Ma Long @WTTC2026: Harimoto Tomokazu is the Best Non-CNT Player.

says Shoo...nothing to see here. - zeio
says Shoo...nothing to see here. - zeio
🏆 Top 1% Commenter
Well-Known Member
Jan 2018
13,091
12,928
29,224
Making a separate thread for easy future reference.

Not Moregard, not F. Lebrun and not Matsushima, but Harimoto. Go convince Ma Long.

https://www.tabletennisdaily.com/fo...ornia-usa-26-jun-5-jul-2026.39444/post-580557
Well, some members here sound like TensorBackhand and those Chinese fangirls who only care about medals and know nothing else other than results.

It's not just Mizutani who has defended (as well as criticized) Harimoto but also Hao Shuai. Even some of the former HKG players and coaches hold the same view.
I really should stop wasting my brain cells on internet forums... 同你班蛋散真係拗來都多𨳊餘

Ma Long’s Pick: Best Non-Chinese Player 👀 #offthebounce #podcast #tabletennis #乒乓球 #malong
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/F19m-sSuJTM
 
  • Like
Reactions: lightspin
says Shoo...nothing to see here. - zeio
says Shoo...nothing to see here. - zeio
🏆 Top 1% Commenter
Well-Known Member
Jan 2018
13,091
12,928
29,224
Off The Bounce #1 - US Smash 2026 Preview
https://youtu.be/D38CJJDmU_w?t=1148
(Um, but yeah, I managed to have a chat with Malong and I'm gonna say this now. Uh, I asked him, is this an exclusive in the first episode?
This is an exclusive.
Okay, it's the right time to do it because I know we've already had quite a few content creators doing like London World Champs wrap-ups, but I thought, okay,
I've got one chance to ask Marong a question. I want to know who he thinks is the best non-Chinese player. Oh.
So, I asked him. I said, Malong, who do you think is the best? Did you just walk up to him and ask him?
He was sat behind me. Jo introduced me to him. So I was having a little chat with him about how he's enjoying his time in London and I did ask him, "Who do you think is the best non-Chinese
player?" And he said, "Wang Chin." I was like, "No, no." I was like, "Non-Chinese." Um, and he said, "Haramoto." No hesitation. Wow. Mi or Tomazi.
Tomazu. Tomazu. And I was thinking, okay, that's interesting because I would have gone with maybe I don't know, Toro
or Trolls right now, but obviously Haramoto was beating him when he was 15, so maybe kind of has to say that. Yeah. Yeah.
I didn't say that to to Malone, but was it like mid mid was there? Where was it? Was it in the arena?
It was in the stands next to the booth. Okay. So, he's trying to watch a game.
[laughter]
We were We were chatting about the Taipei and uh Japan lineups. Oh, wow. Having a proper chat. He is cool guy.)
 
This user has no status.
This user has no status.
🏆 Top 1% Commenter
Well-Known Member
Moderator
Oct 2014
20,206
26,819
71,556
Read 17 reviews
Remember people, the silly reason for this post is that Harimoto likes to make fun of Truls Moregardh, and when we pointed out how silly Harimoto was being in the face of Truls performances at big moments, @zeio as usual started doubling down as if anyone really thinks Harimoto is a bad player in some way when the main point was that making fun of Truls who has more hardware than Harimoto at the moment is really silly. Harimoto is clearly and easily one of the best TT talents in the world and of all time. But if someone says that they think Matsushima is better or Truls has performed better or Felix is going to have a better career, these are all reasonable opinions, just as is Ma Long's. What is more interesting than Ma Long's answer is understanding why he puts Harimoto above the others and that would require a more nuanced conversation.
 
This user has no status.
This user has no status.
🏆 Top 1% Commenter
Well-Known Member
Oct 2016
2,053
1,767
4,209
Off topic but I find it more interesting to discuss why the Chinese are losing more these days?
It just go up and down?
Europeans getting better?
Chinese not as good?
More sports in China now?
Better economy in China, so can live decent life without being a tabletennis pro?

Feel like when they started losing the last time they changed to backside and rpb. Would be interesting if it will be some change now?
Noticed both a shakehand short pimple player and penhold long pimple player on wtt youth tournaments. Maybe they will try more styles?
 
  • Like
Reactions: J-fed
This user has no status.
This user has no status.
Member
Oct 2025
107
113
270
Off topic but I find it more interesting to discuss why the Chinese are losing more these days?
Everyone else getting better, China getting worse, equipment leveling the field (debatable), etc. Maybe up and down. All these things I think are secondary to my main thesis - Yao Ming (only half joking).

Yao Ming being drafted by the Rockets really cemented basketball as the dominant sport in the mid 2000s, and table tennis has been losing ground ever since. Don't get me wrong, pong is still big in China - just not as big as people think. Basketball's effect (combined with a few other timely happenings) actually helped drive football's popularity into the ground, where youth participation in organized football was something stupid low, like in the thousands (fact check this). Anyway, the pipeline for pong talent is ischemic compared to the 90s. I think it barely ranks in the top 10 in youth participation. E-sports is number 2.

I don't think it matters that much but table tennis never attracted the best athletes, but with its continued decline in popularity it probably attracts even less talent nowadays. Because let's be honest, no matter how goated ML and FZD are, they're nothing compared to Wardell Curry or Erling Haaland.

Better economy in China, so can live decent life without being a tabletennis pro?
This was never a big deal. If you look into the backgrounds of the top pros from China, most of them were middle class. Which middle class? Both - UK and US english.
 
  • Haha
Reactions: tokatci
This user has no status.
This user has no status.
Member
Jun 2026
20
6
42
Off topic but I find it more interesting to discuss why the Chinese are losing more these days?
It just go up and down?
Europeans getting better?
Chinese not as good?
More sports in China now?
Better economy in China, so can live decent life without being a tabletennis pro?

Feel like when they started losing the last time they changed to backside and rpb. Would be interesting if it will be some change now?
Noticed both a shakehand short pimple player and penhold long pimple player on wtt youth tournaments. Maybe they will try more styles?
I think all the points you make here are very salient. One thing that is key though is the system they play under has always had an element of hindrance and now it becoming difficult to mask due to the level of the game peaking. Before they could cover up the problems by just being way more dedicated and professional and of course having a many times larger system and pool of talent. Now other nations who are not held back by outdated psychological preparation are catching up and look like taking over. With that large a pool of players and investment China should be miles ahead but for many reasons the state intervention is often a massive pressure on many of the players rather than a source of motivation.
I have studied the psychological aspects to some extent and there are many good academic articles. I studied the case of Lin Gaoyuan who is of course an extreme case, but possibly a microcosm of all that can go wrong as a top Chinese player.
This is a good and interesting paper but there are many. https://pdfs.semanticscholar.org/26aa/736dcab7716acc3bbc8d3c0e6feb8a857e01.pdf
 
This user has no status.
This user has no status.
Active Member
Oct 2024
630
411
1,573
If you want to know who's the best non-chinese player better ask a non-biased chinese athlete. ML is a CNT representative, he obeys the PRC official guidelines, so if Lin-Yun Ju had a better ranking, he'd said LYJ, Tony would understand for sure why I'm saying this, and yes it has to do with anything related to China's geopolitics, if it was Chen TianYuan who's now french he would have said Chen TianYuan. To me better ask Fan Zhendong, the less biased chinese athlete non related anymore to the CNT. FZD has certainly way more freedom of speech than ML.

And about football or basketball being more famous than in the PRC, It makes me laugh hard: when you're an NBA player without contract like recently Killian Hayes after his interim at Sacramento, the second option is Europe, and not because of the Euroleague you simply make a better living there playing in national leagues, then Australia cos' there's a really strong league there developing talented 16 to 19 years old teens before the NBA draft, then only China. Guershon Yabusele once said that at one point in his career he was so down mentally he was ok to play in China, that tells ya how much mediocre you have to be or feel to play there. So please, be serious a minute.

Football, well the women's team is decent that's for sure, like basketball, but anything boys/mens team is atrocious, failing to qualify in any world cup since 2002, ousted in pool matches. And it was their 1st ever WC... Olympics... you have to go back to 1936, Asian Cup... never won any, 2 finals in 1984 and 2004. Why do you think japanese and south-korean players get contracts in top UEFA teams, but not any chinese one ? even the japanese rugby top tier league, mostly made for retired australians, south-africans and all-blacks players, makes more annual revenues than the basketball chinese league. It's well-known the football CSL is rigged by corruption at every stage, and it's that way since more than a decade. even the US MLS looks "decent" compared to the CSL, even if it's for retired top international players, the only exception being Leo Messi, but when you look at Inter Miami performances in last year's FIFA Club World Cup, that's not good, Inter Miami could barely win games in the Europa League. Everyone knows that, only the americans from the USA thinks their MLS players are semi-gods... mostly because they know nothing about football, Alexi Lalas is being punished every night by Zlatan and Titi because he's the worst pundit ever football has ever seen, a former Team USA international player, that tells a lot. Pulisic will be a way better pundit when he'll retire, because he knows what football really is, playing in Italy since a while now, Lalas has played 2 years in Padova, then back to the US, too much mediocre player according to the european standards.
 
This user has no status.
This user has no status.
Member
Oct 2025
107
113
270
If you want to know who's the best non-chinese player better ask a non-biased chinese athlete. ML is a CNT representative, he obeys the PRC official guidelines, so if Lin-Yun Ju had a better ranking, he'd said LYJ, Tony would understand for sure why I'm saying this, and yes it has to do with anything related to China's geopolitics, if it was Chen TianYuan who's now french he would have said Chen TianYuan. To me better ask Fan Zhendong, the less biased chinese athlete non related anymore to the CNT. FZD has certainly way more freedom of speech than ML.

And about football or basketball being more famous than in the PRC, It makes me laugh hard: when you're an NBA player without contract like recently Killian Hayes after his interim at Sacramento, the second option is Europe, and not because of the Euroleague you simply make a better living there playing in national leagues, then Australia cos' there's a really strong league there developing talented 16 to 19 years old teens before the NBA draft, then only China. Guershon Yabusele once said that at one point in his career he was so down mentally he was ok to play in China, that tells ya how much mediocre you have to be or feel to play there. So please, be serious a minute.

Football, well the women's team is decent that's for sure, like basketball, but anything boys/mens team is atrocious, failing to qualify in any world cup since 2002, ousted in pool matches. And it was their 1st ever WC... Olympics... you have to go back to 1936, Asian Cup... never won any, 2 finals in 1984 and 2004. Why do you think japanese and south-korean players get contracts in top UEFA teams, but not any chinese one ? even the japanese rugby top tier league, mostly made for retired australians, south-africans and all-blacks players, makes more annual revenues than the basketball chinese league. It's well-known the football CSL is rigged by corruption at every stage, and it's that way since more than a decade. even the US MLS looks "decent" compared to the CSL, even if it's for retired top international players, the only exception being Leo Messi, but when you look at Inter Miami performances in last year's FIFA Club World Cup, that's not good, Inter Miami could barely win games in the Europa League. Everyone knows that, only the americans from the USA thinks their MLS players are semi-gods... mostly because they know nothing about football, Alexi Lalas is being punished every night by Zlatan and Titi because he's the worst pundit ever football has ever seen, a former Team USA international player, that tells a lot. Pulisic will be a way better pundit when he'll retire, because he knows what football really is, playing in Italy since a while now, Lalas has played 2 years in Padova, then back to the US, too much mediocre player according to the european standards.
I think you're replying to me, so here we go.

Basketball being more popular than table tennis is not an opinion - it's data. Its popularity in China is IN SPITE OF the CCP and CBA. I'm unsure if you're able to grasp the difference between a sport's popularity, participation, and general level of competency, but if your argument is based on the quailty of competition in the CBA, then please, get serious.

Idk what that whole rant about football is. All I said is youth participation is basically negligible, especially for a country of that size. They national team is a joke, and not even a funny one anymore.
 
Last edited:
Top