LF: Butterfly Amultart

This user has no status.
Hi Pablo,
If it's for playing you can take a Garaydia ZLC, it is exactely the same. easier to find as they still have stock in Butterfly.

Hi Gwenved,

Thanks for your suggestion, I just found out that Amultart has been discontinued. Too bad I haven't played/tried a Garaydia ZLC, is it really exactly the same in terms of feel? Cause from what I know Garaydia has a Balsa core while Amultart has Kiri.
 
This user has no status.
Hi Gwenved,

Thanks for your suggestion, I just found out that Amultart has been discontinued. Too bad I haven't played/tried a Garaydia ZLC, is it really exactly the same in terms of feel? Cause from what I know Garaydia has a Balsa core while Amultart has Kiri.
It's the same, hinoki, zlc, kiri, zlc, hinoki, 7.1mm both.
 
  • Like
Reactions: LemuTheGreat
says Visited my own profile, woop woop. ;)
says Visited my own profile, woop woop. ;)
Active Member
Nov 2014
508
267
1,145
Read 6 reviews
29
Lemu. I greatly encourage you to try buying Xvt Zlz hinoki. It's the identical composition of amultart with a 90% similarity And significantly cheaper.
Yes it's slightly slower, but also easier to control. And the spin is beast.
I bought my two blades here: 37usd
https://a.aliexpress.com/_d9e4tnF
I recommend you ask for the lightest one.. Because the heavy once.. Are a bit too heavy imo, 90-95grams being the lightest (unless you like that) amultart is 85-95 also. So the closer to that the more accurate.
I'm certain you'll like it :D


Edit: while garadya has a balsa core. This one has a kiri core like amultart. Not to mention garadya is 140usd...
 
Last edited:
says Visited my own profile, woop woop. ;)
says Visited my own profile, woop woop. ;)
Active Member
Nov 2014
508
267
1,145
Read 6 reviews
29
It's the same, hinoki, zlc, kiri, zlc, hinoki, 7.1mm both.
btw, don't mean to duplicate messages in a row... (sorry) but how do you know?
Since the sources I check in with (like revspin) says it (garadya zlc) has a balsa core... all sources inclusive, tt blades and tabletennisblades.com says ALC has kiri core, but tt blades says nothing on zlc and tabletennisblades.com says zlc has balsa core as well.
Hence I don't think this is right.
 
Last edited:
This user has no status.
btw, don't mean to duplicate messages in a row... (sorry) but how do you know?
Since the sources I check in with (like revspin) says it (garadya zlc) has a balsa core... all sources inclusive, tt blades and tabletennisblades.com says ALC has kiri core, but tt blades says nothing on zlc and tabletennisblades.com says zlc has balsa core as well.
Hence I don't think this is right.
Hi Kaizoku,
The 3 Garaydia blade have the same 3 layers wood, which is Hinoki, Special material, Kiri ( Kiri which is the same as Paulownia), special layer and hinoki, the only thing who change is the thickness and the 2 special layers ALC, ZLC or Tamca 5000. I've the 3 in front of me by the way so I can easily control it apart the video from Butterfly from where I have my informations.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RinNL6qPytk
Unfortunetaly I'm right so please make your conclusions.
Regards
 
This user has no status.
Lemu. I greatly encourage you to try buying Xvt Zlz hinoki. It's the identical composition of amultart with a 90% similarity And significantly cheaper.
Yes it's slightly slower, but also easier to control. And the spin is beast.
I bought my two blades here: 37usd
https://a.aliexpress.com/_d9e4tnF
I recommend you ask for the lightest one.. Because the heavy once.. Are a bit too heavy imo, 90-95grams being the lightest (unless you like that) amultart is 85-95 also. So the closer to that the more accurate.
I'm certain you'll like it :D


Edit: while garadya has a balsa core. This one has a kiri core like amultart. Not to mention garadya is 140usd...
Hi Kaizoku,
By the way if you're looking carefully the blade from your link you'll see clearly it is not an Amultart clone as claimed, as it has 5 wood layers like an innerforce when Amultart only has 3.... apart the fact the special material looks blue and not yellow so should be more alc than zlc. So it should be absolutely different as Amultart / Garaydia in terms of feeling, speed and control.
Regards
 
says Visited my own profile, woop woop. ;)
says Visited my own profile, woop woop. ;)
Active Member
Nov 2014
508
267
1,145
Read 6 reviews
29
Hi Kaizoku,
By the way if you're looking carefully the blade from your link you'll see clearly it is not an Amultart clone as claimed, as it has 5 wood layers like an innerforce when Amultart only has 3.... apart the fact the special material looks blue and not yellow so should be more alc than zlc. So it should be absolutely different as Amultart / Garaydia in terms of feeling, speed and control.
Regards

A couple of things. Regarding XVT Zlc hinoki.
It seems odd.. because, while you're right on the pictures.
My copy does not seem to have two layers before the zlc... I looked up close and I can't see any hint of a two layered top ply on my version... maybe it used to be and they changed, or maybe I have miss comprehended something. Either-way, I want to get to the bottom of this.
I also sent a message to the company (the link) I bought both of my blades from, so I hope it will get cleared up. I'll also edit in a picture of my own version. Which really looks like a one ply.


Regarding the Garadya (which also seems to be discontinued...), I kept looking in, and the more I research, the more convinced I am that it's a thick balsa core and not a kiri core.
Even from that video it just says all are the same... how do you know it's a kiri core and not balsa core for all?
Idk, but I found UpSideDownCarl referencing this Garadya blade with a balsa core, here;
https://www.tabletennisdaily.com/forum/showthread.php?14873-Off-blade-inspiration
Sent him a message to ask his take.
cache.php

The line you're seeing is btw only sandpapering, not another ply.
 
Last edited:
This user has no status.
Interesting, I’m gonna check out the XVT Hinoki ZL.

From what I know, Garaydia and Amultart have different cores based on some discussion years ago. At the same time, based on Revspin, tt reference it does say that Garaydia ZLC has Balsa and Amultart has Kiri as core.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
  • Like
Reactions: Kaizoku
This user has no status.
This user has no status.
Well-Known Member
Dec 2011
1,389
2,159
3,988
The core on the Garadya series is Kiri. Fortunately Butterfly has very good quality so it's easy to identify by the grain pattern just looking at the pictures.

Regarding your XVT blade, the fiber has a pale yellow color, much more like Aramid than Zylon.
 
This user has no status.
Thanks hipnotic, that's crazy to see how people trust more some forums or youtubers or discussions years ago than the official factory/brand comunication about their products. Surely Butterfly as no idea about what they're producing and their marketing department's making what they want?
Come on Lemu, you're wrong accept it. By the way as said I own the complete Garaydia family and both of them have the same wood layers even if the core thickness is different.
End of the game for me.
Regards
 
says Visited my own profile, woop woop. ;)
says Visited my own profile, woop woop. ;)
Active Member
Nov 2014
508
267
1,145
Read 6 reviews
29
Thanks hipnotic, that's crazy to see how people trust more some forums or youtubers or discussions years ago than the official factory/brand comunication about their products. Surely Butterfly as no idea about what they're producing and their marketing department's making what they want?
Come on Lemu, you're wrong accept it. By the way as said I own the complete Garaydia family and both of them have the same wood layers even if the core thickness is different.
End of the game for me.
Regards

Tbh, I don't accept either, it's begging the question of how your source is more credible. Because I can't see anything in your source claiming it's kiri OR balsa.
I'm not convinced of either atm. Maybe it's kiri, maybe it's balsa, or maybe they even changed up production at some point and that would explain the controversies.
I'm looking at pictures and I can't say I'm qualified enough to see the difference. Sometimes it looks like balsa, other times more like kiri.
and butterfly? man, they're not even revealing the type of woods. Just saying "It's special" great, is kiri or balsa more special, idk. I sent them a message also. Not really expecting anything though.

Regarding the XVT composite, I would ask them, but they're clearly marketing for ZLC so I 90% likely wouldn't get anything IF it was something else.
I did however look up Zylon Carbon and this color does seem similar to the one in my blade, and I would agree aramid looks similar also, but I'm not a composite expert really. So I can't say;
https://www.alibaba.com/product-det...spm=a2700.7724857.normalList.1.53b412ccBimDuM

But yeah, I'll leave it at that until I get any feedback from the sources I've messaged.
Peace.
 
says Spin and more spin.
says Spin and more spin.
Well-Known Member
Super Moderator
Dec 2010
16,172
17,750
54,907
Read 11 reviews
@Kaizoku, I have not had any of the Garaydia blades in my hand since they first came out. My memory is not so good as to know for sure what I held in my hand 4 or so years ago. So, I cannot really answer the question and have a legitimate answer. I have seen Butterfly with a series of blades where the core of one is different. But it is not the norm.

And if you have someone who has the blade in his hand and he is asserting that the core of his two Garaydia blades both have the same wood for the core, and it is Kiri, then it is sort of hard to argue. And the person would have to have a bad eye for seeing and feeling different woods. Balsa and Kiri would not look exactly alike. They should also play slightly different. But it should not make too big a deal.

As for the accuracy of Butterfly's statements about their products....for well over a decade Butterfly listed that the core of a Viscaria was Balsa. At one point it may have been. But it definitely is not any longer. And for a very long time that was listed while the core of the Viscaria was definitely not Balsa. TableTennisDB which is now RevSpin also had it listed that Viscaria had a Balsa core. I see they no longer have that listed either. So there are times when the ply construction of a blade, listed on the internet is not correct.

And it is entirely possible that, when I listed the construction for the Garaydia ZLC, I took it from a site that listed the core as Balsa. Since that post is long enough ago.

So, I don't know for sure what the core of a Garaydia ZLC is. And I would have to have one in my hand to say definitively. But since Gwneved says he has one in his hand, we may as well assume he would be able to tell the difference between Kiri and Balsa. I am not sure those differences are worth the bother of the debate if you don't also have the blade in your hand, or, really, even if you did.

The difference in play between a Primorac Cabon and a Schlager Carbon is not sooooo big. They are more similar than they are different even though, it looks like one had a Kiri core and one had a Balsa core. Without those in my hand I still could not tell you that for sure though. So, why go down this road.
 
Last edited:
This user has no status.
@Kaizoku, I have not had any of the Garaydia blades in my hand since they first came out. My memory is not so good as to know for sure what I held in my hand 4 or so years ago. So, I cannot really answer the question and have a legitimate answer. I have seen Butterfly with a series of blades where the core of one is different. But it is not the norm.

And if you have someone who has the blade in his hand and he is asserting that the core of his two Garaydia blades both have the same wood for the core, and it is Kiri, then it is sort of hard to argue. And the person would have to have a bad eye for seeing and feeling different woods. Balsa and Kiri would not look exactly alike. They should also play slightly different. But it should not make too big a deal.

As for the accuracy of Butterfly's statements about there products....for well over a decade Butterfly listed that the core of a Viscaria was Balsa. At one point it may have been. But it definitely is not any longer. And for a very long time that was listed while the core of the Viscaria was definitely not Balsa. TableTennisDB which is now RevSpin also had it listed that Viscaria had a Balsa core. I see they no longer have that listed either. So there are times when the ply construction of a blade, listed on the internet is not correct.

And it is entirely possible that, when I listed the construction for the Garaydia ZLC, I took it from a site that listed the core as Balsa. Since that post is long enough ago.

So, I don't know for sure what the core of a Garaydia ZLC is. And I would have to have one in my hand to say definitively. But since Gwneved says he has one in his hand, we may as well assume he would be able to tell the difference between Kiri and Balsa. I am not sure those differences are worth the bother of the debate if you don't also have the blade in your hand, or, really, even if you did.

The difference in play between a Primorac Cabon and a Schlager Carbon is not sooooo big. They are more similar than they are different even though, it looks like one had a Kiri core and one had a Balsa core. Without those in my hand I still could not tell you that for sure though. So, why go down this road.

What's terrible is the link I placed comes from Butterfly...that's an official communication from Butterfly about how Garaydias are made. Apart of that I have the 3 Garaydia facing me and I've a balsa allround too, so I'll make some picts then these post will be closed for me.

https://www.flickr.com/gp/187899777@N07/A0J441

Regards
 
  • Like
Reactions: UpSideDownCarl
says Visited my own profile, woop woop. ;)
says Visited my own profile, woop woop. ;)
Active Member
Nov 2014
508
267
1,145
Read 6 reviews
29
cache.php

Well, Butterfly won't give out composition info apparently, but let's go with kiri.
As it looks slightly more like it. :rolleyes:
Anyway, I still think Garadya and Amultart differ in some way... I saw a guy reviewing Amultart while saying it's better than Garadya ZLC somehow. Can't pin-point why, but Amultart was also more expensive. Amultart is also rated faster than Garadya (as well as XVT ofc) on revspin average, that might be a user-bias, idk. But still.

But anyway, if money is not an issue, Garadya ZLC and XVT ZLC Hinoki combined (177usd) still goes for less than Amultart's orginal price (230usd), so why not try both and post a comparing review :cool:

Also, if you're still set on getting an Amultart. it does not seem to be gone on the market.
Like, megaspin is somehow not out of stock yet:
https://www.megaspin.net/store/default.asp?pid=b-amultart-zl-c
Though shipping might be a slight pain in the arse.
and here https://www.paddlepalace.com/Butterfly-Amultart-ZL-Carbon/productinfo/SBAMU/
also, https://www.quube.xyz/item/BUTTERFLY-AMULTART-ZLC-SHAKEHAND-ST-BLADE/645363481 (ships to Canada actually)
and for some reason, it's still seemingly even available on https://shop.butterflyonline.com/amultart-zl-carbon-blade ?!
idek anymore. I thought this was discontinued in 2015/2016 or something? o_O I'm sending Butts another pm.
 
Top