Real man play real table-tennis with real forehand.

[Gozo Aruna]

Real man play real forehand

Happy new year 2025 Mister Quadri, sir!

 

[PenHoldSandro]

Real man play real forehand

Happy new year 2025 Mister Quadri, sir!

What an interesting forehand, like the 1930's all over again.

Probably not gonna do smith like that, but damn that does that work so well for him

 

[Gozo Aruna]

What an interesting forehand, like the 1930's all over again.

Probably not gonna do smith like that, but damn that does that work so well for him

30's! What are you talking about?

30's players are using hardbat and the play style is completely alien to Aruna's!

 

[Kopp]

That FH exclusive for him. It's no in the book. Aruna has build & strength to do that.

 

[zhzhzhz]

30's! What are you talking about?

30's players are using hardbat and the play style is completely alien to Aruna's!

Feels like someone (Sandro) has been getting some wrong information lately. I think you should teach him more about old table tennis and Aruna (the player, not lil old Gozo)

No offense to Sandro but I think it is good to learn about forehand-dominant players if you play penhold.
(I'm not saying that backhand is not important for penhold players but it will make it easier to get a really good forehand)

 

[riemsesy]

That FH exclusive for him. It's no in the book. Aruna has build & strength to do that.

I have the same build.. maybe even bigger than Aruno.. and yes I move my arm like him too..
and guess who's bringing the whip next time to training.. yes my coach.. since day one she's trying to unlearn me that big arm movement. And of course.. I suck at it

 

[PenHoldSandro]

Feels like someone (Sandro) has been getting some wrong information lately. I think you should teach him more about old table tennis and Aruna (the player, not lil old Gozo)

30's! What are you talking about?

30's players are using hardbat and the play style is completely alien to Aruna's!

no its the arm movement moving more upwards than normal players (ofc no offense to Aruna), like the 30s. Plus I think I stated it wrong but what I mean more is the vibes I get from both side by side.

- both arms go straight up

I mean that's it but it's a rarity to see that typa thing nowadays

No offense to Sandro but I think it is good to learn about forehand-dominant players if you play penhold.
(I'm not saying that backhand is not important for penhold players but it will make it easier to get a really good forehand)

No offense taken bro. I guess I could watch more than just RSM and Wang Hao

 

[zhzhzhz]

No offense taken bro. I guess I could watch more than just RSM and Wang Hao

When you look into ma lin and others (Xu Xin) you will see why rsm has weaknesses

 

[PenHoldSandro]

When you look into ma lin and others (Xu Xin) you will see why rsm has weaknesses

Just his backhand bro, maxed out almost everything else lmao

Yes Ive recently started to watch xu xin too bro, dont worry

 

[greenbeanmachine]

I think it is good to learn about forehand-dominant players if you play penhold.
(I'm not saying that backhand is not important for penhold players but it will make it easier to get a really good forehand)

When you look into ma lin and others (Xu Xin) you will see why rsm has weaknesses

Penhold certainly gives an advantage to the forehand, but we are now living in an era where the best penholder in the world is backhand-dominant and lacks a strong forehand. Xu Xin's style of playing big swinging FH power-loops from behind the table was good in the celluloid ball era, but he himself has said that the modern 40+ ball puts his style at a disadvantage.

RPB has a lot of advantages in the modern game -- it's compact and deceptive, and it's naturally a looping stroke that comes with sidespin. While having a strong forehand is always a good thing, Felix has shown that it's not a necessity in the modern game. One can make up for a weak forehand by having good aggressive RPB.

Just his backhand bro, maxed out almost everything else lmao

Yes Ive recently started to watch xu xin too bro, dont worry

Even when Ryu was in his prime, his lack of backhand was a noticeable weakness. He made up for a lot of it with good footwork, but even still it was not enough. Let's be real here -- Ryu was never better than Wang Hao. His win at the olympics was mostly due to Wang fumbling the mental game. Ryu was an incredible player, for sure, but his inability to do anything besides block/punch with the backhand prevented him from being one of the greatest players of all time.

A good contrast to Ryu would be someone like Ma Lin -- Ma played mostly one-sided as well, but he had much more creativity and finesse with his TPB. If Ryu had made an effort to play more like Ma, I think he could have been the best in the world. But alas, he only used his backhand as a placeholder so that he could get in position to do a forehand drive.

 

[zhzhzhz]

Penhold certainly gives an advantage to the forehand, but we are now living in an era where the best penholder in the world is backhand-dominant and lacks a strong forehand. Xu Xin's style of playing big swinging FH power-loops from behind the table was good in the celluloid ball era, but he himself has said that the modern 40+ ball puts his style at a disadvantage.

RPB has a lot of advantages in the modern game -- it's compact and deceptive, and it's naturally a looping stroke that comes with sidespin. While having a strong forehand is always a good thing, Felix has shown that it's not a necessity in the modern game. One can make up for a weak forehand by having good aggressive RPB.

In my opinion, it's better to develop a proper forehand before working on RPB. For penhold, the forehand comes somewhat naturally (in my experience), but RPB takes way longer than the forehand or TPB. RPB took me almost twice the time compared to the forehand and I still need to improve more on looping my RPB

 

[NextLevel]

Penhold certainly gives an advantage to the forehand, but we are now living in an era where the best penholder in the world is backhand-dominant and lacks a strong forehand. Xu Xin's style of playing big swinging FH power-loops from behind the table was good in the celluloid ball era, but he himself has said that the modern 40+ ball puts his style at a disadvantage.

RPB has a lot of advantages in the modern game -- it's compact and deceptive, and it's naturally a looping stroke that comes with sidespin. While having a strong forehand is always a good thing, Felix has shown that it's not a necessity in the modern game. One can make up for a weak forehand by having good aggressive RPB.



Even when Ryu was in his prime, his lack of backhand was a noticeable weakness. He made up for a lot of it with good footwork, but even still it was not enough. Let's be real here -- Ryu was never better than Wang Hao. His win at the olympics was mostly due to Wang fumbling the mental game. Ryu was an incredible player, for sure, but his inability to do anything besides block/punch with the backhand prevented him from being one of the greatest players of all time.

A good contrast to Ryu would be someone like Ma Lin -- Ma played mostly one-sided as well, but he had much more creativity and finesse with his TPB. If Ryu had made an effort to play more like Ma, I think he could have been the best in the world. But alas, he only used his backhand as a placeholder so that he could get in position to do a forehand drive.

Anyone who says Felix has a weak forehand has the luxury of high standards and should not be taken too seriously. And yes, Xu Xin is included. That Felix has a really strong backhand and sets up to win many points with it is not a comment on his forehand at all, taking forehands early and off the bounce with spin and consistency is something that many players at the top level (Hugo, anyone) would dream of doing like Felix, even if only as a variarion against players like Felix and Harimoto.

 

[greenbeanmachine]

In my opinion, it's better to develop a proper forehand before working on RPB. For penhold, the forehand comes somewhat naturally (in my experience), but RPB takes way longer than the forehand or TPB. RPB took me almost twice the time compared to the forehand and I still need to improve more on looping my RPB

Yeah that's totally fair. I actually think penholders should learn to play one-sided for a while before they learn RPB -- being able to punch, block, and chop-block with TPB is an important part of the penhold game and I'm sad to see it fade away at the professional level. In the professional game these days, having a strong (even dominant) RPB is non-negotiable. And even in the non-professional game, one can make up for a weak forehand by having a strong RPB.

Anyone who says Felix has a weak forehand has the luxury of high standards and should not be taken too seriously. And yes, Xu Xin is included

Sure, Felix is a professional and no one at that level has a "weak" anything. But I think it's very clear that forehand is not Felix's strength and it's not what got Felix to where he is today. Actually, one might say it's his weakest feature. It's what Fan Zhendong picked on to defeat him 4-0 in the olympics and it's what Dang Qiu picked on to come back from 0-2. Felix is good at taking the ball directly after the bounce, sure, but there are many other ways in which his forehand is not up to par with those of his peers.

 

[NextLevel]

Yeah that's totally fair. I actually think penholders should learn to play one-sided for a while before they learn RPB -- being able to punch, block, and chop-block with TPB is an important part of the penhold game and I'm sad to see it fade away at the professional level. In the professional game these days, having a strong (even dominant) RPB is non-negotiable.


Sure, Felix is a professional and no one at that level has a "weak" anything. But I think it's very clear that forehand is not Felix's strength and it's not what got Felix to where he is today. Actually, one might say it's his weakest feature. It's what Fan Zhendong picked on to defeat him 4-0 in the olympics and it's what Dang Qiu picked on to come back from 0-2. Felix is good at taking the ball directly after the bounce, sure, but there are many other ways in which his forehand is not up to par with those of his peers.

So amongst players who take the ball off the bounce and stay close to the table, who has a better forehand? Whose forehand would you take over Felix for his playing style?

What "weaknesses" does Felix have with his forehand that are not a function of age or holding the table?

 

[Tony's Table Tennis]

that Aruna FH is going to cause injuries for many.
Aruna is very uniquely built, very strong.

very terrible fh technique, but he has raw power.
his kids have more text book forehands

 

[Tony's Table Tennis]

Yeah that's totally fair. I actually think penholders should learn to play one-sided for a while before they learn RPB -- being able to punch, block, and chop-block with TPB is an important part of the penhold game and I'm sad to see it fade away at the professional level. In the professional game these days, having a strong (even dominant) RPB is non-negotiable. And even in the non-professional game, one can make up for a weak forehand by having a strong RPB.

Generally mens practice more of FH whole table then womens.
also mens has faster pace, so they dare to do it.
womens may practice it, but in matches, they more conservative and will guard bh corner mostly with bh.

today's bigger ball, it will be very silly to use FH like in the older days. need a mix of bh + fh imo.

 

[greenbeanmachine]

So amongst players who take the ball off the bounce and stay close to the table, who has a better forehand?

Fan Zhendong has a better forehand and he also takes it very quickly after the bounce. I would also say Wang Hao did a better job than Felix with his forehand, but it's hard to compare because Wang Hao played in a different era with a different ball.

Whose forehand would you take over Felix for his playing style?

For Felix's playing style? I can't think of anyone. He's extremely unique. Right now, Felix positions himself in the middle of the table with parallel feet in order to emphasize his backhand, because his backhand is extremely strong. If he wanted to make his forehand less vulnerable, it would likely involve a change in his body position which would take away the emphasis on his backhand. A difficult trade-off.

What "weaknesses" does Felix have with his forehand that are not a function of age or holding the table?

He has some hesitation in his ability to handle sidespin with the forehand. Surely this will get better with age and experience, but right now it is a weakness that Fan was very aware of when playing Felix.

I will say that based on my understanding of geometry and table tennis, a penhold player who exclusively uses RPB (and thus has a crossover point) and plays close to the table and positions himself in the middle of the table (like Felix) must necessarily have a weakness when handling sidespin on the forehand. Shakehand players can bring the racket closer to the body on forehand, but RPB-only penholders can't bring their forehand so close.

Ma Lin was able to avoid this weakness because (1) he positioned himself very far on the backhand side of the table, and (2) he mostly used TPB and thus did not have to worry about the crossover point that Felix has to worry about. But avoiding this weakness on the forehand meant that Ma had to accept weakness on the backhand.