Suggestion choosing my first good TT Racket.

[NetProphet]

Buying a first personal racket completly not fitted to your current technique is a mistake and wasted money. Thibar 4L and 2 Mark V are enough for any beginners. A friend is at provincial level with a premade racquet.

Yes, if you do that it's a mistake.
So you don't agree that Rakza 7 is a good choice for a beginner?
I don't know what provincial level is where you're living but there's nobody I know at any half decent level that plays with a premade racket. I'm not saying it's not possible but at a certain level it just holds you back. If that level comes after provincial level where you live then fair enough...
But you provide so little beyond coming into the thread and barking at people 'do this, do that, that's a waste' without providing any additional thought or explanation that it's difficult to take you seriously.

If you want to buy a blade because it feels nice, it's pretty, it's the same than your friends or Ma Long, it's fine as long as you admit it. But buying the most expensive blade pretending the purpose to fit the level of a beginner is a joke.

I'm not buying anything cos it feels nice and pretty. Maybe you're referring to the OP? But he stated his reasons for what he wants to do but he doesn't say he buys cos of aesthetics either...
If you read my posts tho you'll see that I recommend a slower wooden blade more than once so we probably actually agree here.

You might think someone's choice is a 'joke' but to express your thoughts that way is just rude and one sided and (if this were us face to face in a club) I would just laugh in your face and ignore you.
He wants blade he can grow with and while I prefer slower wooden blades for a beginner also you should still admit that an all wood blade like the MLEO with Rakza 7 is a racket that someone can use as they develop from beginner to intermediate.
I say this because I've seen many do it (the rubbers especially) and I respect that OPs choice whatever he wants to do.

You may have a point and you may know what your talking about but your short sharp posts kinda make you hard to engage with or listen to.

 

[Lazer]

Yes, if you do that it's a mistake.
So you don't agree that Rakza 7 is a good choice for a beginner?
I don't know what provincial level is where you're living but there's nobody I know at any half decent level that plays with a premade racket. I'm not saying it's not possible but at a certain level it just holds you back. If that level comes after provincial level where you live then fair enough...
But you provide so little beyond coming into the thread and barking at people 'do this, do that, that's a waste' without providing any additional thought or explanation that it's difficult to take you seriously.

I'm not buying anything cos it feels nice and pretty. Maybe you're referring to the OP? But he stated his reasons for what he wants to do but he doesn't say he buys cos of aesthetics either...
If you read my posts tho you'll see that I recommend a slower wooden blade more than once so we probably actually agree here.

You might think someone's choice is a 'joke' but to express your thoughts that way is just rude and one sided and (if this were us face to face in a club) I would just laugh in your face and ignore you.
He wants blade he can grow with and while I prefer slower wooden blades for a beginner also you should still admit that an all wood blade like the MLEO with Rakza 7 is a racket that someone can use as they develop from beginner to intermediate.
I say this because I've seen many do it (the rubbers especially) and I respect that OPs choice whatever he wants to do.

You may have a point and you may know what your talking about but your short sharp posts kinda make you hard to engage with or listen to.

I say Rakza 7 is too much for an absolute beginner. Mark V is much better. I know advanced players that still plays with Mark V. The topsheet is one of the markets best. It lives longer than anything else and has almost as much spin as the spinniest ESN rubbers. And not all premades all shite either.

Wake up You Mak V haters....

Cheers
L-zr

 

[Grumms]

Yes, if you do that it's a mistake.
So you don't agree that Rakza 7 is a good choice for a beginner?
I don't know what provincial level is where you're living but there's nobody I know at any half decent level that plays with a premade racket. I'm not saying it's not possible but at a certain level it just holds you back. If that level comes after provincial level where you live then fair enough...
But you provide so little beyond coming into the thread and barking at people 'do this, do that, that's a waste' without providing any additional thought or explanation that it's difficult to take you seriously.

I'm not buying anything cos it feels nice and pretty. Maybe you're referring to the OP? But he stated his reasons for what he wants to do but he doesn't say he buys cos of aesthetics either...
If you read my posts tho you'll see that I recommend a slower wooden blade more than once so we probably actually agree here.

You might think someone's choice is a 'joke' but to express your thoughts that way is just rude and one sided and (if this were us face to face in a club) I would just laugh in your face and ignore you.
He wants blade he can grow with and while I prefer slower wooden blades for a beginner also you should still admit that an all wood blade like the MLEO with Rakza 7 is a racket that someone can use as they develop from beginner to intermediate.
I say this because I've seen many do it (the rubbers especially) and I respect that OPs choice whatever he wants to do.

You may have a point and you may know what your talking about but your short sharp posts kinda make you hard to engage with or listen to.

It encourages the rise of the prices by the manufacturers, because even beginners will buy expensive rubbers or blades only because of the fame of the equipment. Rakza is a good rubber, a very good one probably, but does a beginner will take benefit from it? No because the technique is so poor that even a slightly less good rubber will be exploited the same. It makes inexperienced players be focus on the material, blaming it for their level of play.

Whatever our friend takes as a blade, as long as it's not in one end of the spectrum (not too fast or not too slow), it will suit him perfectly. And he can save money to invest in 1 or 2 hours of private lessons, where he will improve extensively more than with any new blade.

 

[d3nium]

Blade - Yasaka Sweden Extra
FH - Xiom Vega Pro
BH - Xiom Vega Europe

The ultimate beginner setup.

 

[NetProphet]

I say Rakza 7 is too much for an absolute beginner.

OK. But not relevant here given the OP isn't an absolute beginner.

Mark V is much better. I know advanced players that still plays with Mark V. The topsheet is one of the markets best. It lives longer than anything else and has almost as much spin as the spinniest ESN rubbers. And not all premades all shite either.

Wake up You Mak V haters....

Cheers
L-zr

But are we still talking about 'absolute' beginners?
I started back with a Mark V M2 for a season and also played with a Mark V rackets. It was fine for a little while but as my technique came back and I started hitting harder and playing against better players I soon realised how different the game was with the new 40+ poly ball as compared to the old 38 cell ball.
When you start to actually improve the Mark V just doesn't cut it.
So for an absolute beginner I'd agree with you but that's all. It is quickly outgrown for anyone else.
There are 3 beginners at my club who all bought Mark V rackets and it served them well for a while too but they all preferred Rakza 7 when they tried it. Makes sense as Rakza 7 replaced Mark V as Yasakas standard rubber when tension sponge arrived.

99% of premades are shite, inconsistent, use crap rubbers and come with a shite blade that you can't get the rubbers off of without doing serious surgery.
If you know premades beyond Mark V that can be recommend then cool but I haven't ever seen one so I don't know what they are, but I'm always open to new info!

 

[NetProphet]

It encourages the rise of the prices by the manufacturers, because even beginners will buy expensive rubbers or blades only because of the fame of the equipment. Rakza is a good rubber, a very good one probably, but does a beginner will take benefit from it? No because the technique is so poor that even a slightly less good rubber will be exploited the same. It makes inexperienced players be focus on the material, blaming it for their level of play.

I don't agree here. It last ages, is made for the 40 poly ball and I've seen it work for beginners right through to intermediate so to me it is well worth the money,
I still use it (and Rakza X soft) on BH and also see players much better than me still use it!
I think your Yinhe Loki suggestion could really work well also but that just means both are good ideas as I see it.

Whatever our friend takes as a blade, as long as it's not in one end of the spectrum (not too fast or not too slow), it will suit him perfectly. And he can save money to invest in 1 or 2 hours of private lessons, where he will improve extensively more than with any new blade.

Completely agree here. Saving money by getting your equipment right and spending the rest on coaching is where you get most benefit!

 

[Lazer]

OK. But not relevant here given the OP isn't an absolute beginner.

But are we still talking about 'absolute' beginners?
I started back with a Mark V M2 for a season and also played with a Mark V rackets. It was fine for a little while but as my technique came back and I started hitting harder and playing against better players I soon realised how different the game was with the new 40+ poly ball as compared to the old 38 cell ball.
When you start to actually improve the Mark V just doesn't cut it.
So for an absolute beginner I'd agree with you but that's all. It is quickly outgrown for anyone else.
There are 3 beginners at my club who all bought Mark V rackets and it served them well for a while too but they all preferred Rakza 7 when they tried it. Makes sense as Rakza 7 replaced Mark V as Yasakas standard rubber when tension sponge arrived.

99% of premades are shite, inconsistent, use crap rubbers and come with a shite blade that you can't get the rubbers off of without doing serious surgery.
If you know premades beyond Mark V that can be recommend then cool but I haven't ever seen one so I don't know what they are, but I'm always open to new info!

Its good for a whole lot of players, but because of all the haters they don't know about it. Rakza 7 is simply too bouncy for many. They say they like it... I know a player who just loves his Primorac carbon with dual Tenergy 05. Its so easy to make him hit long so it isn't funny anymore....

Here is a whole bunch of them:

Pingis | Pingisracketar | Köp hos Biljardexperten

Pingis | Pingisracketar | stort sortiment online | Populära produkter från kända märken | Snabba leveranser och personlig service

www.biljardexperten.se

Cheers
L-zr

 

[Grumms]

OK. But not relevant here given the OP isn't an absolute beginner.

But are we still talking about 'absolute' beginners?
I started back with a Mark V M2 for a season and also played with a Mark V rackets. It was fine for a little while but as my technique came back and I started hitting harder and playing against better players I soon realised how different the game was with the new 40+ poly ball as compared to the old 38 cell ball.
When you start to actually improve the Mark V just doesn't cut it.
So for an absolute beginner I'd agree with you but that's all. It is quickly outgrown for anyone else.
There are 3 beginners at my club who all bought Mark V rackets and it served them well for a while too but they all preferred Rakza 7 when they tried it. Makes sense as Rakza 7 replaced Mark V as Yasakas standard rubber when tension sponge arrived.

99% of premades are shite, inconsistent, use crap rubbers and come with a shite blade that you can't get the rubbers off of without doing serious surgery.
If you know premades beyond Mark V that can be recommend then cool but I haven't ever seen one so I don't know what they are, but I'm always open to new info!

Prefering Rakza is totally normal, because it feels like the rubber plays by itself. But this make the player lazy. I say that because even with my honorable level, I've been lazy for many years with speed glue + trichloroethylene, then with tensor rubbers, and it prevents you from noticing the adjustments you should do.

 

[Grumms]

I don't agree here. It last ages, is made for the 40 poly ball and I've seen it work for beginners right through to intermediate so to me it is well worth the money,
I still use it (and Rakza X soft) on BH and also see players much better than me still use it!
I think your Yinhe Loki suggestion could really work well also but that just means both are good ideas as I see it.

Completely agree here. Saving money by getting your equipment right and spending the rest on coaching is where you get most benefit!

Then Rakza with the slowest blade possible, so that all the energy is not provided by the rubber, but by the arm.

I'm glad that we finally agree

 

[NetProphet]

Its good for a whole lot of players, but because of all the haters they don't know about it. Rakza 7 is simply too bouncy for many. They say they like it... I know a player who just loves his Primorac carbon with dual Tenergy 05. Its so easy to make him hit long so it isn't funny anymore....

Here is a whole bunch of them:

Pingis | Pingisracketar | Köp hos Biljardexperten

Pingis | Pingisracketar | stort sortiment online | Populära produkter från kända märken | Snabba leveranser och personlig service

www.biljardexperten.se

Cheers
L-zr

They're not premade 😂
Unless you are calling every blade and rubber combo assembled by the seller 'premade'.
The Yasaka 2040 is the only real premade bat there and that's less effective than Mark V

 

[Lazer]

They're not premade 😂
Unless you are calling every blade and rubber combo assembled by the seller 'premade'.
The Yasaka 2040 is the only real premade bat there and that's less effective than Mark V

I see it a bit differently. Premade means that someone else than yourself has put it together. And they cost less than buying each individual peace. There is nothing wrong with Yasaka 2040 and Mark V either. For someone who is not a TT connoisseur it is probably enough to start with. Better start cheap and wait until You know a little more so you can make a better choice.

However it is perfectly OK to recommend something better as well. I know I wouldn’t recommend that particular racket but that doesn’t mean there is something wrong with it…

Cheers
L-zr

 

[NetProphet]

I see it a bit differently. Premade means that someone else than yourself has put it together.

When I referred to premade I was speaking of factory made rackets. A friend of mine received his Butterfly a few weeks ago, FZH ALC with Tenergy and Dignics assembled by seller. I can't consider this premade

And they cost less than buying each individual peace.

if you go to TT11 Nd order 2 rubbers and a blade ask ask them to assemble it, it costs the same as if they ship them to you for self assembly.

There is nothing wrong with Yasaka 2040 and Mark V either. For someone who is not a TT connoisseur it is probably enough to start with. Better start cheap and wait until You know a little more so you can make a better choice.

Agreed here, good to start with something sufficient and only spend bigger bucks when you are sure of what you need and nothing wrong with Mark V for total beginner 👍

However it is perfectly OK to recommend something better as well. I know I wouldn’t recommend that particular racket but that doesn’t mean there is something wrong with it…

Cheers
L-zr

Well it depends what you want the racket to do. If it's to satisfy a newbie kid knocking around with his friends it's perfect.
If you hand it to me and expect me to win matches with it I'm gonna tell you there's something wrong with it!!! 😂
Cheers man👍

 

[Lazer]

When I referred to premade I was speaking of factory made rackets. A friend of mine received his Butterfly a few weeks ago, FZH ALC with Tenergy and Dignics assembled by seller. I can't consider this premade

if you go to TT11 Nd order 2 rubbers and a blade ask ask them to assemble it, it costs the same as if they ship them to you for self assembly.

Agreed here, good to start with something sufficient and only spend bigger bucks when you are sure of what you need and nothing wrong with Mark V for total beginner 👍

Well it depends what you want the racket to do. If it's to satisfy a newbie kid knocking around with his friends it's perfect.
If you hand it to me and expect me to win matches with it I'm gonna tell you there's something wrong with it!!! 😂
Cheers man👍

It was probably a customer order, now THAT does NOT qualify as a premade. 😉

The players I am talking about can’t telll the difference… 🤣

Cheers
L-zr

 

[greenbeanmachine]

You can play at a pretty high level with Mark V, but you need a really fast carbon blade. There's a ~1700 player at my club who does it. Not the optimal strategy imo.

Same deal with Rakza 7. It's still a beginner rubber. It has some benefits for the poly ball but it can make you develop lazy technique if you aren't paying attention to technique.

Anyone can play with anything at an amateur level, but the question is whether it's the best thing for them to do.

Ma Lin Extra Offensive with H3 both sides is a racket which might not be the best for learning quickly, but it will let you take your gameplay to a very high level. It's not absurd to learn with this setup, but the learning will be slower. As a tradeoff, you won't have to re-learn your feeling of the ball when you reach the next skill level. Furthermore, it won't let you learn bad habits that you will have to un-learn later, because it will force you to play with good technique.

Mark V would probably be the best rubber to use if your goal is to get to a 1000 USATT rating (what one could call a "low-intermediate" player) as quickly as possible. It's better for learning, but it has a lower ceiling. And when you reach that ceiling you will need to change equipment.

Rakza 7 is somewhere in between. You could realistically take it to 1200-1500 before it starts holding you back.

 

[pong99]

There's a local player who plays 2100-2200 with double R7.

 

[greenbeanmachine]

There's a local player who plays 2100-2200 with double R7.

I don't doubt it. Probably not the optimal strategy for getting to 2200 though.

 

[Aturev]

After lots of research and taking inputs, I finally got Extra Offensive 7 Power with Rakza 9 on FH and Rakza X soft for BH.

Reason choosing this combo:
I wanted something fast to compliment my game. If I want something slow I can always switch to my existing pre-made one.

My experience so far after playing for 2 weekends approx 10+ Hours:
It's been very good and I'm enjoying the speed with very less efforts compared to my existing one, especially on mid to far from table shots. My win percentage has gone up significantly.

I didn't have much experience with custom rackets so didn't really know what to expect. But am glad that I didn't go for a slower setup, this one seems perfect.

I'm really tempted to go and try sticky rubber once. May be next change I'll swap Rakza 9 with Hurricane 3.

Thanks to everyone on this thread for all suggestions and inputs.

 

[Lazer]

Makes no sense at all.

Hurricane 3 vs Rakza 9 makes a massive difference. Rakza 9 is made for speed and Hurricane 3 for spin…

Cheers
L-zr

 

[greenbeanmachine]

I think it's good to try different things. Even if it slows your progress, it lets you find equipment that suits your style and it will let you have more fun with your game.

Experimenting with rubbers is fun, but it also helps you to understand how different kinds of rubber work. For instance, since I started playing with pips, I have become much better at playing opponents who use pips, even when I play with inverted rubber. This is because I now have a better understanding of how pips work. Same principle holds for understanding the difference between Chinese and EuroJap rubbers.

I'd suggest for you to play with your current rubbers for 3-6 months, and then they will wear out. After that, you can change if you want, or you can get new copies of the same rubber if you really like it.

Certainly I would not discourage you from trying Hurricane 3, which is indisputably the most popular rubber in the world. If you don't like it you can change it back. If you like it, you might even try using it on both sides.

If you're an equipment junkie like me, just get one racket with EuroJap rubbers (like Rakza) and have one racket with Chinese rubbers like Hurricane then you can compare them directly

 

[Aturev]

Makes no sense at all.

Hurricane 3 vs Rakza 9 makes a massive difference. Rakza 9 is made for speed and Hurricane 3 for spin…

Cheers
L-zr

I totally agree they are completely different.
But that's the whole point, I want to experiment n experience and decide what suits me.

Again I'm not changing it anytime soon, when the current one wears out and due for replacement.

In meantime I'll also see if I can try one from anyone at the club. I highly doubt it coz my place is like a butterfly fanclub.