Liu Guoliang & other penhold twiddlers

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What did Liu use ? What % did he twiddle ?
If I am not mistaken, he had pips mostly on forehand ?

I also would like to learn about other penhold twiddlers pro or amateur
 
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I have never seen LGL twiddle ever. Has anyone seen him doing that?

A famous twiddler is is 59 year old ni xialiang who still is ranked like top50 in the world at her age and won a medal in the doubles at the euros this year.
 
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Don’t think LGL twiddled, remember back in the days penholders usually just have rubber on one side .
Not sure if you even know who Liu Guoliang is
Before him of course those who did not have rubber on other side did not twiddle because he sort of pioneered the RPH (loop) .
I
Anyway also watch the two videos below
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rLMeGfzwgxc
Around 2.20 of above video
Read the comment embedded in the video...unless you want to claim that I added it

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OVgCqlv6KZA
At 47.42 of this video , Liu twiddled to his red side (inverted) from his backhand to his forehand
I think Waldner missed the serve,so Liu did not get to play the point

Maybe he was not a prolific twiddler but I am sure there are many other instances when he twiddled.

 
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Not sure if you even know who Liu Guoliang is
Before him of course those who did not have rubber on other side did not twiddle because he sort of pioneered the RPH (loop) .
I
Anyway also watch the two videos below
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rLMeGfzwgxc
Around 2.20 of above video
Read the comment embedded in the video...unless you want to claim that I added it

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OVgCqlv6KZA
At 47.42 of this video , Liu twiddled to his red side (inverted) from his backhand to his forehand
I think Waldner missed the serve,so Liu did not get to play the point

Maybe he was not a prolific twiddler but I am sure there are many other instances when he twiddled.


I think your time reference is off as the video is 47:42. Can you update it?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
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44:33 is a slow mo of him hitting a FH with his red side. I think he did that very infrequently though, maybe like once or twice per match or so, it wasn't one of his go to strategies, probably more to confuse his opponent a little.
 
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LGL has never twiddled in my observation. Anyone who seen him doing that? A well-known twiddler is 59-year-old Ni xialiang, who is still among the top 50 in the world at her age and this year's Euros doubles medalist.
 
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LGL has never twiddled in my observation. Anyone who seen him doing that? A well-known twiddler is 59-year-old Ni xialiang, who is still among the top 50 in the world at her age and this year's Euros doubles medalist.
If you had read the whole thread , you would have noticed post #5 correcting DukeGaGa's (usual or jump to wild conclusions without proper thought or research) error in post #3 just like your errror here 😂☺🤮
 
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Has anyone tried twiddling with penhold? I, tried it and found it very difficult compared to SH.

Now I can't do it anymore anyway since I modified my cpen with a small piece of jpen cork for my index finger but I guess if you use a pip on the FH twiddling would be an interesting skill to have for a penholder.
 
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Has anyone tried twiddling with penhold? I, tried it and found it very difficult compared to SH.

Now I can't do it anymore anyway since I modified my cpen with a small piece of jpen cork for my index finger but I guess if you use a pip on the FH twiddling would be an interesting skill to have for a penholder.

Twiddling is an art & a science & against pip hating opponents it is mostly psychological. In such cases it is a matter of making them think that you are twiddling like crazy even if you really are not. For example during warmups just twiddle like crazy but keep the ball on the table only from your spinny inverted side but always shoot the ball 20 feet over with your log pips or anti side. Then when match starts twiddle more in the beginning of a game even if you miss just to screw with your opponents' mind etc.
If you have trouble twiddling grab the racket your free hand & twiddle. There is a YT video of a 2300+ Braziian player doing this. It does look funny but then again it may be to your advantage if your opponet is a pips hater. (BTW in an unrealted matter, I find it hilarious when someone plays a two handed backhand like in tennis)
One can also practise single, double & triple twiddling (or even lot more like Cai Zhenhua's high toss serve with a black-black racket LOL) .
Another strategy is twiddle (or pretend like you are twiddling) with your racket below the table level when you are about to serve. I almost burst out laughing when someone does this to me but it would make pip haters very angry. I have had players actually complain to umpire that a aplyer had their racket below the table level (Rules only say ball contact must be above table level and where one's racket is before the ball contact is irrelevant)

I have known players who walk around even when not at a match constantly twiddling to master it. I assume they even twiddle at home in bed making their spouses not so happy.
I personally never never warmup with my oponents but only with my other friends. I have had opponents who hate (long) pips & go out of their way to avoid (long) pips & anti players at club sessions but expect me to train them to beat me during a 2 minute warmup. I have had scores of opponents begging me to use longpips side during warnups. I even had opponents who complained to umpire that I was breaking the 2 minute warmup rule by refusing to warmup (They do not understand it is NOT a mandatory MINIMUM of 2 minutes but is an optional MAXIMUM of 2 minutes)

I especially love it when a pip hater serves to my wide short forehand, expecting me to return using my inverted side. Sometimes i step around and still use my backhand long pips side & it makes them very angry & unstable for the whole match LOL. Other times i twiddle & I return serve etc using long pips side on forehand. Most opponent's assume I am using inverted & make a mistake & makes them even more angry.

One of my biggest pet peeves is paint sheets A penholder (or an American grip player) should never ever use a paint sheet. If you like a lite racket have an OX long pips on that side. If you prefer a heavy racket, use thick(est) sponge long pips. Learn to twiddle for pschological advantage. I have seen some short pips mostly TPG players use inverted on backhand side for serves & reverse PH looping and this is one of the best racket designs.

I get asked as to what the hell is an American grip. About the same as Seemiller grip but I call it American grip to be fair to Eric Boggan who reached same high level in world rankings as Seemiller. Howwver Seemiller is a forehand dominant grip & Eric Boggan is a backhand dominant grip. Seemiller is more of an athlete ( Few know that he was also drafted to play professional baseball but he correctly chose tabletennis). Eric Boggan is more of an artist and partial cause of the two color rule of 1983 (His brother Scott Boggan was also a US national champion and a short pips shakehands hitter) . And their father Tim started all the pips problems by sort of casting the tie breaker vote for the 1998 Durban Aspect Ratio Reduction Massacre
But my favorite American grip was by a father son duo called Shapiro s from Connecticut (David & Brian ??) . I always tried to copy the father's grip but never worked out for me. He had the American grip in such a four sided way that he can play either backhand or forehand using either rubber at will without twiddling.. I think they were both around 2200-2300 but don't know what happened to them.
If you look ar videos of Liu Guoliang he seemed to twiddle at startegic points such as at deuce such as looping using inverted on forehand.side instead of the short pips that he usually used on forehand (pips which are now banned by the pip distribution density reduction regulation of 2004)


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I plead to ITTF to ban all pips & anti to release & set free all of ITTF's political prisoners (choppers / defenders)

 
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To answer your question OP, Liu Guoliang used the Stiga Clipper Wood, TSP Spinpips, and Stiga Mendo Energy up until the ball change. At Atlanta in 1996 he used Mark V AD instead of Mendo Energy, but he used the aforementioned equipment from 1997~2000. Here's a picture of his grip and blade from a 1998 issue of World Table Tennis magazine: https://imgur.com/a/d4LZtFy

And it should be noted, Liu absolutely twiddled, and anyone saying otherwise hasn't watched him enough. However, he usually only twiddled on serve returns, so it isn't with a frequency like Ni Xia Lian would. Chai Po Wa (LP fh/inverted backhand) was similar to this as well, occasionally looping the forehand when necessary rather than blocking/smashing with the long pips.
 
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Jian Fay Lay is also a chinese pen twiddler from Australia.

Click the link below for her videos
Jian Fang Lay
Do you know what rubbers / blades she uses ?


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I plead to ITTF to ban all pips & anti to release & set free all of ITTF's political prisoners (choppers / defenders)
 
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