Yinhe Big Dipper 38 deg (1st version) spin capabilities?

[h3llary]

Can anyone who has played with big dipper 1st version 38 or 39 degrees compare it to older rubbers like Vega Pro, Rakza 7, Fastarc G1 in terms of spin producing? I tried to look info online but couldn't find anything. I had Rakza 7 and it was okay but it didn't seem particularly spinny rubber to me but a lot of people compare BD to H3Neo, saying it produces almost the same spin so I was curious if it is comparable to older gen rubbers or ESN tensors like T05.

 

[TensorBackhand]

Can anyone who has played with big dipper 1st version 38 or 39 degrees compare it to older rubbers like Vega Pro, Rakza 7, Fastarc G1 in terms of spin producing? I tried to look info online but couldn't find anything. I had Rakza 7 and it was okay but it didn't seem particularly spinny rubber to me but a lot of people compare BD to H3Neo, saying it produces almost the same spin so I was curious if it is comparable to older gen rubbers or ESN tensors like T05.

Its spinnier than those mentioned because its tackier and harder

 

[Tony's Table Tennis]

This is where comparison is close to useless on forums, especially listing comparisons in general and without taking into account literally every single factor that makes a big different.

From my perspective, Vega Pro, G1 and Rakza 7 is way more spinner than Big Dipper 1.

The only part I will rate BD as a spin threat is on serving and service return, and that is all.
It is not spinny enough to be a Chinese spinning rubber.

For ones who knows how to use medium hard ESN rubbers, my money is on those players to outspin a BD user any day.

If BD can up its top sheet spin capability, it could be a rubber that could make some noise. Other than that, it is okay for its price and that is about it.
BD is a nice and cheap rubber to try out. It is not a god-like equipment that this forums sees it to be. I started this hype many years ago, but since then, maybe more hybrids has arrived. IE, Vega China is way better than BD if you wanted to compare in the Xiom Vega series (age) of rubbers

 

[Mionixxd]

Big dipper is a difficult rubber to play with compared to rakza 7, vut when you hit a clean shot with big dipper you get so much spin, that of course depends on your technique but I get more spin with big dipper than rakza 7.

 

[Attitude]

First of all you are comparing a budget rubber to mostly intermediate to higher level rubbers.

Second the possibility of getting a trashcan instead of a rubber is not that low with bd. Batches differ up to a huge margin.

So to compare it anyway because i played all of them.
In every scenario the following rubbers have way more spin capabilities than bd:
- T05, H3neo, fastarc g1

- Rakza 7 and vega pro might have some issues to perform on the same level in serves and in touchplay compared to bd which is damn easy to use in these scenarios.

That doesnt mean R7 and vp cant perform on the same or higher level as bd, it is just harder to get high quality shots in mentioned scenarios.
In normal drives, loops, flips, topspins and so on they outperform bd in every aspect

 

[h3llary]

Thank you all for answering, I think I've made my decision to stick with tensors/old gen rubbers for now. If it was obvious that BD would beat Rakza 7 type of rubbers by a big margin then I would switch to it, if not, I guess it doesn't make sense to downgrade, especially if it's harder to play with/produce spin from low quality shots.

 

[TensorBackhand]

Thank you all for answering, I think I've made my decision to stick with tensors/old gen rubbers for now. If it was obvious that BD would beat Rakza 7 type of rubbers by a big margin then I would switch to it, if not, I guess it doesn't make sense to downgrade, especially if it's harder to play with/produce spin from low quality shots.

Yes Rakza 7 is easier to play with and for most players they would play better with it.

BD is less forgiving, but has more offensive potential when properly unleashed, especially boosted. It produces a loud satisfying sound, and feels awesome to use when done right.

 

[Tony's Table Tennis]

Thank you all for answering, I think I've made my decision to stick with tensors/old gen rubbers for now. If it was obvious that BD would beat Rakza 7 type of rubbers by a big margin then I would switch to it, if not, I guess it doesn't make sense to downgrade, especially if it's harder to play with/produce spin from low quality shots.

you can consider Vega Pro and G1
These have way more offensive potential than Big Dipper.

There is a big reason why BD has very little market share in Asia, while G1 is huge in 2 of the 4 Top Asian countries (talking top 5 or top 10 seller over the whole market) while Vega Pro is just behind this (in maybe top 10~top 15), Vega Pro in recent years have also been Xiom's top selling rubber.
Big Dipper is.... bottom 5

G1 is actually very underrated, I think outside Asia, there have very little presence. But the rubber is actually really good and balanced.
Most unsponsored players (I would say 70%) of the premier division high school players (females) in Taiwan uses G1 on FH (I spend time in 3 of the top 8 schools, 2 of which are no 1 and no 2).
Nittaku is cheap and quality is great (1 Tenergy = 2.5 x G1). They change every 2 months or so and girls don't have the power that require harder sponges.
Based on USATT rating, these girls are between 1800 to 2500.

 

[hclnnkhg]

you can consider Vega Pro and G1
These have way more offensive potential than Big Dipper.

There is a big reason why BD has very little market share in Asia, while G1 is huge in 2 of the 4 Top Asian countries (talking top 5 or top 10 seller over the whole market) while Vega Pro is just behind this (in maybe top 10~top 15), Vega Pro in recent years have also been Xiom's top selling rubber.
Big Dipper is.... bottom 5

G1 is actually very underrated, I think outside Asia, there have very little presence. But the rubber is actually really good and balanced.
Most unsponsored players (I would say 70%) of the premier division high school players (females) in Taiwan uses G1 on FH (I spend time in 3 of the top 8 schools, 2 of which are no 1 and no 2).
Nittaku is cheap and quality is great (1 Tenergy = 2.5 x G1). They change every 2 months or so and girls don't have the power that require harder sponges.
Based on USATT rating, these girls are between 1800 to 2500.

The fact that Yinhe has >4 variants of BD doesn't help either... same story with their Apollo rubbers. Very confusing

 

[JJ Ng]

The fact that Yinhe has >4 variants of BD doesn't help either... same story with their Apollo rubbers. Very confusing

Ok, I just put a black 40 degree Big Dipper onto Tibhar Stratust Power Wood. It is ok. Is it faster then 729? Yes. Is it faster than ESN rubber? If you hit it hard enough. It is a very linear rubber. I don't feel much catapult effect.

It's surface really is not tacky at all (just like say Mark V). Maybe I got a bad sheet? I don't know.

I can spin it a heck lot more with H3 neo. For $15 a sheet on Aliexpress, you can consider it. But with bulk discount, I can get H3 neo for $19 a sheet from TT11. I will stick with H3 neo.

That will be the first and only Big Dipper I buy.

Side topic, I would not even consider Big Dipper hybrid. I think K1 and K2 are tackier than Big Dipper.

Finally, if you want to try chinese rubber but are not yet ready for hurricane, then buy Sanwei Target National. STN is sticky but not as sticky as hurricane. I also don't need to boost STN.

 

[H3R0]

Ok, I just put a black 40 degree Big Dipper onto Tibhar Stratust Power Wood. It is ok. Is it faster then 729? Yes. Is it faster than ESN rubber? If you hit it hard enough. It is a very linear rubber. I don't feel much catapult effect.

It's surface really is not tacky at all (just like say Mark V). Maybe I got a bad sheet? I don't know.

I can spin it a heck lot more with H3 neo. For $15 a sheet on Aliexpress, you can consider it. But with bulk discount, I can get H3 neo for $19 a sheet from TT11. I will stick with H3 neo.

That will be the first and only Big Dipper I buy.

Side topic, I would not even consider Big Dipper hybrid. I think K1 and K2 are tackier than Big Dipper.

Finally, if you want to try chinese rubber but are not yet ready for hurricane, then buy Sanwei Target National. STN is sticky but not as sticky as hurricane. I also don't need to boost STN.

Hi JJ Ng
Have similar problem with Yinhe BD. Not tacky at all, but very grippy. I would say that I can impart as much spin as with H3, but I can't really feel the ball. No matter how hard I loop, it gives me very muted feedback to my hand and I can't understand quality of spin with only vibration. If I smash a bit higher balls its fine. But to tell the truth, any rubber will be fine as long as its high ball.
Apparently they have QC issues or Aliexpress shops just sells bad ones. Other guys on the forum also had similar issues with some being tacky and other nontacky.

 

[TensorBackhand]

I have 38d BD on my backhand. Its very fast and spinny and I think its a very good rubber for strong players with good technique.

Another 2000 level friend also just switched to BD on bh from ESN.

 

[JJ Ng]

Hi JJ Ng
Have similar problem with Yinhe BD. Not tacky at all, but very grippy. I would say that I can impart as much spin as with H3, but I can't really feel the ball. No matter how hard I loop, it gives me very muted feedback to my hand and I can't understand quality of spin with only vibration. If I smash a bit higher balls its fine. But to tell the truth, any rubber will be fine as long as its high ball.
Apparently they have QC issues or Aliexpress shops just sells bad ones. Other guys on the forum also had similar issues with some being tacky and other nontacky.

Got it. Agree. Your description of not tacky but grippy sounds right. But if that's the case it is just like any ESN rubbers, not tacky but grippy.

I see to impart spins just fine but no stronger than say Rakza 7 soft or Rakza X.

The sheet is fast. No doubt about it. I have a 729 to compared it to.

And yes, H3 neo when boosted give me the feedback and the spin I want. Not Big Dipper.

Maybe Aliexpress shops just sells bad ones. I got mine from BEO store.

 

[JJ Ng]

I have 38d BD on my backhand. Its very fast and spinny and I think its a very good rubber for strong players with good technique.

Another 2000 level friend also just switched to BD on bh from ESN.

Maybe I got a bad batch/sheet. Where did you get your Big Dipper and where did your friend get his/her Big Dipper? Thanks in advance!

 

[TensorBackhand]

Maybe I got a bad batch/sheet. Where did you get your Big Dipper and where did your friend get his/her Big Dipper? Thanks in advance!

We both bought from Aliexpress, but I dont know which shop. I don't think the shop makes a difference.

BD 40 is pretty hard, so you might want to boost it for more catapult effect.

But how familiar are you with ESN hybrids? Most of those are not very catapulty either. D09c, Dragon Grip, etc are pretty linear without catapult.

 

[JJ Ng]

We both bought from Aliexpress, but I dont know which shop. I don't think the shop makes a difference.

BD 40 is pretty hard, so you might want to boost it for more catapult effect.

But how familiar are you with ESN hybrids? Most of those are not very catapulty either. D09c, Dragon Grip, etc are pretty linear without catapult.

Which shop on Aliexpress do you two use?

I am familiar with K1 and K2. Both have some catapult effects but not like the Revolution series or Tenergy series. The catapult effects from K1 and K2 are more along the line of Fastarc series.

 

[_ak]

with harder rubbers it depends on your technic. Can you hit the ball while still accelerating the bat? In this case you'll get plenty of spin