flatter traejctory from the freitas.

Speed wise: Freitas 9/10, Apolonia ZLC 8.5/10, Innerforce Franziska 7.5/10 (at least my blade because it's super light, 80g only. I imagine 88-90g franziska would play differently)

My Franziska ZLC weighs 90g and it still plays pretty slow compared to Freitas or IFZLC so yeah no big difference. But very insightful thanks! I was thinking about getting the Apolonia or normal IF Zlc as both of them are a little harder than the Franziska. Whenever I play it the blade feels a bit squishy.. idk how to describe it. It doesn't feel solid like a Freitas or IFZLC would

Are you 100% sure about the lower arc of Freitas vs Apolonia? Since on paper ZLC usually has a more linear arc compared to ALC. But that's also comparing an IF vs outer carbon... Do you have any more info as to how they compare?

 

[h3llary]

My Franziska ZLC weighs 90g and it still plays pretty slow compared to Freitas or IFZLC so yeah no big difference. But very insightful thanks! I was thinking about getting the Apolonia or normal IF Zlc as both of them are a little harder than the Franziska. Whenever I play it the blade feels a bit squishy.. idk how to describe it. It doesn't feel solid like a Freitas or IFZLC would

Are you 100% sure about the lower arc of Freitas vs Apolonia? Since on paper ZLC usually has a more linear arc compared to ALC. But that's also comparing an IF vs outer carbon... Do you have any more info as to how they compare?

Yesterday I tried my friend's ovtcharov alc 92g right after mine 80g franziska. The difference is night and day in terms of speed/penetrating power but with franziska I have a lot more control over the placement. With ovtcharov the only thing I could do is attack, attack and attack. There was nothing between, just serve and then straight up finish the point with the 3rd ball. With franziska there is not enough penetrating power like with ovtcharov/apolonia for that matter so I'm not confident in my 3rd ball attack as much so I rely on placement and blocks a lot more and as it also requires less physical effort.

 

[andzejgolot]

I played with every inner zlc blades from Butterfly. I would choose An Jaehyun Tmxi Pro over them.
I had 78 grams Franziska and it was nightmare to Play. The characteristic of OFF blade and speed of ALL+ blade is nightmare. Why? Because I made similar mistakes but didnt have the power to end my opponent.
Apolonia? I really like it, but I had more than 10 apolonias. So more hate - love
Layer ZLC ? Bouncy on backhand side.
Harimoto ? I like it because it feels like the most spinny and stable for block inner zlc
But An Jaehyun Tmxi Pro is special. I mean I dont care. You can buy Tibhar Libra Zac and love even more

 

[Koichi]

I played with every inner zlc blades from Butterfly. I would choose An Jaehyun Tmxi Pro over them.
I had 78 grams Franziska and it was nightmare to Play. The characteristic of OFF blade and speed of ALL+ blade is nightmare. Why? Because I made similar mistakes but didnt have the power to end my opponent.
Apolonia? I really like it, but I had more than 10 apolonias. So more hate - love
Layer ZLC ? Bouncy on backhand side.
Harimoto ? I like it because it feels like the most spinny and stable for block inner zlc
But An Jaehyun Tmxi Pro is special. I mean I dont care. You can buy Tibhar Libra Zac and love even more

Why have you bought 10? Do they play so differently?

 

[Gsen999]

Any reason to go for harimoto zlc over apolonia zlc? Apolonia I bought is 90.5 grams I prefer a little more dwell and vibrations from my blade that's why i liked the old innerforce series but handles were horrible for me too small sort of. Is harimoto a world difference than apolonia? @andzejgolot please provide insight.

 

[Koichi]

Any reason to go for harimoto zlc over apolonia zlc? Apolonia I bought is 90.5 grams I prefer a little more dwell and vibrations from my blade that's why i liked the old innerforce series but handles were horrible for me too small sort of. Is harimoto a world difference than apolonia? @andzejgolot please provide insight.

Hey there, do you have any insights as to what the differences between innerforce layer zlc and apolonia are?

 

[SleepyMaster]

I have innerforce layer ZLC/Apolonia/Franziska also Harimoto ALC.
Apolonia and Harimoto is more comfortable for my game than all of those ZLC - but I don’t know does it better for you?

I prefer harder blades, I would say, with not too much of vibration and such softness like Frankiska for example. Apolonia is definitely has more power but maybe bit harder to control for the one who used to a soft blades.

All of those blades are limba top ply but Harimoto and Apolonia top ply is more darker in color (maybe different part of limba or something) - so they more crispy and stiffer/harder 🤓

 

[SleepyMaster]

I played with every inner zlc blades from Butterfly. I would choose An Jaehyun Tmxi Pro over them.
I had 78 grams Franziska and it was nightmare to Play. The characteristic of OFF blade and speed of ALL+ blade is nightmare. Why? Because I made similar mistakes but didnt have the power to end my opponent.
Apolonia? I really like it, but I had more than 10 apolonias. So more hate - love
Layer ZLC ? Bouncy on backhand side.
Harimoto ? I like it because it feels like the most spinny and stable for block inner zlc
But An Jaehyun Tmxi Pro is special. I mean I dont care. You can buy Tibhar Libra Zac and love even more

Why in the world someone is needed ten Apolonia blades? It is really good one but - if you not Tiago then why?

 

[disaster3]

In terms of Apolonia, I think that you did not understand correctly and some context would be helpful. I understood it as bought 1, at first was amazing but suddenly he hated it looking for something else. So he decided to sell. After some time he recalled hmmm Apolonia was really good, maybe I increased my skills and gave it another try… and so on until the 10th (maybe the weight was also the case, choose what you want) this is how I understood this 10 in some time period in terms of hate and love.
But of course I might be wrong

 

[Koichi]

I have innerforce layer ZLC/Apolonia/Franziska also Harimoto ALC.
Apolonia and Harimoto is more comfortable for my game than all of those ZLC - but I don’t know does it better for you?

I prefer harder blades, I would say, with not too much of vibration and such softness like Frankiska for example. Apolonia is definitely has more power but maybe bit harder to control for the one who used to a soft blades.

All of those blades are limba top ply but Harimoto and Apolonia top ply is more darker in color (maybe different part of limba or something) - so they more crispy and stiffer/harder 🤓

I currently play the Freitas and was looking for something similar just as innerforce zlc. Would you say the Apolonia or the Layer ZLC comes closer to Freitas in feeling and hardness? I dont like how you have to work super hard in order to get a decently paced ball with Franziska. With Freitas i just flick my wrist and get the same speed in backhand as a full swing bh topspin (big exaggerated but you know what I mean)

 

[Wrighty67]

Maybe I missed this but I’m not clear what you don’t like about the Freitas, and therefore what you’re looking for?

Frans/Apolonia etc are very different than outer blades because they’re more woody and slower, which it seems you don’t like.

 

[h3llary]

I currently play the Freitas and was looking for something similar just as innerforce zlc. Would you say the Apolonia or the Layer ZLC comes closer to Freitas in feeling and hardness? I dont like how you have to work super hard in order to get a decently paced ball with Franziska. With Freitas i just flick my wrist and get the same speed in backhand as a full swing bh topspin (big exaggerated but you know what I mean)

not close, apolonia is a lot harder/stiffer, faster and heavier

 

[Koichi]

Maybe I missed this but I’m not clear what you don’t like about the Freitas, and therefore what you’re looking for?

Frans/Apolonia etc are very different than outer blades because they’re more woody and slower, which it seems you don’t like.

Hm.. basically I used to play the Innerforce Layer ZLC as my main blade but sold it recently because I was convinced I'd stick to Freitas or the then newly acquired Franziska ZLC (which I don't like at all). Despite the two of them having the same composition (layer zlc & franziska) they play very differently. Basically I'm looking for a 2nd blade that could do most things similarly to the Freitas just with a little more control in some aspects.
Before I got the Franziska I sold my layer zlc as I thought they couldn't be that different since their composition is similar. But as mentioned before I was very wrong about it and now I wanna find out whether I buy the layer zlc again or the Apolonia and which one would be a better fit and more similar to Freitas in its playing characteristics

 

[Koichi]

not close, apolonia is a lot harder/stiffer, faster and heavier

Could you elaborate? I feel like saying a blade is heavier when nowadays you can select your selection isn't saying much. Also I rarely heard of an innerforce being faster than an outer carbon blade. And also from experience having played the Ovtcharov, Harimoto, Innerforce layer zlc, alc, alc.s and Franziska ZLC i find it hard to believe that the Apolonia is a lot harder and faster... All these blades are made out of Limba wood which in itself already is a softer wood. But maybe I'm wrong.. I'm just trying to see your reasoning

 

[Wrighty67]

Hm.. basically I used to play the Innerforce Layer ZLC as my main blade but sold it recently because I was convinced I'd stick to Freitas or the then newly acquired Franziska ZLC (which I don't like at all). Despite the two of them having the same composition (layer zlc & franziska) they play very differently. Basically I'm looking for a 2nd blade that could do most things similarly to the Freitas just with a little more control in some aspects.
Before I got the Franziska I sold my layer zlc as I thought they couldn't be that different since their composition is similar. But as mentioned before I was very wrong about it and now I wanna find out whether I buy the layer zlc again or the Apolonia and which one would be a better fit and more similar to Freitas in its playing characteristics

The only blade I know that might work for you, given what you say, is the Maze - I have one and it is like the Freitas but a little softer and less stiff - the inner blades are quite different in my experienice.

 

[Wrighty67]

The only blade I know that might work for you, given what you say, is the Maze - I have one and it is like the Freitas but a little softer and less stiff - the inner blades are quite different in my experienice.

Out of interest my Franziska (91g) is not much different to my Innerforce ZLC (92g) - Frans was a little softer and better feeling to me.

 

[h3llary]

Could you elaborate? I feel like saying a blade is heavier when nowadays you can select your selection isn't saying much. Also I rarely heard of an innerforce being faster than an outer carbon blade. And also from experience having played the Ovtcharov, Harimoto, Innerforce layer zlc, alc, alc.s and Franziska ZLC i find it hard to believe that the Apolonia is a lot harder and faster... All these blades are made out of Limba wood which in itself already is a softer wood. But maybe I'm wrong.. I'm just trying to see your reasoning

Apolonia is only a slightly slower than Ovtcharov innerforce alc, which has nearly the same speed as viscaria/timo boll alc. It is slower only in the short game. Franziska, on the other hand, rarely weighs more than 85g. All the ones that I was able to find were in the range 80-87g. Apolonia the one I tried was 92g, and I guess that's an average weight (90+-g). So it has a lot more speed/penetration power compared to franziska, but franziska is more controllable close to table due to its low weight, vibration/feedback and slower speed. If you are all in attacker who plays far from the table then you would want apolonia or ovtcharov. If you only play close to table like I do then you would benefit from franziska a lot more.

Sometimes limba can be harder than koto, it all depends. The limba on freitas alc that I tried is harder than koto on viscaria for examlpe.