Butterfly Innerforce layer ALC or Butterfly Harimoto IF ALC

[steve888]

Hi,
I am looking at two blades - Butterfly Innerforce ALC & Butterfly Harimoto version, and wondering how they compare for speed, spin and control. Has anyone compared the two?

I have been reading reviews that say the Harimoto has a bigger head and that's the main difference and for some when put thick (2.1mm) rubbers on it for some people it can get a bit heavy as I have found on my Petr Korbel blade (bit head heavy). I have also read the Butterfly innerforce layer has been different thicknesses (older version 5.7/8mm and newer version 5.9/6.0mm), and the newer one been a bit stiffer and faster. Link: https://ttgearlab.com/2019/12/10/ho...-innerforce-layer-alc-comparison-by-lab-test/

Has anyone compared the newer innerforce layer alc and Harimoto blades? I like to have a lot of control like the Korbel especially for the close to the table game and also a bit more speed for away from the table. Are the blades stable, solid linear with many gears or more catipulty like a thinner Nitaku acoustic inner which seems less solid the Korbel and a bit too catapulty in the short game. Any feedback will help thanks.

Steve

 

[Denso]

Hi Steve,
I cannot comment on the Innerforce ALC, but I made the transition from the Japanese Korbel to the Harimoto ALC to gain more speed away from the table and I got everything I wished for. The Harimoto has a similar control close to the table and a few more gears away, and is built very well. I'd recommend to select a lower weight (<86 g).

The head heavyness of the Harimoto is basically the same as that of Korbel (at same blade and rubber weight). If that is too much for you, I reckon that the Innerforce ALC might be the better option.

 

[GOAT 🐐]

I suggest you go with the Harimoto zlc. It’s slightly slower and more like Korbel on low power and has better explosiveness and control high power. Harimoto alc just isn‘t good as you get to a higher level.

 

[ThePongCommenter]

Harimoto alc just isn‘t good as you get to a higher level.

It's been a popular choice among pros and top level amateurs for years, can you explain why it "just isn't good" as you get to a higher level?

 

[GOAT 🐐]

It's been a popular choice among pros and top level amateurs for years, can you explain why it "just isn't good" as you get to a higher level?

at least with H3, the core feels hard and the quality of ball isn’t really high. It’s very easy for opponents to block. It’s has a long and straight arc. Backhand is excellent whole the forehand is just not good. Low arc, medium spin, medium speed. After I used my W968 and switched to it, I had to put it down immediate because of how bad it is. Just my opinion tho

 

[Tyce]

So what you are saying is that it doesn't work that well with H3. Which makes sense, because that's not what Harimoto uses anyway.

 

[ThePongCommenter]

at least with H3, the core feels hard and the quality of ball isn’t really high. It’s very easy for opponents to block. It’s has a long and straight arc. Backhand is excellent whole the forehand is just not good. Low arc, medium spin, medium speed. After I used my W968 and switched to it, I had to put it down immediate because of how bad it is. Just my opinion tho

I'd agree its not the best blade for maximum quality nor the most powerful, it has a very high arc though and most people say it has a short rather than long arc hence why its better suited for those who stay closer to the table. Probably also not the best fit for H3.

You aren't a higher level though so I'm not sure why you think your personal experience means it "just isn't good" for higher level players when Tomokazu, Miwa, Mino, Assar, and many others at the pro and high amateur level have had success with it. Did your coach say that?

 

[mightymouse]

at least with H3, the core feels hard and the quality of ball isn’t really high. It’s very easy for opponents to block. It’s has a long and straight arc. Backhand is excellent whole the forehand is just not good. Low arc, medium spin, medium speed. After I used my W968 and switched to it, I had to put it down immediate because of how bad it is. Just my opinion tho

I see that your blade is W968 Ma Long Personal Blade.

Is it really Ma Long's blade?
Is that why BTY Harimoto felt inferior to your W968?

 

[GOAT 🐐]

I see that your blade is W968 Ma Long Personal Blade.

Is it really Ma Long's blade?
Is that why BTY Harimoto felt inferior to your W968?

It is his personal blade that my coach got out of the national team, he uses the same blade. Well I just didn’t like the Harimoto alc at all(no offense to people that like it), it’s just not a great blade. Arc is short and ball quality is not good. I think that BTY inner alc blades qren’t good, if yall like Harimoto go with Harimoto zlc, that blade was much better than the alc in my testing. I kinda found that surprising because I usually prefer alc fiber snd is huge fans of FZD alc and viscaria.

 

[steve888]

Hi,
An update , I ended up getting the Butterfly Innerforce Layer alc., 6mm at around 91g for a good price. I use Butterfly Sriver on backhand and normal Butterfly Glayzer in forehand. At first it felt a bit stiff, hard and a bit uncontrollable and fast. It seems to after about 5 hours play it soften a bit - a bit more feeling, less stiff and certainly more controllable. I am enjoying it now. Won two out of 3 matches with it last night.

I feel its a step up for the Nittaku acoustic inner in terms of speed and seems a bit more stable for counter hitting, better at blocking but a little less feeling and a touch less spin. Measured vibration at 1250 for Nittaku and 1390 for the innerforce blade. I was surprised of the difference.

A good racket at times a bit to fast but fantastic at blocking, serving, good at spin. Sometimes a little catapulty with Glayzer and I think Glayzer has a high arc too, so wondering whether to try Razka 7 wondering if the arc is lower? how it compares with Glayzer on this blade with control??

Thanks for everyone's input thus far.
Steve

 

[po-stit]

I don't know if you already bough a Rakza 7, but when i tested a glayzer i tough it was really bouncy, mainly on backhand. I would say almost as bouncy as Tenergy. Rakza 7, albeit i tested in i a much slower all wood blade, i think its not as much catapulty as glayzer.

 

[TTprofessional]

The Innerforce alc is better balanced and it pairs better with different rubbers otherwise very little difference except head size and handle shape.

 

[Chr75]

Does the feel of the handle differ significantly between the Harimoto ALC and the Innerforce ALC?

 

[MOG]

Personally I hated the Innerforce ALC after initially liking it.
It feels muted sometimes but is fast. I think it is a really overrated not particularly pleasant blade at all.
It was awful with Tenergy 05fx.
It was ok with Victas Sticky soft but hen was too slow.
It was ok fairly decent with Waran 2 pips on bh.
For context I have generally preferred wood blades or 7 ply woods or more recently the Yasaka Ma Lin Carbon.
Currently using a Yasaka Goiabao and trying a Hina Hayata H2 which has loads more feeling.

If you like carbon and its disconnect my guess is you will like either.
What blade are you coming from.

I'm known as an EJ but tried the IF ALC for 3 months and hated at the end.
My friend tried it how is a good all-round attacking player and he did not like it either. He thought it lacked feeling too.

It is quite a balanced blade overall, but I think there are better blades around tbh.

 

[rbtitco]

It is his personal blade that my coach got out of the national team, he uses the same blade. Well I just didn’t like the Harimoto alc at all(no offense to people that like it), it’s just not a great blade. Arc is short and ball quality is not good. I think that BTY inner alc blades qren’t good, if yall like Harimoto go with Harimoto zlc, that blade was much better than the alc in my testing. I kinda found that surprising because I usually prefer alc fiber snd is huge fans of FZD alc and viscaria.

I agree, it didnt seem like anything special when i hit with one, couldve been a rubber mismatch, but i would rather use w968 if i went inner any day. The zlc could be interesting tho.

 

[LucasHoang2013]

is actually have the exact same design in its core. The largest difference is probably harimoto innerforce alc is a little heavier due to its size( a little bigger towards the head), and harimoto's hanlde design looks a lot cooler