Daily Table Tennis Chit Chat

[NextLevel]

In the same boat Der , was playing the league on saturday , played against two teams .
The first one we should have won but my doubles partner was completely out of it , could not focus when we needed too. Her normal reaction is to muscle the ball whenever we have more consistent players on the other end , tried to convince her to spin but too not a good effect , hence two 1700 - 1800 loopers lost it to two one winged penhold blockers around the same level, it was pretty disheartening ...

then played two singles in the next match . first match was against the long pip guy which I described earlier. The second match was against a 2100 guy on the worst table in the club. its basically 10 feet from the only entrance which has a curtain that keeps swinging in the wind. Players around us somehow don't seem to care whether they walk into us when we are in the middle of a rally or stop right next to the table for a social chat. Anyways , the guy had a good serve and a very good forehand. Saw him beat down our highest rated players in the previous match and I tried to be over agressive and lost the first two sets too easily.
The third set , knuckled down and took him to 9-9 and then lost 11-9 . Could have done better ...

Gotta stick to structurally sound table tennis when playing the better players. Serve mostly short, play for first attack, and try to make sure his first attack comes from his weaker side (usually backhand from backhand side but depending on player, might be forehand from wide forehand side). When you do that, playing better rarely crosses your mind because you played properly.

 

[NextLevel]

@NL : on a different note, special thanks to you for the long pips video you posted recently , I got a long pips guy yesterday in the league and put the fear in him with heavy long under spin / no spin serve variation and then when he fell apart mentally things became a lot easier ... sh guy with long on the bh and regular on the forehand , slightly different proposition but the gist of it worked ... I could then work on his other weaknesses ... he started fearing my loop and serve from then on and it helped ... lost for the first set but came back to win 3-1 , 12-10 on the fourth.

Thank DerEchte. I used to be clueless about serving pips players and would mostly serve them no spin and then attack the third ball. The funniest thing is that even when I had bad serves, my only real deceptive serve was my backspin nospin serve. It worked but then the better pips players started turning on my no spin serves. Then DerEchte told me that pips players can put heavy backspin in the net, which no one else had ever stressed to me before. They always made pips sound like this cure for spin reading issues. So as my backspin nospin serve combo improved, I started using it more and more on pips players. Now my backspin serve is so good (even though I need to modify it in part because of my pendulum serve) that it just works like a charm if the pips player is struggling to read the nospin.

 

[Archosaurus]

NL, you don't use a lot of body in your serves compared to what I'd assume someone of your serving level would use.

Why is that? Is it physically challenging, or is it a question of consistency, or just how you were taught?

I'm aware it's possible to serve very, very well with mostly only arm mechanics. However I've found use of the body to be beneficial. It's easier to adjust to a sub-optimal throw and they stop becoming a problem, and the bodyweight gives that one little last push you need to keep the ball heavy but also low and short at the same time.

Now, even without body, your best backspin serves are above my best backspin serves' level by a respectable enough margin. There might be a level difference causing an illusion here, and I just don't get it.

However, I don't think it's entirely like that. If you have good touch, I don't see how more energy being put into spin could be a bad thing. By moving the body one way and rotating the bat around a point the other, you can do some crazy stuff, too.

 

[NextLevel]

NL, you don't use a lot of body in your serves compared to what I'd assume someone of your serving level would use.

Why is that? Is it physically challenging, or is it a question of consistency, or just how you were taught?

I'm aware it's possible to serve very, very well with mostly only arm mechanics. However I've found use of the body to be beneficial. It's easier to adjust to a sub-optimal throw and they stop becoming a problem, and the bodyweight gives that one little last push you need to keep the ball heavy but also low and short at the same time.

I would say that there is an alternate approach to serving that emphasises larger whips. I was taught by my serving coach to use relatively small and deceptive ones.

Now, even without body, your best backspin serves are above my best backspin serves' level by a respectable enough margin. There might be a level difference causing an illusion here, and I just don't get it.

However, I don't think it's entirely like that. If you have good touch, I don't see how more energy being put into spin could be a bad thing. By moving the body one way and rotating the bat around a point the other, you can do some crazy stuff, too.

Well, I am physically stronger than you are Archosaurus. That matters a lot. In terms of using body, people have all kinds of misconceptions but the only use of the body when serving in terms of the quality of the serve ( as opposed to the consistency or the recovery) is how much you use it to get extra power to snap the wrist over a short distance with control. Because my motion is small, my body usage is small and relatively invisible. Because I mostly don't use my knees for anything, most of my power is in small abdominal rotation movements that you may or may not see, timed over short distances because I cannot always rotate over larger ones and retain control and balance. The most important thing in TT for such technique is to hit the ball while rotating. Timing the snap is also important. But like I said, such things come with practice, experimentation and experience. As a guy in my club says, this ain't no Scooby-Doo.

 

[Archosaurus]

Well, I am physically stronger than you are Archosaurus. That matters a lot. In terms of using body, people have all kinds of misconceptions but the only use of the body when serving in terms of the quality of the serve ( as opposed to the consistency or the recovery) is how much you use it to get extra power to snap the wrist over a short distance with control. Because my motion is small, my body usage is small and relatively invisible. Because I mostly don't use my knees for anything, most of my power is in small abdominal rotation movements that you may or may not see, timed over short distances because I cannot always rotate over larger ones and retain control and balance. The most important thing in TT for such technique is to hit the ball while rotating. Timing the snap is also important. But like I said, such things come with practice, experimentation and experience. As a guy in my club says, this ain't no Scooby-Doo.

Knowing that you have high enough strength and a good method of accelerating your bat rapidly to begin with, don't you think that a larger movement could ultimately aid you to do those better, or are the downsides not worth it for you?

 

[NextLevel]

Knowing that you have high enough strength and a good method of accelerating your bat rapidly to begin with, don't you think that a larger movement could ultimately aid you to do those better, or are the downsides not worth it for you?

In TT, you sometimes need to solve the problems at your level before you start taking things to the next level. That said, I wonder what you mean sometimes when you say more body. Here is one of the best third ball attackers in the USA (neon yellow/green). Does he use more body than I do? Note that he is doing a serve and recovery while I am doing just a serve.

The real problem here is that people watch Ma Long serve and take away all the wrong insights. The thing is that the larger the serve motion, the more difficult it is to hide deception. But most serving is pretty small and the larger motions mostly transfer movement towards the table to faciliate recovery. Some people use those motions to improve the serve marginally but then some people start confusing those motions with the actual serve. Those things do help and my serve is more physical than it looks, but regardless, it is more important to make the serve look effortless and have it heavy than to make it heavy and have it heavy. If you looked at my serve in a match with the recovery, you might not find it as different as it looks in practice.

One junior that plays at NYISC, after he lost our most recent match, I tried to tell him all the ways he had improved. He said that it is annoying to play me because the serve keeps changing!

 

[42andbackpains]

Did my regular hour long session training with one of my coaches on Saturday. Still trying to get the Arc on my loops, i keep powering them off the table. I know, i know...more topsheet engagement, lower stance, racket angle, relax....blah blah blah...hopefully i will get there one of these days.

Played one of the junior players rated 1900, lost 0-3. He has improved a lot since last year (1500 year ago)....will do better next time(hopefully).

Watched the Saturday older players roll in around 3pm est, 4 of them are about 2100. They like to put up some money to make it more exciting. Was fun to watch as they were playing and trying to get into each others head. A lot of trash talking. Me and a coach was laughing and commenting (adding fuel to the fire...lol)

 

[NextLevel]

Did my regular hour long session training with one of my coaches on Saturday. Still trying to get the Arc on my loops, i keep powering them off the table. I know, i know...more topsheet engagement, lower stance, racket angle, relax....blah blah blah...hopefully i will get there one of these days.

Played one of the junior players rated 1900, lost 0-3. He has improved a lot since last year (1500 year ago)....will do better next time(hopefully).

Watched the Saturday older players roll in around 3pm est, 4 of them are about 2100. They like to put up some money to make it more exciting. Was fun to watch as they were playing and trying to get into each others head. A lot of trash talking. Me and a coach was laughing and commenting (adding fuel to the fire...lol)

Step 1: Remove those hard chinese rubbers from your paddle.
Step 2: Just loop as if you are massaging your wife's back.

 

[42andbackpains]

Thinking of Tenergy 05 for a while. And my wife doesnt like massages...lol

NL....can you come to NYC this coming Sat? D.E. and USDC are planning a get together.

 

[OldschoolPenholder]

Watched the Saturday older players roll in around 3pm est, 4 of them are about 2100. They like to put up some money to make it more exciting. Was fun to watch as they were playing and trying to get into each others head. A lot of trash talking. Me and a coach was laughing and commenting (adding fuel to the fire...lol)

Just like the old days at the firehouse chinatown tt club! We had a soda machine in there, and sometimes members would bet a can of soda... the better players bet money lol

 

[42andbackpains]

Just like the old days at the firehouse chinatown tt club! We had a soda machine in there, and sometimes members would bet a can of soda... the better players bet money lol

Yeah, but these days people bet more than a can of soda. Too rich for me and my 1400 rating, fun to watch though. Trash Talking is a art form. We should run Tourneys and league with a Trash Talking requirement...lol

 

[OldschoolPenholder]

LOLOL

You would kill me in a trash talking contest, i gotz noz trash talkin' gamez

Yeah, but these days people bet more than a can of soda. Too rich for me and my 1400 rating, fun to watch though. Trash Talking is a art form. We should run Tourneys and league with a Trash Talking requirement...lol

 

[OldschoolPenholder]

Cornel,

RE: the footwork part of your comments - I'm slow in my footwork many times in TT ... if i'm not physically tired, i tend to move more for 2nd/3rd/5th ball attacks. So when i do move, it's slow.

i've been jumping rope (like boxers do, well not as cool-looking as them LOL) ... that has helped me a little, to be lighter on my feet. also generally stand on the balls of my feet as well as not being flat-footed.

I shadow drill shuffling footwork - generally side to side - get into ready stance, to move to right, i step with my right foot first and then shuffle/slide my left foot to shoulder-width stance or shuffle my left foot to my right foot and then shuffle my right foot further to right and then shuffle my left to either get into shoulder-width stance or to right foot to shuffle one more out (although shuffling 3x may be inefficient and slow and the recent chit chat on the cross-step may be better suited) ... but the point is to get used to shuffling

This sounds wacky perhaps... watch tv, and when the figures on tv move, i send the signal to my brain to move - could be hand/arm or foot. Part of speed in movements is the mental signal to the brain to tell body to move... scene changes on tv and decide to move are one way to train it for me.

Not sure if these will help you, but i offer them in case they may help.

Good luck in your training and TT!

 

[OldschoolPenholder]

OSPH, I just got to agree with what people say - you are so kind and responsive to everyone here, I am very glad this forum has such a member as you!

*blushing* Thank you Cornel!

I'm not as experienced or good as NextLevel, Carl, Der_Echte and others ... but I do my part to help if i think i can. We are all here because we like/love TT. Plus, sometimes, during lulls in workflow, helps me pass the day by chit chatting here

Thank you Cornel again!

 

[OldschoolPenholder]

LOLOLOL at Liten and japanese carpenter comment

My first time hearing me described that way! And although I've not thought of it that way, i have to agree... basically, go with the flow or as a martial arts master says, 'Flow with the go.' (Rickson Gracie for the record)

 

[OldschoolPenholder]

A very elite amature player geared his game down (maybe so he could practice vs my attacks) and I got by 3-2. If this player was serious, I would lose 0-3 averaging 5 points.

Wow at your opponent! Given this was League play, guessing he did this cos his team won already? If not, what would his teammates think of him?

 

[OldschoolPenholder]

First day at unigames 2016:
As expected, nearly all the teams were super strong, and the team from UNSW just annihilated every one and everything...

Our team lost both of our match ups today.
I played 6 singles for my team today. Lost all 6. The level of the players were too strong. There was one player that I might have had the chance of winning, but still lost 2 sets at 11-9, and then lost the third.
I managed to capture everything on camera, and even though I lost, I just try my best and play the best I could. Made some amazing shots.

No loss is a loss if you learn from it. A win sometimes is detrimental to one's game as one may think they have nothing to improve on. Since you have the games captured on video, your opponents will show you the holes in your game. You didn't lose in a sense if you watch the videos and spot where you can improve on!

I like the compilation of good points video that you recently posted ... shows you have the basic idea of what to do for 3rd ball attack and what works for you.

You will get them next time JeffM!

 

[laistrogian]

Thinking of Tenergy 05 for a while. And my wife doesnt like massages...lol

NL....can you come to NYC this coming Sat? D.E. and USDC are planning a get together.

Just boost the hurricane. I just boosted mine, strap them on 93g TBS with boosted old T05 (so it's basically like ML's old setup) and now I understand why european players complain about boosted hurricane 3 blue sponge.

 

[Boogar]

Yeah, but these days people bet more than a can of soda. Too rich for me and my 1400 rating, fun to watch though. Trash Talking is a art form. We should run Tourneys and league with a Trash Talking requirement...lol

Nice Avatar 42andbackpains Are you reading the series? If yes are you just buying the jump issues?

 

[42andbackpains]

Nice Avatar 42andbackpains Are you reading the series? If yes are you just buying the jump issues?

Nah, just googled and copied the pic because the pick looked like me in my younger years.... I don' t read much manga these days since Naruto the first series finished. I read a lot of Wuxia translations now a days.