Pip structure for inverted rubbers.

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I'm sure this information exists somewhere, but I haven't been able to find it, so I thought to post here in the hopes that nerds like me might have the answer.

My question is this - given 3 (maybe 4) pip attributes for an inverted rubber top sheet:
  1. height (how tall the pip is i.e how high above the sponge does the top sheet sit)
  2. width/radius (the basic size of the pip, i.e wider pips = lesser pips on the topsheet),
  3. spacing (how far pips are from each other. i.e. bigger spacing = lesser pips on the topsheet)
  4. tacky (sticky) <-- maybe?

How do these attributes/combination of attributes effect the throw, spin, control and possibly speed of the ball (close, mid and far ranges). I understand there are other factors that greatly effect the ball, but I'm trying to wrap my head around the basic science. Please share what you know, I've been obsessing over this for a while now!
 
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I'm sure this information exists somewhere, but I haven't been able to find it, so I thought to post here in the hopes that nerds like me might have the answer.

My question is this - given 3 (maybe 4) pip attributes for an inverted rubber top sheet:
  1. height (how tall the pip is i.e how high above the sponge does the top sheet sit)
  2. width/radius (the basic size of the pip, i.e wider pips = lesser pips on the topsheet),
  3. spacing (how far pips are from each other. i.e. bigger spacing = lesser pips on the topsheet)
  4. tacky (sticky) <-- maybe?

How do these attributes/combination of attributes effect the throw, spin, control and possibly speed of the ball (close, mid and far ranges). I understand there are other factors that greatly effect the ball, but I'm trying to wrap my head around the basic science. Please share what you know, I've been obsessing over this for a while now!Hi
BTY explained some of 2.+3. in it's T19 promo: https://www.butterfly-global.com/en/product/tenergy/19.html Seems reasonable to me, but I'm not an expert.
I doubt that 4. has any sense for pimples-in rubber.
As for 1. my guess is that sponge thickness variation has greater effect than pips' height, and then there's also ITTF's limit on overall rubber thickness. So maybe the pips' height is chosen so that it lets the pips do their job and at the same time allows to combine them with the sponge of different thickness. Also too long pips would break faster, I guess.
 
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says Fair Play first
says Fair Play first
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SCIENTIA EST POTENTIA.
Tiefenbacher's profound investigations of 1994. (inverse rubbers subjected)

Summary of the Tiefenbacher's researches in most brief words
— slim and flexible pimples are good for spinny strokes
— stiff and stubby pimples are better to use for fast attacks.

Dr. Tiefenbacher explained actual physics of ball and rubber impact with a lot of practical experiments .
The article still available from Google Academics depot..

https://sasportssience.blob.core.wi...iles/IJTTS_2_1_14_Tiefenbacher_The Impact.pdf
 
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I think more precise mathematical calculations are needed here. When you need to resort to finding the exact answer to your questions, it is best to use the exact sciences like mathematics for this. You can calculate for yourself or look for the answer on https://plainmath.net/secondary/calculus-and-analysis/precalculus/trigonometry, as he has repeatedly helped me out in the most unpredictable situations. I used it in college to find an answer to any applications of integrals question and also used it when I couldn't accurately calculate tank density for my fish. It is convenient to understand mathematics, you can count everything in the world.
 
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Yeah igorponger! I have been posting that link for years and now someone else is paying attention!
The study is old but the physics hasn't changed.
However, it would be nice if that research was done again with modern cameras and modern TT equipment.

davidjulian said:
I think more precise mathematical calculations are needed here.
You are kidding right!?
Would you be able to understand them? The uneducated "kids" wouldn't. They are still looking for the magic rubber , blade or booster that will make them better.
Would the study be ignored like that Tieffenbacher study has been for so many years?
It would be a lot of work and all the effort would be wasted as soon as the thread is off the front page.

Longer thinner pips would allow the top sheet to stretch more when brushing. A thinner top sheet would also allow the top sheet to stretch more. It is the snap back that causes extra spin in addition to the tangential paddle speed.
The difference between T05 and T25 was that the T25 pips were thicker so they didn't allow the top sheet to stretch as much so there was less spin. This assume the top sheets are made of the same material.
As far as the speed difference goes, it depends on how springy the pips are vs the sponge. I have no data on that.
 
says Spin and more spin.
says Spin and more spin.
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I am 90% sure that is a bot. davidjulian, are you a bot or a human?//exactly 5 posts, with very generic text


It's a bot and it's quite funny broken can't spot it.

This has happened before. Actually, there are a lot of people who respond to bots. I am 98.5% sure it is a bot. :)

The only reason this one has not been removed yet is, I don't see any spam from it. If it goes inactive for a few days, I will also make it disappear because all of the posts are waste of space posts. But I have my eye on DavidJulian. :)

 

erm

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erm

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yes shape of the pips make a difference into the flexibility and spring affect too...
also the arranging of the pips in vertical or horizontal direction makes a difference as well in inverted not just in pips out...
 
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