I’m thinking about training in Germany

[Yurifi]

What you are saying isn't any different than what others are saying about ratings - its just how the USA equates what you are saying to roughly a 2500 level.

it's completely different. results are what matters. with that results you gather points, which then put you on table. like the kid wishes to - to be top 100 players, playing a lot of tournaments will get him there, not getting up to some level ...

and as I explained in the past. mini tournament with two juniors and me. one junior is top 4 player. the other one is top 10 player. T4 and T10 play each other. T4 wins. T4 plays with me. I win with him easily. then I play with T10 and we have a grueling match where he barely wins. how can you set a level? hard. but you can count the sets and establish who is the best in the group. if you follow me ...

 

[ThePongCommenter]

it's completely different. results are what matters. with that results you gather points, which then put you on table. like the kid wishes to - to be top 100 players, playing a lot of tournaments will get him there, not getting up to some level ...

and as I explained in the past. mini tournament with two juniors and me. one junior is top 4 player. the other one is top 10 player. T4 and T10 play each other. T4 wins. T4 plays with me. I win with him easily. then I play with T10 and we have a grueling match where he barely wins. how can you set a level? hard. but you can count the sets and establish who is the best in the group. if you follow me ...

I'm confused. Do you think that someone gets to 2500 by not "winning some nice tournaments with good opposition"?

 

[piligrim]

it's completely different. results are what matters. with that results you gather points, which then put you on table. like the kid wishes to - to be top 100 players, playing a lot of tournaments will get him there, not getting up to some level ...

and as I explained in the past. mini tournament with two juniors and me. one junior is top 4 player. the other one is top 10 player. T4 and T10 play each other. T4 wins. T4 plays with me. I win with him easily. then I play with T10 and we have a grueling match where he barely wins. how can you set a level? hard. but you can count the sets and establish who is the best in the group. if you follow me ...

Its when Faraji beat WCQ?

 

[Yurifi]

I'm confused. Do you think that someone gets to 2500 by not "winning some nice tournaments with good opposition"?

honestly, I do not even know how the system works. as far as I know it is measured by who you compete against and who you beat and who you lose against. that's why I gave my example when we played, so i.e. T4 and T10 are 2000 and 2400 players and I am 1900. so after our matches, what are the levels? also, we play next week and I beat them both and suddenly I am 2500 player? and then lose after 2 weeks and I am again 1900 player? it's confusing. winning "regional California Open Juniors Tournament" isn't as confusing ... at least to me. but it is true that in Europe, we never dealt with ratings. yes, leaderboards, based on accumulating points during the season, but not ratings, if you understand me.

 

[Yurifi]

Its when Faraji beat WCQ?

yes, nice example, too ... so, what, he is suddenly rated 2800? and the next time they play and i.e., loses, he is back to his previous rating? that's what I am talking about.

 

[KTableTennis]

You would not go back to your previous rating if you are 1900 and won against a 2000 then 2400 the a few weeks later you lose to them both you would still be above 2000

 

[piligrim]

yes, nice example, too ... so, what, he is suddenly rated 2800? and the next time they play and i.e., loses, he is back to his previous rating? that's what I am talking about.

According to your logic Faraj can look for club to play telling them he beat WCQ

 

[Yurifi]

According to your logic Faraj can look for club to play telling them he beat WCQ

I am pretty sure that he got on the radar of some of them … 😉

 

[piligrim]

I am pretty sure that he got on the radar of some of them … 😉

He didn't win many tournaments. Maybe just few youth contenders ...
He very talented no doubt

 

[Tony's Table Tennis]

it's completely different. results are what matters. with that results you gather points, which then put you on table. like the kid wishes to - to be top 100 players, playing a lot of tournaments will get him there, not getting up to some level ...

and as I explained in the past. mini tournament with two juniors and me. one junior is top 4 player. the other one is top 10 player. T4 and T10 play each other. T4 wins. T4 plays with me. I win with him easily. then I play with T10 and we have a grueling match where he barely wins. how can you set a level? hard. but you can count the sets and establish who is the best in the group. if you follow me ...

I have to disagree with you in your statement of "not getting up to some level".
while your example of 3 way win/loss is possible in table tennis, you can't expect the kid to stay at one level, and then play 100 tournaments and expect him to just not loose points and but only gain in points.

he could play 100 tournaments and win nothing in 90 of them.
based on USATT rating rules, he will loose points and he could end up the year with less points than he has.

from professional coaching, we will want to up the level before going into competition.
This is why you won't see U13 players or U11 players taking part in WTT from Taiwan, or many east Asian countries.
while competition experience is good, level gain at this age group should be the core.
Not everyone is like the Harimotos, reach "senior level" levels by 12 years old.

and since we talking about USATT rating points, the level is set based on the points gain/loss.
in Taiwan, we don't have points, but we have national team levels, and we have enough players that taken part in US Open or other US tournaments to know what kind of level equates to what rating points.
When your data is bigger, it will be more accurate, right now you are a 3 player data....

 

[Tony's Table Tennis]

in Europe, we never dealt with ratings. yes, leaderboards, based on accumulating points during the season, but not ratings, if you understand me.

one of the top systems in Europe deals with rating, for example, in Germany, there is TTR rating, it takes in performance from German leagues and ITTF/WTT.

a 2600 USATT is about 2300 TTR
TTR I would say is more accurate in the "higher level", due to its bigger data (ie there are many players from 2300 to 2600), while in USA, 2600+ becomes a minority and data is not accurate.

German TTR measures all players that played internationally - so you may not have played in German leagues, but the players would have TTR points gathered from WTT/ITTF matches.

 

[Tony's Table Tennis]

He didn't win many tournaments. Maybe just few youth contenders ...
He very talented no doubt

that kid is closer towards a one hit wonder than anyone else I know.
one tournament, he went from a kid, and didn't become an adult, he became a giant.
then he went back to become a kid.

many of our "beatable" U15 national kids from Taiwan can beat him straights (after his giant performance), but can't touch senior players like that one hit wonder did.

The kid does have a future though, and it will be very interesting what he can become in the next few years.

 

[backspacer]

According to your logic Faraj can look for club to play telling them he beat WCQ

He will play 2. Bundesliga for Velbert in the upcoming season in Germany.

 

[Metaxa]

For this how would I book training for many many months?

Write them an e-mail! Explain them what you want/prefer.

 

[Yurifi]

I have to disagree with you in your statement of "not getting up to some level".
while your example of 3 way win/loss is possible in table tennis, you can't expect the kid to stay at one level, and then play 100 tournaments and expect him to just not loose points and but only gain in points.

he could play 100 tournaments and win nothing in 90 of them.
based on USATT rating rules, he will loose points and he could end up the year with less points than he has.

from professional coaching, we will want to up the level before going into competition.
This is why you won't see U13 players or U11 players taking part in WTT from Taiwan, or many east Asian countries.
while competition experience is good, level gain at this age group should be the core.
Not everyone is like the Harimotos, reach "senior level" levels by 12 years old.

and since we talking about USATT rating points, the level is set based on the points gain/loss.
in Taiwan, we don't have points, but we have national team levels, and we have enough players that taken part in US Open or other US tournaments to know what kind of level equates to what rating points.
When your data is bigger, it will be more accurate, right now you are a 3 player data....

I think we didn't understand each other - firstly, I am not talking about him getting into WTT tour immediately, of course no. attend smaller tournaments. local, if you please. then advance to regional. and then maybe national. in his own category, of course, maybe a category higher, to get some more experience. this is what we did, and our country is very very small. but we did school championship organised like this - first, local, municipality. best 4 from the municipality go into city or regional. and again, best qualify for nationals. but that was a bit different level, yes, nationals were usually the same suspects as in the tournaments for national ranking. but it was a good system, and top 10 in the ranking usually got called into national selection and then during camps they would choose the members of the national selection. and those would go on bigger international tournaments, European Youth Championships and similar.

of course he has to be getting up in level. he has to practice and grow as a player. we didn't have these rating systems and we went by just fine. I think it can also be a distraction. unnecessary pressure. "I won't make it if I don't get to a certain USATT rating" ... no, first try to get to the top of your category. try to get into national selections. so you can attend international competitions. this is where you can get spotted if you are a talent. which is what our kid here is basically trying to do.

 

[pong99]

It's good to not obsess about ratings in general.

However, OP does need to see ratings improvement as a benchmark for progress. There is also seeding in big tourneys.

For example, if you enter the US Nationals in the U15, there is a qualification round where players are seeded in groups of 4. If your rating is too low you will be seeded #2 in your group, which means you must beat the number one seed to advance into the main draw. This doesn't happen often.

The last U15 at nationals had 33 qualifier groups. If you can't make it out of the qualifier, you are not even top 33 in your age group. This is a reality check.

 

[BlopChock]

It's good to not obsess about ratings in general.

However, OP does need to see ratings improvement as a benchmark for progress. There is also seeding in big tourneys.

For example, if you enter the US Nationals in the U15, there is a qualification round where players are seeded in groups of 4. If your rating is too low you will be seeded #2 in your group, which means you must beat the number one seed to advance into the main draw. This doesn't happen often.

The last U15 at nationals had 33 qualifier groups. If you can't make it out of the qualifier, you are not even top 33 in your age group. This is a reality check.

In the most recent U15B US Nationals, #33 was ranked 2065. The top 20 were >2200, seeds 6-2 were 2305-2388, and #1 was 2487

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[Tony's Table Tennis]

In the most recent U15B US Nationals, #33 was ranked 2065. The top 20 were >2200, seeds 6-2 were 2305-2388, and #1 was 2487

STADIUM. Competition Software.

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and the kids wants to go for WR50, so needs to be number 1 in USA first.

agree on the seeding for groups,
you don't want to be the 3rd or 4th (lowest) player in that group, and all your opponent are way stronger than you.
if you are about 2000~2100, you could be a seed in your group
but if you are 1900~2000 you might only be 2nd best, and would have someone higher than you.

With our kid, he was under rated, due to not living in the USA (no chance to update ratings), and one time he was put in the group with the 1st seed, which was 2400.
He should be over 2000, and could take his a seed in a group and shouldn't be in the top seeds group, so seeding is so important in national trials or any competition (of course ktt is not yet ready to be talking about trials yet).

 

[ThePongCommenter]

Another one I was looking at is Eslöv table tennis academy. I am going to first work on getting to a higher level like 2300-2400 then I will write them an email to train there. Is that good?

Academy - Eslövs AI BTK

eaibtk.se

Might be worth writing an email now to them with your long term goals and plans and see what they say about the possibility and requirements of you joining so you have a more clear idea what you need to aim for

 

[Tony's Table Tennis]

Academy - Eslövs AI BTK

eaibtk.se

Might be worth writing an email now to them with your long term goals and plans and see what they say about the possibility and requirements of you joining so you have a more clear idea what you need to aim for

i've stop bothered answering some questions posted from that kid.

of that post I would reply a big no and it is a bad idea (you I see are still being very patience about it lol), since he could be 20 years old by the time he gets to 2300-2400 and there will be no purpose to even train full time as his goal will then be to try and get top 50 in the USA and he would probably fail in that too.

its impossible to speak to people who don't understand that the earlier you start, the more possible to get some where (and we sure not even talking top 200 in the world). I mean, why wait to you are 15, why wait till you get to 2300 or 2400? and this is why, you/we alll need to be speaking to the parent of this kid lol.

My conclusion is, this kid doesn't understand that you can't afford to waste time if you set very big goals, especially if you are a super late starter as he is and the age between 8 to 13 is the most important to determine your peak ability.

I'm sure he probably read too many cinderella stories and not enough table tennis life journey stories.
and certainly, he isn't grasping this from his current resource group as well as his time on TTD.