Experience with some other Loki rubbers - Arthur China, GTX Pro (inc)

[Attitude]

So here in germany our playing season ended early due to covidrestrictions at the end of last year.
That gave me some time to try some more equipment 😍 and reconsider some equipment choices.

First of all i have 2 main setups i am switching around a bit for the moment.
1. Blade: DHS TG 506x
FH: DHS Hurricane 3 OS prov (40°) boosted with 2 layers of FTL.
BH: Yasaka Rakza Z (still satisfied with it so far - thx for the recommendations on that again).

2. Blade: Yinhe Pro 01
FH: DHS Hurricane 3 OS prov (40°) boosted with 2 layers of FTL.
BH: DHS Hurricane 8 (37°) boosted with 2 layers of FTL.

The second setup was used to be my spare one, what made me reconsider the rubber-choices because boosting spare setups suck.
So some time ago i ordered Loki Arthur China and started playing with it in January on my Yinhe Pro 01.
Now several things surprised me at once:
1. Somehow my hand got used to the bigger handle of the Yinhe and now i have a better feeling with the blade of all than with my main setup. I experienced handcramps before and thought i would never be able to use it for longer than 30-40 minutes at best. Now i can play with that blade for several hours without any problems.

2. And more important my experience with Loki Arthur China (LAC) compared to DHS Hurricane 3:

I am impressed of the quality of the rubber. It is a bit less tacky than the prov Hurricane 3, but i can hold up a ball with it for several seconds.
As proclaimed by Loki there is no need to boost that rubber (though i might try it in the future).

The rubber is faster by a decent margin than the Hurricane 3. The arc and throwangle is slightly lower which forced me to some adjustments, because touchplay and slower opening-loops were a bit tricky to play this way coming from Hurricane 3.
But it is way easier to get speed from the LAC. While i have to work my ass off with the Hurricane 3 to perform a finisher or at least a really fast and strong topspin i get a way faster and harder shot with less effort. It is simply easier to engage the rubber.
In terms of spin i have some issues to judge that right now. From my feeling i dont recognize i huge difference. At best i would say the Hurricane can bring out slightly more spin in most of the shots. But my 2 opponents and main trainingpartners say the exact opposite and have more issues to block my topspins from the LAC, so i am not so sure.

With that experience i was sure i would have some issues in matches to not shoot over the table and hit more nets because of the lower arc, but surprisingly that wasnt the case. I switched several times between the rubbers in the last 3 months and i had a better feeling and overall better results with the LAC than with the Hurricane 3.

So with that i will probably switch several things for the upcoming weeks and months. The first thing is, that the Yinhe Pro 01 will become my main blade. Second i will put my Yasaka Rakza Z on that bh and third i will stick with LAC on my fh.
On top there is a Loki GTX Pro on the way right now. I will test this one too, since i am very impressed by the Loki rubbers so far.

Has anyone else tested these rubbers or have questions, just let me know.

 

[mocker88]

I tried the LOKI Arthur Asia for a while, but I think it was too hard, and the tack vanished quickly. Sounds fun that the Arthur China seems like a better replacement for H3N, so I might try that one out some day.

I have used the Arthur Europe as well. Good spin. Not so bouncy and you'll have to put a lot of power in your strokes.
N80 is quite close to H3N but with a softer feel and works fairly good for backhand as well.
T3 is fast, a bit grippy, but hard to create spin with.
GTX Pro is softer, more bouncy Euro-style rubber. The top sheet is a bit thick. Not my forehand rubber anyway.
Rxton rubbers are quite nice where Rxton I is slowest and most basic rubber. Rxton III is a bit softer, like a H3N 39 deg and Rxton V is harder, faster and stiffer.

 

[Attitude]

I tried the LOKI Arthur Asia for a while, but I think it was too hard, and the tack vanished quickly. Sounds fun that the Arthur China seems like a better replacement for H3N, so I might try that one out some day.

I have used the Arthur Europe as well. Good spin. Not so bouncy and you'll have to put a lot of power in your strokes.
N80 is quite close to H3N but with a softer feel and works fairly good for backhand as well.
T3 is fast, a bit grippy, but hard to create spin with.
GTX Pro is softer, more bouncy Euro-style rubber. The top sheet is a bit thick. Not my forehand rubber anyway.
Rxton rubbers are quite nice where Rxton I is slowest and most basic rubber. Rxton III is a bit softer, like a H3N 39 deg and Rxton V is harder, faster and stiffer.

I tried the Arthur Europe Diamond some while ago, but for my bh. Still too hard for me. Literally had the same issue with it as you. But i didnt test it for my fh because its behaviour didnt appeal to me for fh.
N80 is supposed to have a 49° sponge - are you sure you can use that on bh?^^ That might intrigue me to test that too in the future.

Same for GTX pro. That is supposed to be very hard with a porous sponge though. Curious how that would feel for me, if you describe it as bouncy.

 

[mocker88]

I'm using Yinhe Big Dipper 38° on bh now, and N80 isn't so far away from that. I use a couple of layers of Haifu Seamoon Booster as well. That makes it a bit softer I guess. For me N80 isn't as good for backhand as Big Dipper, but I think it's easier to use and more controllable than H3N 39°.

For me GTX Pro doesn't work for brush looping. It doesn't give me the direct feedback like H3N. It works better with ordinary looping game and gives you good control.

 

[Michael Zhuang]

Im a big fan of Loki rubbers. Just ordered a GTX to try out

Have played rxton 1, rxton 5, T3, arthur asia, arthur europe.

Rxton 1 is underrated good springy rubber. I like it on bh.

Rxton 5 is good cheap substitute for h3 but faster.

T3 is a fairly fast bh rubber. Like ak47 red.

Arthur asia and europe are very heavy, but have good control and performance. Fairly fast, but also a little tacky, but easy to control. Made in germany but quite different from esn.

 

[riversquirrel]

Any thoughts on a Rakza Z alternatives? I have been using it as FH and BH for a couple months and I love it, I don't think I'll ever go back to a non-hybrid rubber. Looking for something cheap to replace the rubbers on my backup blade with something similar.

Yinhe Big Dipper II seems to be the best option, but reviews are scarce. I am in some doubt to as if it is a true tensor sponge, or just a slightly springier Chinese sponge.

I also think Loki Arthur Europe may be an option, but reviews are once again scarce, and I can't even find it for sale anywhere anyways. Good to hear Loki's quality is decent tho.

 

[Michael Zhuang]

I have several sheets of Big Dipper (never tried II though). I think it is far more than a slightly springier Chinese sponge. Its completely different from H3, for example, and probably quite close in quality to Rakza Z. So I think if you are looking for a cheap alternative hybrid, indeed Big Dipper would be a fantastic choice. Bloom Power would be a great choice too.

If H3 is a 8 on speed, and if Fastarc G1 is a 9 on speed, then I think Big Dipper would be a 8.9 on speed. Maybe its just as fast as tensors depending on your stroke style. Whenever I loop with BD, people comment about how fast and spinny it is. It's not a true tensor sponge, because tensor is patented and owned by ESN. It doesn't have the same feeling as tensor, but it has similar playing characteristics (which is really what matters IMO). A guy who plays with Tenergy/Dignics hit with my BD and asked me if I boosted it because he felt the rubber "clicking". So I would say it's really quite close to tensor, despite being 1/3 the price.

I have Loki Arthur Europe too. Arthur is a little heavy, so that might bother some people. It is porous, yet hard (carbon) sponge. It doesn't have the catapult effect of Rakza, and its also slower than BD. I would say 8.5 for speed. If you really need springiness, then Big Dipper would be better choice. However, maybe people who grab my Arthur ask me what it is because they are impressed by it. A guy just yesterday asked to buy it from me. It has a great feeling of controlled-speed. Its mostly fast enough, but it feels very stable and easy to control.

 

[riversquirrel]

Awesome, that's pretty much exactly what I was looking to confirm. I feel like I need the springiness, as when I use something with a dead feeling/slow sponge like H3, I end up messing up my form trying to swing harder to compensate.

Bloom Power doesn't seem to be stocked well right now, so I think I'll order two sheets each of BD and BD II. I could nearly buy a set of Rakza Z for that, but I am an equipment junkie at heart and 4 is more than 2. I'll reply here again or just make a separate post when I get them in and try them out.

 

[Michael Zhuang]

Awesome, that's pretty much exactly what I was looking to confirm. I feel like I need the springiness, as when I use something with a dead feeling/slow sponge like H3, I end up messing up my form trying to swing harder to compensate.

Bloom Power doesn't seem to be stocked well right now, so I think I'll order two sheets each of BD and BD II. I could nearly buy a set of Rakza Z for that, but I am an equipment junkie at heart and 4 is more than 2. I'll reply here again or just make a separate post when I get them in and try them out.

Awesome, let me know how BD2 is. I have always stuck with BD because I like the look of the blue sponge. And its cheaper. Where are you buying it?

 

[riversquirrel]

Aliexpress. BD2 is definitely not sold as commonly as BD, but there are a couple legitimate stores that have it.

 

[Attitude]

Any thoughts on a Rakza Z alternatives? I have been using it as FH and BH for a couple months and I love it, I don't think I'll ever go back to a non-hybrid rubber. Looking for something cheap to replace the rubbers on my backup blade with something similar.

Yinhe Big Dipper II seems to be the best option, but reviews are scarce. I am in some doubt to as if it is a true tensor sponge, or just a slightly springier Chinese sponge.

I also think Loki Arthur Europe may be an option, but reviews are once again scarce, and I can't even find it for sale anywhere anyways. Good to hear Loki's quality is decent tho.

Will be hard to get smth cheaper as a serious alternative. Non of the mentioned rubbers come even close to thow angle and speed, especially noticable on bh.
If you want the Hurricane 8 to get close you need to boost it. There is simply no way around.

Btw kind of the same goes for Big Dipper. This is way harder than Rakza Z and has a lower throw by a decent amount. It is an okish alternative for fh i would say, but not really for bh (depending on how you play though).

As it goes for alternatives you can really use for fh and bh, i can recommend Hurricane 8-80. Boosting is not needed but still possible. And you can chose between 2 hardness degrees. On top the speed and throwangle are pretty similar. If i were picky i would say that the Hurricane 8-80 has a sliiiightly lower throw and is a tiny bit slower (unboosted). And i am damn sure about that, because i am testing and playing both of these rubbers on bh right now.
In terms of spin i the Hurricane 8-80 surpasses the Rakza Z (not by much though) which made it a bit more tricky getting used to, if you want to block consistently. For me i had not issues to adjust.
It is worth mentioning that H8-80 is noticable more tacky than the Rakza Z.

In terms of prices the Rakza Z is around 36 € in my country at best, while i can purchase the H8-80 for around 30 from Aliexpress, so at least it is a bit cheaper^^

 

[mocker88]

Any thoughts on a Rakza Z alternatives? I have been using it as FH and BH for a couple months and I love it, I don't think I'll ever go back to a non-hybrid rubber. Looking for something cheap to replace the rubbers on my backup blade with something similar.

Yinhe Big Dipper II seems to be the best option, but reviews are scarce. I am in some doubt to as if it is a true tensor sponge, or just a slightly springier Chinese sponge.

I also think Loki Arthur Europe may be an option, but reviews are once again scarce, and I can't even find it for sale anywhere anyways. Good to hear Loki's quality is decent tho.

Big Dipper is really nice in 38/39 deg. The 40 deg is too hard I guess. I just lost a lot of effect with that one. Tried BD4 as well. It was slower and had less spin capabilities. Haven't tested BD2 yet. LOKI Arthur Europe is totally different, harder and heavier. I didn't like that as much as BD in any way. I have started to boost BD with a couple of layers of Haifu Seamoon, but it works great without as well. Might be better for my less powered backhand though.

Now it's not that springy as ESN rubbers, but compared to H3N the sponge is softish and the top sheet is a bit softer. About H8-80, I have tried this (38 deg) mainly on backhand. It didn't suit my forehand at all. Too mushy and ... yep that's it. The top sheet is grippy/tacky, but if you want any speed and spin at all with your backhand, don't go there. It's really outstanding for controlled short game, pushes and blocks. Soooo good, but it wasn't what I was looking for.

BD is a rubber that would work as both forehand and backhand for many types of players.

 

[riversquirrel]

Awesome, let me know how BD2 is. I have always stuck with BD because I like the look of the blue sponge. And its cheaper. Where are you buying it?

I actually ended up messaging a seller and they told me the only difference in Big Dipper vs Big Dipper II is that Big Dipper 2 is not factory tuned/boosted. So I think I am probably not going to waste my money on that, since I would just boost it anyways.

 

[Michael Zhuang]

I actually ended up messaging a seller and they told me the only difference in Big Dipper vs Big Dipper II is that Big Dipper 2 is not factory tuned/boosted. So I think I am probably not going to waste my money on that, since I would just boost it anyways.

That's funny...why would BD2 cost more if its not factory boosted. What about 3 and 4?

 

[Attitude]

A little update: Today i got rid of the Loki GTX Pro. This is not a bad rubber in some terms but several things bothered me way too hard.

1. Yeah this is a pretty hard rubber, though it is advertised as a bouncy cake sponge - there is nothing bouncy to find here. This thing is hard as a rock and it is a pain in the ass to hit hard enough to bring anything to life in there.

2. 404 Spin. Creating a decent amount of spin while topspinning was nearly impossible. And if you hit a lighter shot the ball simply drops short without any mentionable rotation. And this was the dealbreaker for me. I can work with harder rubbers, especially on fh, but not with this one.

What i like about the rubber is the quality overall. It had a really good surface, pretty tacky and is able to grip the ball kind of, at least if you hit really hard and awesome^^
With a little bit of technique you even can perform speedy topspins, though pretty hollow ones.

So i am back with the Loki Arthur China on one my setups and i am testing the Hybrid K2 which is just a little bit more expansive. For now i have the feeling is has nearly the same capabilites in terms of speed but it is slightly easier to get a really good amount of spin into topspins.
Gonna take it for some more swings and observe its durability. If it can keep up, it might be a better Arthur China version, but we will see.

 

[Michael Zhuang]

That's sad to hear, I got a piece of GTX rubber for a friend, based on good overall reviews. I've heard that it is quite bouncy like a tensor.

Can you describe the Arthur China? Is it faster than GTX or other rubbers? Does it have the same black carbon sponge as Arthur Asia/Europe? Or does it have that dense sponge like H3 or Rxton 5?

 

[Attitude]

That's sad to hear, I got a piece of GTX rubber for a friend, based on good overall reviews. I've heard that it is quite bouncy like a tensor.

Can you describe the Arthur China? Is it faster than GTX or other rubbers? Does it have the same black carbon sponge as Arthur Asia/Europe? Or does it have that dense sponge like H3 or Rxton 5?

Well i didnt hoped for a full blown tensor, especially not with this hardness. But a little more spin and a little bouncyness would have been utmost welcome^^

Arthur China is pretty sticky and way faster than the GTX. If you hit a little harder it seriously sound awesome and is all of a sudden pretty damn fast. A little less bouncy than the Hurricane 8-80. I would put it in between the 8-80 and H8 in terms of speed.
Actually i have no clue of what sponge exactly they use.
The only information at all you can get from them is their official storepage on Aliexpress: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005003036393920.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.0.0.517f585fLNmiVk&algo_pvid=bdafe6aa-cb43-4c1c-b942-1f3f26383ec3&algo_exp_id=bdafe6aa-cb43-4c1c-b942-1f3f26383ec3-1&pdp_ext_f=%7B%22sku_id%22%3A%2212000023369173211%22%7D&pdp_pi=-1%3B26.03%3B-1%3B-1%40salePrice%3BEUR%3Bsearch-mainSearch

Not much but every little help i guess. Actually this was supposed to be my go to rubber for my spare racket. Now i am actually not sure. It is a little less spinny than Hurricane 3 but way faster (i am talking about H3 boosted) so it could get on my main setup. Or the Tibhar Hybrid K2 as mentioned before.

But as you can see with the pictures on the website it has a dense sponge but not as dense as H3. I was thinking of boosting it several times now, but the more i think about it, the i am sure i would regret it and maybe even destroy the sheet. Beside i dont really know why i should. Maybe for more spin, but usually the rubber gets faster too, and that would flatten the arc, which would make playing with it way harder and more unforgivable.
Right now i can do really dumb shit sometime and still get some quality out of the stroke and the ball over the net, which makes me happy quite often^^

 

[Michael Zhuang]

According to this chart from one of the sellers on Aliexpress, apparently Arthur China has the same Carbon Cake sponge.

 

[Michael Zhuang]

A little update: Today i got rid of the Loki GTX Pro. This is not a bad rubber in some terms but several things bothered me way too hard.

1. Yeah this is a pretty hard rubber, though it is advertised as a bouncy cake sponge - there is nothing bouncy to find here. This thing is hard as a rock and it is a pain in the ass to hit hard enough to bring anything to life in there.

2. 404 Spin. Creating a decent amount of spin while topspinning was nearly impossible. And if you hit a lighter shot the ball simply drops short without any mentionable rotation. And this was the dealbreaker for me. I can work with harder rubbers, especially on fh, but not with this one.

What i like about the rubber is the quality overall. It had a really good surface, pretty tacky and is able to grip the ball kind of, at least if you hit really hard and awesome^^
With a little bit of technique you even can perform speedy topspins, though pretty hollow ones.

So i am back with the Loki Arthur China on one my setups and i am testing the Hybrid K2 which is just a little bit more expansive. For now i have the feeling is has nearly the same capabilites in terms of speed but it is slightly easier to get a really good amount of spin into topspins.
Gonna take it for some more swings and observe its durability. If it can keep up, it might be a better Arthur China version, but we will see.

Curious, how long did you play with GTX for? Did the rubber get any more bouncy over time as the tackiness wore off?

 

[Attitude]

Curious, how long did you play with GTX for? Did the rubber get any more bouncy over time as the tackiness wore off?

Several training session and a tournament.
The simple answer is no. Even with the dust from balls on it, there was nearly no difference.
I mean i am capable of hitting hard, but the results remained sad compared to the other mentioned rubbers, which is why the GTX pro is no alternative for me.