What instead of Primorac JP -OFF - OSP/Nittaku?

[disaster3]

Hi Guys,

This is my first post here! 😊

I’m looking for a new blade for me. I’m 40+. A little bit history about me.

As a kid I played in club. My father was and still is (65+) table tennis trainer so I’m not a school player and background and techniques are well known to me. All elements like, backspins in BH/FH, drive BH/FH, topspins BH/FH, etc. I can do with quite good frequency but played regularly up to 12 years old. I was playing both BTF Srivers sheets, blade I can’t recall.

Then I stopped and came back after 20+years in 2016 when everything has changed. Tensor sheets, 40+ balls etc.… I was shocked. Bought BTF Primorac JP -OFF and Rakza 7 soft/BH, T05 FX on FH. Was playing almost a year, trying also EVO FX-P on both sides, Then changed my activity to gym/running etc. This year did again come back and old 6+ years old FX-P sheets changed to T64/BH and T05/FH (both max) still on BTF Primorac JP. This is like riding a bike, after few trainings everything came back. 😊 The one thing I have to work on is a condition and footwork, as during covid and personal problems (surgery etc.) did not do any exercises until now, so when you are 40+ condition dropped down rapidly.

This time I play 3x a week, twice with amateurs with different level of skills in the club, and one time private (1hr) lesson with table tennis coach where I am out of breathe after it.

Get to the point from the beginning. I’m looking for a new blade which might be a little bit faster to my current blade. I think then I will stick to BTF Tenergy sheets as I like them. I know they are expensive, but the condition they are useful are longer too than other sheets.
At first I was thinking to go in ALC/ZLC etc, but after reading some posts and taking into account that will get older not younger and I’m not pro, woody blade would be enough for my amateur skills. I was thinking about Korbel JP or Nittaku Acoustic and found many information about OSP blades Virtuoso -/+. I like to have awareness that if I pay more it was worth it. I know that going into Nittaku or OSP Virtuoso will be a good direction.

What do you suggest in terms of OSP blades, should I go in “-“ or “+” to have a little bit faster blade and what size S, M, L. I have a small hands and always played FL hand so will go in FL, too but don’t know what head size and which one Virtuoso – or Virtuoso + should I choose. I’m rather close and mid distance offensive player, trying to take initiatives and start attacking.

Thanks in advance! 😊

 

[TheProfessor]

I have no experience with OSP blades, but in terms of the Nittaku Acoustic and with what I found out in another post here. The Acoustic has different handle shapes regular(being the smallest), LG(large handle) and SG (size in between supposedly.)
A good blade to try as well would be a 7ply allwood blade like a Stiga Clipper or Tibhar Force Pro Black Edition. You can't go wrong with those.

 

[mightymouse]

You can choose Butterfly Petr Korbel. It is a bit stiffer, a bit harder and a bit faster compared to your Primorac Off-. It is natural progression (usually) from a Primorac. Choose Petr Korbel made in Japan. It is better than the European version (made in Hungary??).

However, if you really want to spend money, it is OK to buy Acoustic or OSP Virtuoso (or Virtuoso +).

From my point of view, Acoustic gives good feeling. Whether it justifies the much higher price, it depends on each individual. For me, I am good with my Korbel even though I own Acoustic (normal handle, which is very small) and Acoustic with LG handle (large handle). There is also Acoustic with SG handle (in between regular and large handle), but I have not tried it.

For Virtuoso, you also have different head sizes: L (159 x 150 mm), M (158 x 150 mm) and S (157x 150mm). I can't really remember the 150mm (it could be 151 or 152).

See? Too many options.

For simple guy like me, an ordinary Korbel serves the purpose well and can be used forever. Unless the EJ bug bites you.

 

[turbozed]

Here are some comparisons between 5-ply blades. They include the Korbel and the Acoustic. It's hard to find objective measures for blades, and it's worth questioning if whether these comparisons are applicable since the characteristics of individual blades might vary greatly between blades of the same model. But it's extra information for you so I hope you get something out of it.

Classic 5-ply wood blades [Comparison by Lab Test]

[Update on 13th October 2023] The values of Nittaku ‘Violin’, ‘Acoustic’ and ‘Tenor’ have been adjusted a bit. 1. Introduction In table tennis, the power of bal…

ttgearlab.com

 

[disaster3]

Thanks! Seems that whatever I'll choose will not be much different each other. I'm just wondering how advanced we should be to notice the difference in feeling/control/speed if the blades are very similar to each other. Maybe the difference results in one worse day or something else unless we play the same setup (I mean sheets) but different blade at least month or more.
Primorac, Korbel (JP version) are 150x159 so in OSP notation they are "L", almost all fiber glass 5+2 blades are 150x157 ("S").
I found that above 2 BTF blades has the same 5 wood plies:
Limba-Limba-Ayous-Limba-Limba
correct me If I'm wrong.
What about the Violin, Acoustic and Virtuoso -/+ blades. Are they the same or different? If different can anyone provide information?
Thanks

 

[turbozed]

Acoustic is limba / limba / tung / limba / limba
Violin is ash / ash / kiri / ash / ash
Virtuoso (I think) is limba / limba / ayous / limba / limba

 

[mightymouse]

Primorac, Korbel (JP version) are 150x159 so in OSP notation they are "L", almost all fiber glass 5+2 blades are 150x157 ("S").

Butterfly Korbel Japan head size is 158 x 152 mm. So I think it is "M" in term of Virtuoso classification.

 

[disaster3]

hmm, there are different information provided by local distributors. On Poland btf website there is following info (sorry in PL language but measurements are international )

On official international web, you are right there is 158x152x5.9

edit: Nevermind, I decided to order 2x Virtuoso -/+ FL "S" size both, Acoustic and Korbel JP.
Seems that in the near future they might be white ravens, full wood blades. Everything tends to reduce the content of pure wood in the blades in favor of artificial substitutes. One time full wood blades may cost more the ALC/ZLC, etc. So I do not loose for sure.
And what is most important, I can check which one would fit the best for me w/o any rush or based on internet opinions.

 

[disaster3]

Hi Guys,

Blades, I've already chosen for testing and owning (BTF Primorac JP, Virtuoso -&+, Nittaku Acoustic) but as I mentioned I would like to slow down a bit to improve repeatability and slow down returning ball when I attack (due to my condition on which I'm working on). I haven't got any knowledge about other rubbers than BTF ones thus I compare everything to them.
I've on Primo T64 on BH (max) and T05 on FH (max) and I like them and would like to get back to them once above will be improved.
So I found that for correcting and improving skills , i.e. BTF Rozena was introduced and I'm leaning towards buying them max on BH/FH for practice, at least 6 months or more until I found out, ok I'm ready and will get back to my faster setup.
Please correct me If I'm wrong in terms of Rozena for practice or I would really appreciate if you provide rubberts from others manufacturers similar to Rozena which will help me in above mentioned things, i.e. from Xiom or something else. Following manufacturers that are available in the store where I shop:

Of course price also matters. Xiom Vega Europe or Asia could buy 2 for 1 Rozena but if you let me know, no Rozena will be better for above, ok, I'll buy, but if I can save a little would be nice, too.
Thanks in advance!

Ps. You can see how I was (and i think still)/am playing, now here: https://www.tabletennisdaily.com/forum/topics/video-footage-safe-thread.26467/post-398441 (#836)

 

[disaster3]

ok, will discuss to myself if none wants to
Ordered Rozenas but received info from the shop that they are out of stock in max size and they will receive it on Friday.
Nittaku Acoustic the same story as above so need to wait.
In terms of Virtuoso's, everything is on the track, seems no delay so far.

 

[jk1980]

I don't know where your tendency to go for Max sponge thickness comes from, but I advise you to think twice. More sponge is not needed if you can't make the most of it and it will only result in less accurate play of your strokes are not refined enough.

 

[disaster3]

I asked store to change to 1.9 for BH. on FH will stick on max.
Yesterday was playing with my coach and he was surprised how deadly my BH topspin is, taking into account my long brake from playing. He told me that if I perfectly hit the ball, speed and spin is incredible and is hard to block.
Repeatability is a problem so need to work on this. On FH I have no problem with "Repeatability" but physical condition, technically is good but in long rallies, I am out of breathe and I'm delayed to be in position to attack again.

 

[WingTT]

If you get a chance, try out an inner carbon ALC type blade, especially the DHS Hurricane Long 5 which has the control and feel of a 5 ply wood at low speed and accelerate to carbon power when you hit it hard. It is like the best of both worlds. Might just be what you are looking for. If you find a good HL5, it's like magic.

 

[disaster3]

If you get a chance, try out an inner carbon ALC type blade, especially the DHS Hurricane Long 5 which has the control and feel of a 5 ply wood at low speed and accelerate to carbon power when you hit it hard. It is like the best of both worlds. Might just be what you are looking for. If you find a good HL5, it's like magic.

After your post I started googling and searching about DHS Long 5/W968 and found out that now it's like the holly grail of TT the problem is that it is hard to buy in fair price and taking into account their availability it might be the problem. Probably there isn't a problem in US or in China but in Europe... yeah.
Is there any thread, info where is collected information about different kinds of this blade, as for such novice as I'm. I saw that some was referring to provincial, national, commercial, etc... my head will explode I got lost
Maybe it is not a time for me for this blade, but in 6 months I will be ready
Trained 3x a week will get me back to my level and after 3 months I'm going to take part in local tournaments for amateur to gather experience in matches

 

[WingTT]

After your post I started googling and searching about DHS Long 5/W968 and found out that now it's like the holly grail of TT the problem is that it is hard to buy in fair price and taking into account their availability it might be the problem. Probably there isn't a problem in US or in China but in Europe... yeah.

It's finally back in stock on tt11 which would be my first choice. You can get it cheaper at princett but you will have to wait quite a bit with a lack of communication and shipping may be expensive. There is a reason why people are willing to pay the prices for the HL5 when the Fang Bo Carbon is available - less gambling. You could take your chances and get a good Fang Bo Carbon.

 

[disaster3]

It's finally back in stock on tt11 which would be my first choice. You can get it cheaper at princett but you will have to wait quite a bit with a lack of communication and shipping may be expensive. There is a reason why people are willing to pay the prices for the HL5 when the Fang Bo Carbon is available - less gambling. You could take your chances and get a good Fang Bo Carbon.

Ordered DHS L5 FL from tt11.
No more blades
Thanks!

 

[Saimuro]

Hi Guys,

Blades, I've already chosen for testing and owning (BTF Primorac JP, Virtuoso -&+, Nittaku Acoustic) but as I mentioned I would like to slow down a bit to improve repeatability and slow down returning ball when I attack (due to my condition on which I'm working on). I haven't got any knowledge about other rubbers than BTF ones thus I compare everything to them.
I've on Primo T64 on BH (max) and T05 on FH (max) and I like them and would like to get back to them once above will be improved.
So I found that for correcting and improving skills , i.e. BTF Rozena was introduced and I'm leaning towards buying them max on BH/FH for practice, at least 6 months or more until I found out, ok I'm ready and will get back to my faster setup.
Please correct me If I'm wrong in terms of Rozena for practice or I would really appreciate if you provide rubberts from others manufacturers similar to Rozena which will help me in above mentioned things, i.e. from Xiom or something else. Following manufacturers that are available in the store where I shop:
View attachment 24552

Of course price also matters. Xiom Vega Europe or Asia could buy 2 for 1 Rozena but if you let me know, no Rozena will be better for above, ok, I'll buy, but if I can save a little would be nice, too.
Thanks in advance!

Ps. You can see how I was (and i think still)/am playing, now here: https://www.tabletennisdaily.com/forum/topics/video-footage-safe-thread.26467/post-398441 (#836)

How the world is small - you and i my friend have a similar thought process regarding equipment. I played with Acoustic Carbon Outer for the past 2 years but recently i admitted to myself that i need all wood blade for more control and feel. And in the last 15 days or so i am struggling oh so much with deciding should i buy Korbel Japan or Acoustic? Should i go with Rozena 2.1/1.9 or Fastarc G1 2.0/Fastarc C1 1.8. Through hours of reading posts it seems that (at least for the blade) either choice is not wrong. But i would like to hear someone's opinion who played with those two blades as well - so if you managed to try them both i would be most thankful if you give your thoughts on the differences between these two bladels.

Best regards!

 

[JJ Ng]

How the world is small - you and i my friend have a similar thought process regarding equipment. I played with Acoustic Carbon Outer for the past 2 years but recently i admitted to myself that i need all wood blade for more control and feel. And in the last 15 days or so i am struggling oh so much with deciding should i buy Korbel Japan or Acoustic? Should i go with Rozena 2.1/1.9 or Fastarc G1 2.0/Fastarc C1 1.8. Through hours of reading posts it seems that (at least for the blade) either choice is not wrong. But i would like to hear someone's opinion who played with those two blades as well - so if you managed to try them both i would be most thankful if you give your thoughts on the differences between these two bladels.

Best regards!

I have not played with either Korbel Japan or Acoustic.

However, I do have an Acoustic Carbon Outer that has been collecting dust for a while. I bought it and realized it was too fast for me immediately.

For all wood, I was (am still) a big fan of the 5-ply Tibhar Stratus Power Wood. Very good vibration. However, recently I have found it a bit slow and have moved on to Donic Persson Powerplay (7-ply wood at a very very affordable price) and Tibhar Fortino Performance (inner carbon blade that is affordable as well).

I like Persson Powerplay because it is a bit stiffer than Tibhar Stratus Power Wood so a bit faster but yet I do not find any loss of control. Weird.

Similarly, Tibhar Fortino Performance gives that carbon feel with faster speed, but also without any loss of control. It does give a woody feel.

Also I have not heard of people liking Rozena, on this forum, including for beginner's. Would you consider Glayzer instead?

Another person brought up DHS Fang Bo carbon in this thread. I have one. It is a bit stiff and I don't get a good feel while playing it so it is also collecting dust. Maybe I got a bad batch?

 

[disaster3]

No, I haven’t played Korbel, I played Acoustic 5ply wood and from all wood blades this one fits me best. Maybe because of ST handle which after couple of months like the most. I have to light Acoustic only 78gr wish to have around 88gr would be probably a little bit faster.
I also have OSP virtuoso + which is provided as a Korbel equivalent with FL handle. They all are very similar and I don’t have any issue to play both. I do not require many of hrs to use to each of them.
But now I transitioned to FZD ALC which like to most.
In terms of rubbers, g-1 is fantastic I play it on fzd on bh max thickness. Instead of Rozena at this moment I would probably give a try to both Glazer if is has to BTY and not much expensive