Best Single Ply Hinoki Blade on Ali Express for a 13 Year old! and thenbest Price/Performance Single PLy?
- Thread starter Haraold
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It is because mine is bespoke. Custom made.
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I think it is the Royal version ,the finest grade of Hinoki,it would cost around 400 Euros for me.- so you have to go full Bonzo before youcan go Full Gozo,lol.
I play the normal Glayzer on Bh in 2.1 and the Bluestar A1 in max on FH.
I also tried the Hammond Z2 on BH in Max,but it is to fast for my Playstyle on BH.
I heard that single Plies are Stiff and have little to low Fle and my BTy Kiso V has enough Flex and the Hardness is nowhere near a single ply i guess,but Hinoki has some kind of inbuilt Tensor Effect or so,Smashes are a pain in the ass cause of this effect,i always overshoot,i now always try to use a Hard TS with SIdespin to make the Point,,instead of smashing .
Hm I really wanted to try a T05 or D05 on that Played only from the SPin perspective,but the Bluestar with it´s somewhat hybrid like features sits me very well.
I find it a great rubber but pricey,and no it is only half casue Waldner promoted it,the other half is it is really a good rubber.
The Glayzer is somewhat of easier to play Tenergy but more stable but not as much spin i guess.
Only played a T05 on a BTY Grubba Carbon,was reall a nice controlled combo.
I liked some 47.5 like Xiom Vega Pro,Or X which is acomparable wit Tenergy but i didn´t like the Sponge from Xiom.
I even played V 47.5 J & H but on FH.
Spinniest of all the 47.5 i tested but i found the rubber a bit strange from its behaviour,couldn´t find out when and how much tha catapult sets in.
AS for the Hinoki with CArbon,does anybody play it with harder or softer rubbers?
I loved the Acuda S2 on Bh but it bottomed out quickly but was well worth the stability but you really had to put in Power and precision to get pressure with your bh.
I reall would like to find out whatthat Juic Neo Galaxy is,they really waited 10 years for a release of a new rubber, i know it is a somewhat not so well established brand but not totally a new brand,even one of the old ones like Yinhe or 729.
COuld be a great rubber,but genetion is here as are the new Andro and Gewo,and it costs a lot,but maybe somebody whill get his hands on one..looking at you @Gozo Aruna
Aand all in all i find it is a really difference between a frimer Topsheet and harder Sponge (besides there are Sponges same degree Shore which feel "harder" is this probably cause of the air or bubbles in it) and Allwood,,i always sy its about composition of the complete Setup.
And can you guys maybe elaborate on allthe Cypresses,American Hinoki,etc in comaprison to Kiso?
I play the normal Glayzer on Bh in 2.1 and the Bluestar A1 in max on FH.
I also tried the Hammond Z2 on BH in Max,but it is to fast for my Playstyle on BH.
I heard that single Plies are Stiff and have little to low Fle and my BTy Kiso V has enough Flex and the Hardness is nowhere near a single ply i guess,but Hinoki has some kind of inbuilt Tensor Effect or so,Smashes are a pain in the ass cause of this effect,i always overshoot,i now always try to use a Hard TS with SIdespin to make the Point,,instead of smashing .
Hm I really wanted to try a T05 or D05 on that Played only from the SPin perspective,but the Bluestar with it´s somewhat hybrid like features sits me very well.
I find it a great rubber but pricey,and no it is only half casue Waldner promoted it,the other half is it is really a good rubber.
The Glayzer is somewhat of easier to play Tenergy but more stable but not as much spin i guess.
Only played a T05 on a BTY Grubba Carbon,was reall a nice controlled combo.
I liked some 47.5 like Xiom Vega Pro,Or X which is acomparable wit Tenergy but i didn´t like the Sponge from Xiom.
I even played V 47.5 J & H but on FH.
Spinniest of all the 47.5 i tested but i found the rubber a bit strange from its behaviour,couldn´t find out when and how much tha catapult sets in.
AS for the Hinoki with CArbon,does anybody play it with harder or softer rubbers?
I loved the Acuda S2 on Bh but it bottomed out quickly but was well worth the stability but you really had to put in Power and precision to get pressure with your bh.
I reall would like to find out whatthat Juic Neo Galaxy is,they really waited 10 years for a release of a new rubber, i know it is a somewhat not so well established brand but not totally a new brand,even one of the old ones like Yinhe or 729.
COuld be a great rubber,but genetion is here as are the new Andro and Gewo,and it costs a lot,but maybe somebody whill get his hands on one..looking at you @Gozo Aruna
Aand all in all i find it is a really difference between a frimer Topsheet and harder Sponge (besides there are Sponges same degree Shore which feel "harder" is this probably cause of the air or bubbles in it) and Allwood,,i always sy its about composition of the complete Setup.
And can you guys maybe elaborate on allthe Cypresses,American Hinoki,etc in comaprison to Kiso?
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Did you test the normal Glayzer?i find it like a bit more topped out Rozena,i loved the Factive be4 the Fastarc Series,and still do recommend as Entry level Tensor maybe Paul (the Son) will get it on the Blade.
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@Haraold ,
I'll answer only on those product that I know.
1. Have not tried Glyzer hence no comment. Not a fan of Spring-sponge X. I have tried Dignics 05 & 09C. Not a fan.
2. Yes, one-ply hinoki has a certain in-bulit tension to it.
3. Acuda S2 is nice. Good choice. S3 is even nicer. I luv control rubber these days. My old days of being a speed demon is behind me. I drive responsibly now.
4. The newer Gewo & Andro with thin topsheet, thick sponge are lovely to loop but because of their extra bounciness, the short game can be challenging. Something to be aware off. This rubber IMO would be ideal for the European style of away from table loop-a-loop playstyle.
I'll answer only on those product that I know.
1. Have not tried Glyzer hence no comment. Not a fan of Spring-sponge X. I have tried Dignics 05 & 09C. Not a fan.
2. Yes, one-ply hinoki has a certain in-bulit tension to it.
3. Acuda S2 is nice. Good choice. S3 is even nicer. I luv control rubber these days. My old days of being a speed demon is behind me. I drive responsibly now.
4. The newer Gewo & Andro with thin topsheet, thick sponge are lovely to loop but because of their extra bounciness, the short game can be challenging. Something to be aware off. This rubber IMO would be ideal for the European style of away from table loop-a-loop playstyle.
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that is why i play the Bluestar A1 hard and more linear but softer topsheet,cause the Kiso V from Bty has a really great tension almost unplayable with softer rubbers,cause every short-short was medium and i have a good teqchnique.
The Hammond Z2 was to fast that is why i found the normal Glayzer like a updated Version of the Factive from Nittaku for BH which i love.
And the Xiom J% H V 47.5 has some strange behaviour with his catapult,
the mos problems i have is whit smashes fast punchblocks etc ,they all land somewhere on the moon i have to apply tts for Magnus effect otherwise it is out or i really stand perfect,and not at my age anymore.thos days in the Bayernauswahl and beyond are long gone.
Yeah i loved the S2 the S3 was to soft but i played it on the Spectra Blades and on the normal Waldner offensive 2016.
Well and i played the Goriki Kaisoku and the Quantum X pro on another blade from Sergo,who was with Spectra and Framire top ply,it was a Smashmonster but way to fast.
But i liked the Gorikki on Bh and Quantum x Pro on FH,it was some kind of the exact oppsite of a Hinoki Blade with Spinheavy Rubbers,.take the ball really soon after it dropped and overpower the spin with speed,alas i am too old for this playstyle.
A few problems i have are with fake serves who are empty and fast,but that is training,
The Hammond Z2 was to fast that is why i found the normal Glayzer like a updated Version of the Factive from Nittaku for BH which i love.
And the Xiom J% H V 47.5 has some strange behaviour with his catapult,
the mos problems i have is whit smashes fast punchblocks etc ,they all land somewhere on the moon i have to apply tts for Magnus effect otherwise it is out or i really stand perfect,and not at my age anymore.thos days in the Bayernauswahl and beyond are long gone.
Yeah i loved the S2 the S3 was to soft but i played it on the Spectra Blades and on the normal Waldner offensive 2016.
Well and i played the Goriki Kaisoku and the Quantum X pro on another blade from Sergo,who was with Spectra and Framire top ply,it was a Smashmonster but way to fast.
But i liked the Gorikki on Bh and Quantum x Pro on FH,it was some kind of the exact oppsite of a Hinoki Blade with Spinheavy Rubbers,.take the ball really soon after it dropped and overpower the spin with speed,alas i am too old for this playstyle.
A few problems i have are with fake serves who are empty and fast,but that is training,
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Anyone tried the Sanwei H-10 or other Hinoki blades from them,i was told they all make An handle if you talk to them and now i got the Yes,so maybe i am lucky after all,and to start with the Hinoki blades is there a Good Blade one of you can recommend?
maybe the H 10 as a single ply or one of the others to first test out the Hinoki blades which are nearer on the Darker 5p2a or so?
maybe the H 10 as a single ply or one of the others to first test out the Hinoki blades which are nearer on the Darker 5p2a or so?
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And another no for anatomic or no for "we don´t" have the wood.
Well at least Paul,will get a flared one,i doubt that will go away.
But Sanwei produces anatomic if you contact them before.
Only one i know is the new Tibhar H1-10 and H3 but thatt can´t be it...i mean 2 Blades and only ons sungle pl with anatomic,and like 50 with ST or FL that is Insanity.
I also contacted many Manufacturerrs,no chance man,that suck so crazy.
Wll i only have the Tibhar in STore cause i doubt i will get an old Senkoh lol
Well at least Paul,will get a flared one,i doubt that will go away.
But Sanwei produces anatomic if you contact them before.
Only one i know is the new Tibhar H1-10 and H3 but thatt can´t be it...i mean 2 Blades and only ons sungle pl with anatomic,and like 50 with ST or FL that is Insanity.
I also contacted many Manufacturerrs,no chance man,that suck so crazy.
Wll i only have the Tibhar in STore cause i doubt i will get an old Senkoh lol
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Rabbit hole lolllllllli seen this on zenmarket (yahoo Auction) some is from a Kotaku
And the others spelled Kokutaku,i somewhere read in another Forum that they are connected or where connected at some point but i didn´t understand it exactly,I think it was theooak Forum and there are also some WHo got their Blade from Kokutaku and other fromMr.Takashima.
But maybe they are just custom orders from kokutaku.
Hinoki Blades are just like rabbit hole
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yes an anatomic rabbit hole with a single ply hopefully
But like Alice i am still in Wonderland and searching for a single ply wit an handle,do you got by any chance a Tamaropa,Senkoh85,90 or max to sell?
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you tested the Factive by any chance,liked him for a control Rubber or entry Tensor the most of all with Acuda S2 as second.
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I play penhold only so I don't have shakehand blades...yes an anatomic rabbit hole with a single ply hopefully
But like Alice i am still in Wonderland and searching for a single ply wit an handle,do you got by any chance a Tamaropa,Senkoh85,90 or max to sell?
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i play anatomic handle,so the only and this is the truth option i Have is the "NEW" Tibhar H1-9.
It´s fantastic i was at yahoo auction,asked several Manufacturers,big Brands to like Sanwei who can produce another handle if you ask before you buy (Hint:they dont produce their single Ply anymore ;HAHA)
Darker,Butterfly,Juic,,Yinhe,Nittakzu,Yasaka,etc... and NOBODY has a Single Ply HInoki blade with Anatomic handle.
Even ARiex who produce exclusive and i believe superb Hinoki blades won´t or can´t even with the Royal Phoenix edition a Blade with anatomic handle.
IT is INSANE even PP from Taiwan or other cypresses Variants all have 0 blades with anatomic Handle.
I just got a message from SPinfactor.de that even Avalox who produces a lot of excellent Blades with Hinoki Veneers ,can´t get the 9 ply AVX Hado in anatomic,even if it is listed as available in anaatomic.
SO PLS can Anyone Tell me that the NEW Tibhar H1 -9 is really worth 260 euros,cause I could get a shakehand flared or straight to SDC OR TZSAAKAMBO who would make me the handle and pay another i dunno,100 euro for it
YOU play CPEN OR JPEN?
SO you probably have more modells available than SHakehand?what was the Best SIngle ply you ever played?
I think we probably get my friends son a Myiabi first to Test then he will probably if he wants to train again A DArker Speed 90 or the new Avantir,he also has a lot of options.
SO I have a new question for all of you,
What Single Ply Model,would be the best transition Blade from the 5,7,plies and 5+2etc "normal shakehand or penholder, into a Single ply Hinoki Shakehand Flared Model Blade?
Brands etc is your choice,what did anyone of you consider the best for the first Transition and why?like thickness,tooo stiff,flex,speed controll etc?
It´s fantastic i was at yahoo auction,asked several Manufacturers,big Brands to like Sanwei who can produce another handle if you ask before you buy (Hint:they dont produce their single Ply anymore ;HAHA)
Darker,Butterfly,Juic,,Yinhe,Nittakzu,Yasaka,etc... and NOBODY has a Single Ply HInoki blade with Anatomic handle.
Even ARiex who produce exclusive and i believe superb Hinoki blades won´t or can´t even with the Royal Phoenix edition a Blade with anatomic handle.
IT is INSANE even PP from Taiwan or other cypresses Variants all have 0 blades with anatomic Handle.
I just got a message from SPinfactor.de that even Avalox who produces a lot of excellent Blades with Hinoki Veneers ,can´t get the 9 ply AVX Hado in anatomic,even if it is listed as available in anaatomic.
SO PLS can Anyone Tell me that the NEW Tibhar H1 -9 is really worth 260 euros,cause I could get a shakehand flared or straight to SDC OR TZSAAKAMBO who would make me the handle and pay another i dunno,100 euro for it
YOU play CPEN OR JPEN?
SO you probably have more modells available than SHakehand?what was the Best SIngle ply you ever played?
I think we probably get my friends son a Myiabi first to Test then he will probably if he wants to train again A DArker Speed 90 or the new Avantir,he also has a lot of options.
SO I have a new question for all of you,
What Single Ply Model,would be the best transition Blade from the 5,7,plies and 5+2etc "normal shakehand or penholder, into a Single ply Hinoki Shakehand Flared Model Blade?
Brands etc is your choice,what did anyone of you consider the best for the first Transition and why?like thickness,tooo stiff,flex,speed controll etc?
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Ans sry for my anatomic rant,but after i heard tzhe Hado news i gave up and probably know my fate will be Tibhar H1-9.
didn´t think it was possible that there can be only one,they should rename the Blade into "Highlander"
I searches for like a year or so,and contacted a lot of shops etc i couldnßt believe it,Even Kevin from AMerican Hinoki said no,lol
sry guys my NBA team Dallas got mauled yesterday in the finals,and i woke up to the Hado News and my Fate of the Tibhar.
didn´t think it was possible that there can be only one,they should rename the Blade into "Highlander"
I searches for like a year or so,and contacted a lot of shops etc i couldnßt believe it,Even Kevin from AMerican Hinoki said no,lol
sry guys my NBA team Dallas got mauled yesterday in the finals,and i woke up to the Hado News and my Fate of the Tibhar.
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Doesn't Ariex have the "other" option for handles as the last option on the drop down list for royal blades?i play anatomic handle,so the only and this is the truth option i Have is the "NEW" Tibhar H1-9.
It´s fantastic i was at yahoo auction,asked several Manufacturers,big Brands to like Sanwei who can produce another handle if you ask before you buy (Hint:they dont produce their single Ply anymore ;HAHA)
Darker,Butterfly,Juic,,Yinhe,Nittakzu,Yasaka,etc... and NOBODY has a Single Ply HInoki blade with Anatomic handle.
Even ARiex who produce exclusive and i believe superb Hinoki blades won´t or can´t even with the Royal Phoenix edition a Blade with anatomic handle.
IT is INSANE even PP from Taiwan or other cypresses Variants all have 0 blades with anatomic Handle.
I just got a message from SPinfactor.de that even Avalox who produces a lot of excellent Blades with Hinoki Veneers ,can´t get the 9 ply AVX Hado in anatomic,even if it is listed as available in anaatomic.
SO PLS can Anyone Tell me that the NEW Tibhar H1 -9 is really worth 260 euros,cause I could get a shakehand flared or straight to SDC OR TZSAAKAMBO who would make me the handle and pay another i dunno,100 euro for it
YOU play CPEN OR JPEN?
SO you probably have more modells available than SHakehand?what was the Best SIngle ply you ever played?
I think we probably get my friends son a Myiabi first to Test then he will probably if he wants to train again A DArker Speed 90 or the new Avantir,he also has a lot of options.
SO I have a new question for all of you,
What Single Ply Model,would be the best transition Blade from the 5,7,plies and 5+2etc "normal shakehand or penholder, into a Single ply Hinoki Shakehand Flared Model Blade?
Brands etc is your choice,what did anyone of you consider the best for the first Transition and why?like thickness,tooo stiff,flex,speed controll etc?
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I asked @Gozo Aruna amd he said no,before i made up this Thread,
The Last option for me with google translate is "another Specification" so Maybe but they have everything else Penhold,straight or flared so i honestly believe they at least could have a simple anatomic option,.But hey i will ask but the blade itselfis about 400.- Euros iirc,so it is a probably worth it but as my first entry into single ply Blades maybe a overkill.
But you maybe right and i have to ask,
But i found a 1h-9 maybe,which can be the ultimate Luck or the greatest scam and only I can Tap into it,if that is true it will be like a"Erlkönig"as we say here in Germany,I already sent him 3 mails when i saw it.
But do you own a single ply and which single Ply For little Paul would you suggest will be a the best transition into single Ply blades,for a Youngster who played mostly a five and seven ply butterfly and Joola Rally i think it was like everybody had it here in Germany.
I think he played an Armstrong and tackiness C or D or both.
Cause as we made the simple Falkenberg he played really solid with my BTY Kiso V,and with my rubbers a Bluestar A1 on Fh and the Glayzer max on BH.
That is not an easy setup by any means and he will get new rubbers,,cause his are torn down.
I thought some entry level tensors like the Factive,or 42 shore esn for bh.Cause those Single pies are stiff and have low flex i guess,you see i am new to the hinoki club nad that was the point why i play harder rubbers on that Kiso V from me,to tame that "Hinoki trampoline Tensor" effect,whih was new for me for a normal 5 Layer Woodblade,and here are hundreds of them like The Old Donic WAldner 2016 or Banda back in the day.
The Last option for me with google translate is "another Specification" so Maybe but they have everything else Penhold,straight or flared so i honestly believe they at least could have a simple anatomic option,.But hey i will ask but the blade itselfis about 400.- Euros iirc,so it is a probably worth it but as my first entry into single ply Blades maybe a overkill.
But you maybe right and i have to ask,
But i found a 1h-9 maybe,which can be the ultimate Luck or the greatest scam and only I can Tap into it,if that is true it will be like a"Erlkönig"as we say here in Germany,I already sent him 3 mails when i saw it.
But do you own a single ply and which single Ply For little Paul would you suggest will be a the best transition into single Ply blades,for a Youngster who played mostly a five and seven ply butterfly and Joola Rally i think it was like everybody had it here in Germany.
I think he played an Armstrong and tackiness C or D or both.
Cause as we made the simple Falkenberg he played really solid with my BTY Kiso V,and with my rubbers a Bluestar A1 on Fh and the Glayzer max on BH.
That is not an easy setup by any means and he will get new rubbers,,cause his are torn down.
I thought some entry level tensors like the Factive,or 42 shore esn for bh.Cause those Single pies are stiff and have low flex i guess,you see i am new to the hinoki club nad that was the point why i play harder rubbers on that Kiso V from me,to tame that "Hinoki trampoline Tensor" effect,whih was new for me for a normal 5 Layer Woodblade,and here are hundreds of them like The Old Donic WAldner 2016 or Banda back in the day.
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If you really want to try a One-Ply blade (or grab a pair of blades for you and your son), and want them with an anatomic handle, I can easily make a matching set for you for far less than the 400 euro (each!) you're currently contemplating.
The only catch will be they won't be made from Hinoki -- they'll be made from an obscure timber I discovered over two years ago, while conducting research into possible alternatives to Hinoki. Rather than derail the thread any further, please pm or email me if you have any interest, my contact details are included in my TTD profile. 🙂
The only catch will be they won't be made from Hinoki -- they'll be made from an obscure timber I discovered over two years ago, while conducting research into possible alternatives to Hinoki. Rather than derail the thread any further, please pm or email me if you have any interest, my contact details are included in my TTD profile. 🙂
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Interesting, can you tell us more about this wood?🪵
Cheers
L-zr
P.s I think this is definitely on topic…
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Yeah sure, happy to. 🙂
I'll keep this as brief as I can, as I've posted this stuff before elsewhere from memory. 🙂
The wood I use in my one plys comes from a very obscure species, which I sometimes need to process a bit in order to make it blade-worthy. It's not a rare or endangered species but it's also not commercially available. So far as I know it's neither planted in any plantations, or regularly harvested anywhere in the world; ...this makes it really hard stuff to procure, and even when I do manage to find some, it's only available in *very* limited amounts.
I've given this particular wood the name Skollawood because I prefer not to call it by its common name, largely for commercial reasons (given how difficult it is to procure the stuff regularly, I'd prefer demand for it *not* go through the roof any time soon if at all possible).
Skollawood is basically the closest thing imaginable to either hinoki or cypress in a One-Ply blade, without it actually being either of those woods. Describing Sköllawood's playing feel in detail requires comparing it to Hinoki and cypress through necessity, but it's not really an ideal comparison.
Hinoki/ cypress and Sköllawood are highly dissimilar woods, both structurally and biologically, but just happen to behave almost exactly the same during impact with a table tennis ball. In an ideal world, each of these woods when used in a one-ply would therefore be regarded separately, and on its own merits. That being said, in terms of playing feel, Hinoki/cypress is still the closest thing to Sköllawood I've found (with Gabon / Okoume being a very distant second), so for now at least, the the imperfect comparison continues.
Skollawood has highly similar spin, speed, control, vibration & feedback to hinoki: It shares the exact same soft playing feel, the same super-springy bounce, and has a similar sensation of 'wrapping' itself around the ballduring play. Its sense of playing touch isn't quite as 'buttery' as hinoki ( if that makes sense), but it's still got a very similar feeling of touch to it nonetheless.
Which one out of Skollawood and Hinoki is the bouncier wood (ie: which one has the most popping catapult) is frankly a matter of some debate. Personally I think high grade Sköllawood is a bit faster / bouncier than even Kiso Hinoki, but I'm also far from impartial on this point.
What is totally beyond dispute though, is that despite their many similarities, Skollawood has a few unique characteristics all of its own, that IMO makes it better suited to one ply use than either hinoki or cypress:
-- Skollawood has a MUCH higher Modulus of Rupture than Hinoki (ie: it's much stronger across the grain). So while it can still technically be split along the grain in one ply blades (just like hinoki does), it's also much, MUCH less prone to doing so.
-- it's typically a little more dense (ie: a bit heavier on average) than Hinoki, but not overly so. If the 'average' 10mm Hinoki / cypress one ply weighs about 80-90 grams, the same blade in Sköllawood would weighs about 90-105 grams.
-- Skollawood also frequently (but not always) has a lower Modulus of Elasticity than Hinoki (ie: it' far more prone to flexing than Hinoki. While Hinoki one plys are typically hugely stiff, Sköllawood blades however will in most cases, flex considerably more than Hinoki (depending on the grade and thickness of skollawood, and how I treat it).
There's a few more things I could say on the differences between them, but all the above basically covers the main points.
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You are definitely on the List with the Sköllarwood,and the anatomic handle would be only for me,My Friend´s Son is too smart to play a dying gripform.as did his father back then.
I on the other Hand am Dumb and to old to relearn a new gripform,well i can play both ST and FL but i always liked AN more,cause i got more stability in certein situations with the grip like Blocks,etc.
I never twiddled but i get the Argument for STr and FL over An.
But that this handle ultimately will die out is crazy,almsot all of the new Blades are Penhold,STR or FL.
But I will defiinitelly HAve your Sköllarwood in mind,i simpl know what a Kiso Hinoki 5 ply feels like,that is the only reason i didn´t get concrete before when we talked,but when the Next saison starts i want to starrt it with a Bang and maybe a Sköllar.
As for Paul he has to decide for himself hence why i asked many of you who already played single plys which modell or cutom SKöllar will be the best to get comming from normal5 ply Kiso Hinoki or Allwood blades and composite blades like my 2 from SDC.
No the ARiex would probably an Overkill,but they have their Hinoki graded in tiers,at least the royal Phoenix s+ Tier and i didnt ask them if the last options in the Handle options is customizable to anatomic,but i will b e just to say nw i suddenly have the Tibhar a Sköllar or Ariex to choose from!
We old Dinosaurs have to fight so that this handle doesn´t die out!
