Looking for a custom setup advice

[sportslover]

I am a beginner player playing with a Palio Master 3.0 premade racket. It has an all-wood 5-ply blade with cj8000 rubbers on both sides.

I can play counter on forehand and backhand decently well and am learning to topspin on both sides. I am pretty fit and like to move quickly and push myself physically.

I am looking to move to a custom setup that will help me improve my technique and that I can use for a long time. I understand that developing a good game isn't just a decent setup but quality practice with a good coach and playing matches.

I am considering going for a Donic Appelgreen Allplay blade with DHS Hurricane 3 on the forehand and Yasaka Mark V on the backhand. Is this a good setup for someone like me?

I have shortlisted the following blades:
1. Donic Appelgreen Allplay
2. Yasaka Sweden Extra
3. Stiga Allround Classic

Would you recommend the Yasaka or the Stiga blade instead?

 

[jk1980]

No,
the proposed setup sounds like a recommendation of an old guy that tells you tales from yesteryear.

The blades are fine, but there is no point for a beginner to use a hurricane rubber which will make learning topspin harder and force you to learn a technique that is different than the one needed for regular tensors.

The yasaka mark v is also something from the past. Very few successful people play it.

I recommend to start with low catapult tensors so you get a feel for it and develop a fine hand that is needed for the short touch game.
One example of such rubber would be the xiom vega intro.

 

[hclnnkhg]

No,
the proposed setup sounds like a recommendation of an old guy that tells you tales from yesteryear.

The blades are fine, but there is no point for a beginner to use a hurricane rubber which will make learning topspin harder and force you to learn a technique that is different than the one needed for regular tensors.

The yasaka mark v is also something from the past. Very few successful people play it.

I recommend to start with low catapult tensors so you get a feel for it and develop a fine hand that is needed for the short touch game.
One example of such rubber would be the xiom vega intro.

+1. I am not a big fan of old classic rubbers, especially if they have the old price. Not saying they are bad, but pretty sure they are not cost effective.

 

[Lazer]

Don't listen to somebody who is dissin' Mark V. Its old but it has one of the best top sheets on the market. It lasts longer than most others. It is slow which is good stepping stone for a beginner. The sponge does not have air pockets so there is very little catapult.

Mark V is an excellent beginners rubber...

Cheers
L-zr

 

[Tony's Table Tennis]

There isn't anything wrong with Mark V indeed
It is still one of the tops selling rubbers in Japan and Japan has a huge table tennis population.

I would argue against using Huricane 3 though. Maybe you should just use Mark V on both sides.

In terms of blade, see what your seller has. Either one is fine

 

[mocker88]

As OP likes a challenge and likes to move quickly and push himself physically, why not go with something quite like the H3 that actually demands some work to be used properly? I don't think that a H3 39deg on 5-ply allround wooden blade would be too hard to use, and it would be great for developing your technique. A bit easier could be using Yinhe Big Dipper 38deg, as it has a softer touch but similar properties.

I mean as you are used to a not too bouncy setup, one of these would certainly work great for you

For BH there are some good non-tacky rubbers like Palio AK47 Blue/Yellow and 729 Focus III 44deg and they are very easy to control and gives you sufficent spin and speed, while learning

 

[kingkimchi]

No,
the proposed setup sounds like a recommendation of an old guy that tells you tales from yesteryear.

The blades are fine, but there is no point for a beginner to use a hurricane rubber which will make learning topspin harder and force you to learn a technique that is different than the one needed for regular tensors.

The yasaka mark v is also something from the past. Very few successful people play it.

I recommend to start with low catapult tensors so you get a feel for it and develop a fine hand that is needed for the short touch game.
One example of such rubber would be the xiom vega intro.

harder but more effective, look, let him choose according to his playstyle. Hurricane teaches you to use your body to put power into your shot, maybe he's a strong guy and he wants to do that. He might be more comfortable with tensor on the backhand since it requires a shorter stroke, so he might not be able to generate much power in a short amount of time when in a rally.

 

[sportslover]

Thank you so much, everyone, for the advice.

There're so many opinions and options; I should pick one and spend more time playing!

I plan to go for Yasaka Sweden Extra with Yasaka Mark V on both sides.

What thickness should I use with Yasaka Mark V, 2.0 or max?

 

[Lazer]

It doesn’t matter too much. I usually select this in regard to weight. I want a total weight 180 - 185 grams and a head balance not too head heavy. Mark V has a pretty dense sponge so it is a little bit heavy. Compared with I. e Mark V HPS that’s has the same top sheet but a little more bouncy sponge that is lighter.
If you go for Mark V the next natural steps would be -> Mark V HPS -> Rakza 7.

Cheers
L-zr

 

[turbozed]

I have a YSE, Donic Appelgren, Nittaku Acoustic, and a few Sanwei Fextras.

The YSE is far and away my least favorite blade. I used it for a few weeks before shelfing it. It now does service as a loaner bat. Don't know why but has a lifeless feeling. Maybe I don't like the anigre outer?

I agree with @mocker88 that using hard tacky rubber (H3 and H3 alternatives) for the FH is the most satisfying and demanding. When I hit a good FH drive, it means I've earned it through good footwork, positioning, and body mechanics. I believe that a noticeable gap between high quality and low quality shots is better for development (for me at least) since it helps cue you to when you've performed the stroke optimally vs sub-optimally.

For tacky rubber, I don't think any of those blades will pair very well. Sanwei Fextra I know feels great with tacky rubber and is only $20. It's also one of the most recommended blades alongside Yinhe U-2 and DHS PG7 on Chinese forums for a first custom blade.

 

[latej]

Thank you so much, everyone, for the advice.

There're so many opinions and options; I should pick one and spend more time playing!

I plan to go for Yasaka Sweden Extra with Yasaka Mark V on both sides.

What thickness should I use with Yasaka Mark V, 2.0 or max?

Apart from training, I think it is good to try different things, just for the sake of trying to recognize the differences. So, if you go for Mark V, I'd take 2.0 on BH and max on FH. Also, if 2.0 is available, I prefer it on the BH. Another option is to take Yinhe Mercury 2 Red Soft for BH and Black Mid for FH, not expensive on Ali. Cheers.

 

[turbozed]

Apart from training, I think it is good to try different things, just for the sake of trying to recognize the differences. So, if you go for Mark V, I'd take 2.0 on BH and max on FH. Also, if 2.0 is available, I prefer it on the BH. Another option is to take Yinhe Mercury 2 Red Soft for BH and Black Mid for FH, not expensive on Ali. Cheers.

I haven't played Mark V but from most reviews I've read, Yinhe Mercury 2 is for most purposes a much better rubber (here's one reviewer, for example: https://racketinsight.com/table-tennis/yasaka-mark-v-review/)

The fact that Mercury 2 costs $5 and Mark V costs $35 makes me wonder in what situations would it make sense for someone to pay around 7x as much for Mark V.

Are there any reasons besides maybe availability and nostalgia? Genuinely curious

 

[Mivan]

I have now played two seasons with the MARK V on the backhand. And now we moved to Xiom VEGA intro and I must say it is great and better for me.

So I'd rather go with the intro tensor than the old rubber, especially if it still costs the same money.

 

[latej]

I haven't played Mark V but from most reviews I've read, Yinhe Mercury 2 is for most purposes a much better rubber (here's one reviewer, for example: https://racketinsight.com/table-tennis/yasaka-mark-v-review/)

The fact that Mercury 2 costs $5 and Mark V costs $35 makes me wonder in what situations would it make sense for someone to pay around 7x as much for Mark V.

Are there any reasons besides maybe availability and nostalgia? Genuinely curious

I don't know. It's a legend rubber, can afford being not cheap, and it would fulfill the task here well too. I think no reason to start a polemics, diff. people have diff. prefs ;-)

I think too that YM2 is good enough, while being much cheaper. It's not fast, it's actually very tacky, forces you to do the movement. I recently bought 4red/soft and 4 black/mid for children. Soft is 44-45 and Mid is 46-47 on durometer, the Mid's hardness is very close to H3 H37. Cheers.

 

[loerting]

I disagree that hurricane is not for beginners. It will teach you a good forehand topspin and not do the work for you. It is always better to learn how to drive with an old car instead of a golf.

 

[sportslover]

I am trying to understand where my current rubber cj8000 stands compared to some of the rubbers suggested in this discussion.

What are the differences between my current rubber cj8000 and DHS Hurricane 3/Mark V/Yinhe Mercury 2/Yinhe Big Dipper/Xiom Vega Intro?

As of now, I do enjoy the non-bounciness of my current rubber on the forehand side. I like the directness of my current setup - that I get a good shot if I hit a good shot and a poor shot if I hit a poor shot.

On the backhand, I sometimes feel a lack of power/speed.

Additionally, would someone be able to compare the Allwood 5-ply blade used in my Palio Master 3.0 premade racket and the blades that I have shortlisted?

 

[hclnnkhg]

I am trying to understand where my current rubber cj8000 stands compared to some of the rubbers suggested in this discussion.

What are the differences between my current rubber cj8000 and DHS Hurricane 3/Mark V/Yinhe Mercury 2/Yinhe Big Dipper/Xiom Vega Intro?

As of now, I do enjoy the non-bounciness of my current rubber on the forehand side. I like the directness of my current setup - that I get a good shot if I hit a good shot and a poor shot if I hit a poor shot.

On the backhand, I sometimes feel a lack of power/speed.

Additionally, would someone be able to compare the Allwood 5-ply blade used in my Palio Master 3.0 premade racket and the blades that I have shortlisted?

Mercury 2 is tackier than CJ8000, but in the same tier as CJ8000. Haven't tried the others.

 

[mocker88]

I am trying to understand where my current rubber cj8000 stands compared to some of the rubbers suggested in this discussion.

What are the differences between my current rubber cj8000 and DHS Hurricane 3/Mark V/Yinhe Mercury 2/Yinhe Big Dipper/Xiom Vega Intro?

As of now, I do enjoy the non-bounciness of my current rubber on the forehand side. I like the directness of my current setup - that I get a good shot if I hit a good shot and a poor shot if I hit a poor shot.

On the backhand, I sometimes feel a lack of power/speed.

Additionally, would someone be able to compare the Allwood 5-ply blade used in my Palio Master 3.0 premade racket and the blades that I have shortlisted?

DHS Hurricane 3 is a faster, more spin oriented rubber. Available in hardness 37 to 41deg, where the 37deg is quite soft and could be the most similar to your CJ8000.

Mark V is an older untacky rubber and could be a bit faster than CJ8000, but also quite linear. I haven't played with this one this millenium, so I can't compare it that good.

Yinhe Mercury 2 is really tacky and available in Soft/Medium/Hard sponge. Speedwise in the same area as your CJ8000.

Yinhe Big Dipper is my own favorite. Faster, half-tacky and spinnier compared to CJ8000. And it gives better control properties than DHS H3. I could easily play the 38deg backhand and 39deg forehand on my Yinhe V14 Pro blade for competitions.

Don't know about the Xiom Vega Intro...

 

[BaRanchik]

I am trying to understand where my current rubber cj8000 stands compared to some of the rubbers suggested in this discussion.

What are the differences between my current rubber cj8000 and DHS Hurricane 3/Mark V/Yinhe Mercury 2/Yinhe Big Dipper/Xiom Vega Intro?

As of now, I do enjoy the non-bounciness of my current rubber on the forehand side. I like the directness of my current setup - that I get a good shot if I hit a good shot and a poor shot if I hit a poor shot.

On the backhand, I sometimes feel a lack of power/speed.

Additionally, would someone be able to compare the Allwood 5-ply blade used in my Palio Master 3.0 premade racket and the blades that I have shortlisted?

I had Palio Energy 03 paired with CJ8000 on both sides (tried all kinds of different hardnesses with the CJ to feel and understand how they differ), which I assume is very very close to what you are using. It served me well for the 6 or 7 months I used it, but it was slow for anything other than close to the table.

Since then I moved to Nittaku Violin, which I had paired with the CJs for a month, and it was a bad combination for the backhand. The forehand with CJ8000 was always great and packed with spin as well as enough speed for hitting winners at my level paired with the Violin, but the backhand was horribly slow and the sweet spot was very small resulting in worse shots. I had to adapt to it for a bit, and even after a while my backhand wasn't nearly as good as it was with the Energy 03.

I recently changed the rubbers to Big Dipper on the FH, and Moon Speed on the BH. This is significantly faster than the CJ8000s, which requires some time of getting used to it, but the control is still there. My BD sheet doesn't seem to be as tacky as others say it is (the CJs were way tackier), but it's way grippier. Lifting backspin is easier, serves have more spin (but not by much, which is definitely because of my technique), and it feels like I could use this rubber until I get to the top5 at my club.

BD and the Moon Speed also do a good job of punishing me for poorly executed strokes, same as the CJs, so I am not worried of it teaching me bad habits. I was worried about that before changing into them, but it seems like it's okay. For their price, I'd say give them a go regardless if you choose to keep them or not.

 

[sportslover]

Here are a few videos of me playing. I am in a black T-shirt.

Forehand counter:

Backhand counter:

Forehand topspin:

What kind of custom racket should I go for?