Help - Rubbers for Xiom Hayabusa ZL Pro

[Hikarupin]

Hey everyone, I want to change the rubbers on my Hayabusa ZL Pro but I'm having a hard time understanding what to choose, I'll give some context. I've been training for 3 years with coaching, this year I joined a club and started playing my local league, I would consider myself an advanced begginner or low intermediate.
Late last year I upgraded to the blade in the title, Hayabusa ZL Pro and I'm currently using Fastarc G-1 for FH and C-1 for BH, these are the same rubbers that I've been using for the past 2 years. I want to get a hybrid tacky or semi tacky rubber for my forehand since I want to generate more spin in my loops and my serve and don't really care about more speed, but I was also advised against getting harder rubbers, and most of the hybrids seems to be on the harder side.

What would be your recommendations for medium soft<->medium hard hybrid rubbers? I've been considering:

1. Bluegrip C2 (but it seems way harder than G1 on paper and for advanced players)
2. Dynaryz ZGR (same issue as C2, also warned about donic rubbers lasting 2 months)
3. Xiom Vega Pro or Europe H (the only medium soft ones I found that seemed to fit the bill)

I don't really care about longevity, I know Fastarc G1 is supposed to be the king in that regard, but I wan't to try an european rubber with some tackiness.

Thanks!

 

[chinacurious]

I liked the combo of ZL Pro and Rakza Z a lot. Played it on backhand though.

 

[Hikarupin]

I liked the combo of ZL Pro and Rakza Z a lot. Played it on backhand though

How hard is that rubber compared to G1?

 

[spino]

Late last year I upgraded to the blade in the title, Hayabusa ZL Pro and I'm currently using Fastarc G-1 for FH and C-1 for BH, these are the same rubbers that I've been using for the past 2 years.

I'm also interested in this blade, how does it perform with G-1 in terms of speed and spin? Can you compare this blade with others that you have played?
I heard someone who said that this blade pairs well with softer rubbers, so is C-1 more spiny than with other blades? Any other impressions? I want this blade, I just hope it is fast enough for me - currently my YSE feels slow.

 

[Doppelschlag]

Did you come to any conclusion or tests?

 

[imbadatlooping]

I second the Rakza Z recommendation. I actually play with the Xiom Hayabusa ZL Pro with Rakza Z on FH and Xiom Vega X on BH. These rubbers suit very well for this blade. Its a looping monster and everything just magically goes on the table for me. The Rakza Z allows me to play more aggressively. If your looking to upgrade the backhand as well, i totally recommend Vega X (which I've heard is pretty much the same to Vega Pro). You cant go wrong with Rakza Z or Vega X on this blade.

Also, anyone correct me if I'm wrong, but with this type of blade since its soft and flexible, wouldn't harder rubbers feel softer to play with? I get that feeling a lot that Rakza Z feels softer on this blade than it probably would with a harder/stiff blade. The Rakza Z i would say is advanced beginner friendly lol. Just something to keep in mind.

I'm also Advanced Beginner barely Low intermediate (1100 USATT) and play with this setup. Even though I'm no expert, i don't think it would hurt to go for a little harder rubbers. G1 is already 47 degrees. Hybrids probably best since its best of both worlds as far as spin, speed, and control. This setup has allowed me to be more aggressive and act on instinct since i don't have to worry to much about if my shot is going to go on the table or not. Backhand corner step around to forehand for a loop is something I've never had the confidence to do until i started playing with this setup. At the end of the day, its subjective. A coaches recommendation is much more valuable then mine, but i hope this helps in the slightest.

 

[Hikarupin]

I'm also interested in this blade, how does it perform with G-1 in terms of speed and spin? Can you compare this blade with others that you have played?
I heard someone who said that this blade pairs well with softer rubbers, so is C-1 more spiny than with other blades? Any other impressions? I want this blade, I just hope it is fast enough for me - currently my YSE feels slow.

I think it's a great blade, specially at its price point. My blade path was YSE -> SK7 -> Hayabusa ZL PRO and recently I upgraded to Hugo HAL. But honestly I think price/performance the Hayabusa ZL Pro is better than Hugo HAL.

Fastarc C1 on the backhand with Hayabusa ZL Pro wasn't "more spinny" to be honest, but it felt super controlled.

 

[Hikarupin]

Did you come to any conclusion or tests?

I finally ended up using Victas V15 Sticky Soft this season and I'm loving it, really really good. My looping has improved, specially opening up backspin balls during games. The only issue is durability, since Fastarc G1 lasted like 8 months and the V15 Sticky Soft is already on its last legs after only 4 months.
On the backhand I'm regretting my choice, I went with Xiom Vega Korea since I read good reviews and I thought it would be similar to Fastarc C1 but the latter is WAY better, specially for pushing the ball. Pushes with the Vega Korea tend to fly high for me, it's strange. I'm definitely going to keep the soft hybrid on the FH even with the durability issues, but for BH I'm either going back to C1 or trying something else like Rasanter 42 or maybe NUZN 45 for double hybrid.

 

[Hikarupin]

I second the Rakza Z recommendation. I actually play with the Xiom Hayabusa ZL Pro with Rakza Z on FH and Xiom Vega X on BH. These rubbers suit very well for this blade. Its a looping monster and everything just magically goes on the table for me. The Rakza Z allows me to play more aggressively. If your looking to upgrade the backhand as well, i totally recommend Vega X (which I've heard is pretty much the same to Vega Pro). You cant go wrong with Rakza Z or Vega X on this blade.

Also, anyone correct me if I'm wrong, but with this type of blade since its soft and flexible, wouldn't harder rubbers feel softer to play with? I get that feeling a lot that Rakza Z feels softer on this blade than it probably would with a harder/stiff blade. The Rakza Z i would say is advanced beginner friendly lol. Just something to keep in mind.

I'm also Advanced Beginner barely Low intermediate (1100 USATT) and play with this setup. Even though I'm no expert, i don't think it would hurt to go for a little harder rubbers. G1 is already 47 degrees. Hybrids probably best since its best of both worlds as far as spin, speed, and control. This setup has allowed me to be more aggressive and act on instinct since i don't have to worry to much about if my shot is going to go on the table or not. Backhand corner step around to forehand for a loop is something I've never had the confidence to do until i started playing with this setup. At the end of the day, its subjective. A coaches recommendation is much more valuable then mine, but i hope this helps in the slightest.

Thanks, Rakza Z has been on my radar since forever but people in my club spoke against it, so I ended up going for a newer softer hybrid, Victas V15 Sticky Soft, although it's not really sticky. I'm still thinking about trying Rakza Z, even though it is harder on paper (50º vs 47º). Is Rakza Z really as sticky as the reviews say? Because V15 Sticky Soft is not sticky at all, it can't lift the ball off the table at all.

 

[ToH]

I use this blade with Stiga Helix m on both side. Its a relative slow blade with the Helix rubber, but enough speed when you hit hard. Stiga Helix on bh is the best i have ever tried. So much control and spin. Short game is also awesome.

 

[Scarfed Garchomp]

Thanks, Rakza Z has been on my radar since forever but people in my club spoke against it, so I ended up going for a newer softer hybrid, Victas V15 Sticky Soft, although it's not really sticky. I'm still thinking about trying Rakza Z, even though it is harder on paper (50º vs 47º). Is Rakza Z really as sticky as the reviews say? Because V15 Sticky Soft is not sticky at all, it can't lift the ball off the table at all.

RZ is indeed pretty sticky. Not as sticky as some old school Chinese rubbers but you hardly see that level of tack anymore. It also doesn't really feel full on 50 degrees because the topsheet is pretty soft but you feel it in terms of hitting in to the sponge and trying to extract speed from the rubber, in all honesty I don't think RZ is very fast.

I use this blade with Stiga Helix m on both side. Its a relative slow blade with the Helix rubber, but enough speed when you hit hard. Stiga Helix on bh is the best i have ever tried. So much control and spin. Short game is also awesome.

I am also really impressed with Helix M. Its fast but not crazy bouncy, and it feels like it makes a ton of spin without being that sensitive. I am still testing the H and XH versions, I haven't meshed with them as well as the M

 

[Doppelschlag]

I think it's a great blade, specially at its price point. My blade path was YSE -> SK7 -> Hayabusa ZL PRO and recently I upgraded to Hugo HAL. But honestly I think price/performance the Hayabusa ZL Pro is better than Hugo HAL.

Fastarc C1 on the backhand with Hayabusa ZL Pro wasn't "more spinny" to be honest, but it felt super controlled.

How would you describe the differences between ZL Pro and Hugo HAL – in feel, performance, speed, dwell, looping and in general – not taking price into account? (Considering ZL Pro as backup to HAL.)

 

[imbadatlooping]

Thanks, Rakza Z has been on my radar since forever but people in my club spoke against it, so I ended up going for a newer softer hybrid, Victas V15 Sticky Soft, although it's not really sticky. I'm still thinking about trying Rakza Z, even though it is harder on paper (50º vs 47º). Is Rakza Z really as sticky as the reviews say? Because V15 Sticky Soft is not sticky at all, it can't lift the ball off the table at all.

Rakza Z isn't as sticky as like DHS Hurricane 3 or any other Chinese tacky rubber, but it does indeed have some level of stick to it and has some good grip as well to help spin the ball. It has enough stick for me to press down on it and lift, making the ball stay on my racket for a second or two before falling. Also, I agree with what @Scarfed Garchomp said, on paper its hard but in reality it does feel a little softer unless your hitting through the sponge and getting more speed into it. I feel like just like any rubber, Rakza Z has the capability to be fast if your technique is correct and you put more waist and hip rotation into your shots, but its still has amazing control since its not as fast as like dignics 09c for example.

 

[Hikarupin]

How would you describe the differences between ZL Pro and Hugo HAL – in feel, performance, speed, dwell, looping and in general – not taking price into account? (Considering ZL Pro as backup to HAL.)

I think they are similar blades, the first thing I noticed when switching is that Hayabusa felt more like my previous wooden blades, where Hugo felt more artificial and kind of hollow feeling, but after some time you don't really notice it to be honest. In terms of dwell, both are good, but maybe Hayabusa is just slightly ahead. Both are similar in speed and looping, they play quite similar to me. I think the main difference is feeling, also the handle of the Hayabusa is a tad smaller than the Hugo.
Another good thing is that the Hayabusa is available (at least in tt11) from very light weights, <80, so in my case I got an 82 gram one to avoid having an overly heavy blade overall. The Hugo HAL I got it at 85 grams when it was back in stock after the reissue, and since it is a heavily sought after blade I don't know how long stock will last.
I'm doing exactly what you intend to do, keeping the Hayabusa as a backup, since blades of these charateristics are hard to find.

 

[Doppelschlag]

I think they are similar blades, the first thing I noticed when switching is that Hayabusa felt more like my previous wooden blades, where Hugo felt more artificial and kind of hollow feeling, but after some time you don't really notice it to be honest. In terms of dwell, both are good, but maybe Hayabusa is just slightly ahead. Both are similar in speed and looping, they play quite similar to me. I think the main difference is feeling, also the handle of the Hayabusa is a tad smaller than the Hugo.
Another good thing is that the Hayabusa is available (at least in tt11) from very light weights, <80, so in my case I got an 82 gram one to avoid having an overly heavy blade overall. The Hugo HAL I got it at 85 grams when it was back in stock after the reissue, and since it is a heavily sought after blade I don't know how long stock will last.
I'm doing exactly what you intend to do, keeping the Hayabusa as a backup, since blades of these charateristics are hard to find.

Thanks. Your experience is in accordance with Ttgearlab. However, he also states that Zl Pro will always feel (and be) faster than Hugo HAL, is that also your feeling?

 

[Hikarupin]

Thanks. Your experience is in accordance with Ttgearlab. However, he also states that Zl Pro will always feel (and be) faster than Hugo HAL, is that also your feeling?

I also follow TTGearLab and I think they are great, best out there for in-depth info, but also go very "by the book" sometimes. I guess they are stating that the Hayabusa is faster because the primary elasticity index for the Hayabusa is 1.67 and for the Hugo HAL it's 1.62, so since EP is related to rebound speed they might be saying that the maximum potential for the Hayabusa is higher (very slightly higher I think, based on the minimal EP differerence) than the Hugo HAL. But in practice I believe this quite impossible to feel for the average player, maybe a pro can tell the difference in speed between the two.

I think both blades aren't slow by any means, but at the same time aren't speed demons, this is why I was interested in them in the first place, I didn't care for more and more speed (my club mates were going for viscarias at the time), I wanted a blade that was fast enough but controllable that I could use for a long time and don't have to "upgrade" ever again (or at least for a long long time).
So no, I don't feel that one is faster than the other, you have your technical answer by TTGearLab that the Hayabusa can be marginally faster given certain conditions, and even each blade produced is slightly different than the next one, so you can have a "slower" hayabusa and a "faster" hugo hal. I think they are similar in terms of speed, even with Hugo being of outer carbon composition and the hayabusa inner.