Daily Table Tennis Chit Chat

[NextLevel]

@NextLevel

I was straight arming balls for maybe half an hour at a slow pace. I've done it before but never to this extent, because I could never actually get my bat on the ball with a stroke like that until this day.

I'm not sure I've ever landed, or even attempted a stroke like this in a match or drill situation. I just don't have the timing and relaxation for it. I can understand what you mean when you say that it takes years.

Even if this stroke is far from ideal, I will try to develop it and take the good things from it into all of my strokes. It's the only thing I know that is closer to a high level of spin, and you yourself talk about maximizing spin as a focus. Surely a more efficient whip mechanic is more ideal, but it's somewhat beyond my reality. I just do what I can.

A more efficient whip mechanic is not beyond anyone's reality. The structure of your stroke is in your control as long as you are willing to receive feedback and go through the process of shadow stroking and swinging at the ball... What I like about your game is that the bigger body parts and the balance look right - it's the small things in the whip and the hand that are missing. To someone who isn't looking at ball quality, you may look like a good player - my favorite student is like you. She looks good and has good form, but the small things the wrists and the forearm should be doing to make the ball higher quality are just not there partly because of inexperience but partly because she prioritizes hitting the ball to getting the quality.

I can't pretend my timing came overnight. I Say these things in part to encourage you so that you don't get the wrong idea of what is happening. In TT, many people give up for the wrong reasons - they think it happens by magic. I was watching my serves in a practice drill with Boogar in June and I was laughing at how I served backspin even in June. But Brett had been getting on me to change my backspin serve form for almost 2 years and it was a painful process with much resistance that only finally fully clicked when he came here and fixed the last few things. And before that, I had a very good backspin serve.

So you are on the right path - you aren't where you think you may like to be, but with the process continuing, you will get there. But you need the video so that you can get the feed back.

 

[NextLevel]

Yes, forehand from righty BH to righty opponent's BH is an inside out loop.

 

[OldschoolPenholder]

Yes, forehand from righty BH to righty opponent's BH is an inside out loop.

Thank you Sir!

EDIT: taking a page out of Shuki's book ... How to Beat OSPH ... know that 90% of the time he will inside out loop on 3rd ball after sidedown serve

 

[Shuki]

 

[Shuki]

the bad habits that are showing up are driving me crazy. coach has been back in china for 3 months now and everything feels to be falling apart in my form. (especially timing in this video)

 

[Archosaurus]

@NextLevel

It's a good point to remember that higher level players don't just magically produce a better ball. Always, there is something concrete that, in theory, you or me can do.

I guess a better way to express it would be to say that better whip mechanics are not my reality RIGHT NOW, so I need to work up to it in smaller steps doing simple things.

 

[NextLevel]

@NextLevel

It's a good point to remember that higher level players don't just magically produce a better ball. Always, there is something concrete that, in theory, you or me can do.

I guess a better way to express it would be to say that better whip mechanics are not my reality RIGHT NOW, so I need to work up to it in smaller steps doing simple things.

Most of my time in TT practice is consumed with looking at my whip mechanics and trying out different ideas and seeing which one gives me better or worse whip with control. Would probably be easier if I was a nicer and richer person and paid a coach that I could listen to, but for now, experimenting, watching video tape and getting insights from Brett and any other nice person willing to make smart comments about my game will have to do.

It's not as easy as it sounds and there are some dead ends, but it helps you understand how certain pros stroke/serve the ball differently. And it discourages you from being too much of a fanboy.

 

[Archosaurus]

To say the truth, when I try whipping into the ball, I get more spin. Visibly more, and I can feel it as pressure on the racket when the ball contacts. Not terribly much more, but more.

However I haven't really tried to start incorporating that into my shots because I don't have much control with it. That being said probably the only way I will gain control is to practice it...

 

[NextLevel]

To say the truth, when I try whipping into the ball, I get more spin. Visibly more, and I can feel it as pressure on the racket when the ball contacts. Not terribly much more, but more.

However I haven't really tried to start incorporating that into my shots because I don't have much control with it. That being said probably the only way I will gain control is to practice it...

Whip is a loss of control. Whether on serves or on loops or on pushes. The control comes from practice and trusting the brain to time and adapt. People who aren't able to tolerate the errors in the learning process either get good at TT as children or simply never do. I'm looking at Shuki rolling that ball all over the place on his racket and I know I can do it, but it will be a pain to learn. If I start, I will miss the ball badly for at least an hour. The issue is whether I will persevere to the tipping point. Most people don't.

I saw an 1850 player doing the drill that begins at 42 seconds in this video easily. And then I said to myself, why can't I do it? And now, I can.

 

[Shuki]

Whip is a loss of control. Whether on serves or on loops or on pushes. The control comes from practice and trusting the brain to time and adapt. People who aren't able to tolerate the errors in the learning process either get good at TT as children or simply never do. I'm looking at Shuki rolling that ball all over the place on his racket and I know I can do it, but it will be a pain to learn. If I start, I will miss the ball badly for at least an hour. The issue is whether I will persevere to the tipping point. Most people don't.

I saw an 1850 player doing the drill that begins at 42 seconds in this video easily. And then I said to myself, why can't I do it? And now, I can.

the first video I posted yesterday was similar to this, but I couldn't do it with both sides of the raquet back in fourth for a long time. philipe (the good player that played against the one with "bad form" in another thread) actually taught me how to do it the more difficult way.

 

[wtachetna]

Does anybody remember that video in which Bruce Lee was playing Table Tennis with nunchucks? I want to ask if that video is genuine? Was there real Bruce Lee or was that game played with nunchucks?

 

[Takkyu_wa_inochi]

Does anybody remember that video in which Bruce Lee was playing Table Tennis with nunchucks? I want to ask if that video is genuine? Was there real Bruce Lee or was that game played with nunchucks?

it was a fake

 

[Boogar]

I am catching up on all that tt chat

I finally managed to fit in some table tennis. Yesterday I played about 2 hours in my club with the Vega pro on my forehand.

Overall I like it. I had problems to get good spin on the serves, because I haven't figured out how to activate the sponge.

Sometimes I would produce reasonable backspin and other times the ball would just slip. I think the contact needed with the tacky H3N is so much different on serves. I hope i can figure things out in the coming weeks.

In match situation i was quiet comfortable with looping and countering. I noticed the spin to speed ration was different from the H3N. Meaning the ball would fly with less of an arc. This may sound like a bad thing. But I hope this opens up new possibilities to feel the ball. And if I learn how to do spiny slow loops with this rubber, I hope to reach new heights concerning touch.

Plus last weekend I went to a club with an around the table event once a month.

Note how there are so much people that they can't just walk around the table but have to go into an other room.

It took me 45 minutes to get to the last three. I then proceeded to hit the ball into the net xD

EDIT: @NL you mentioned that I should put MX-P on my forehand. isn't its sponge even harder than the vega pro's one? And what about EL-P?

 

[Archosaurus]

Tried whipping a little more today. I think I got a miniscule amount of more "free spin" with no added risk, because people kept putting out the whip shots even if they are now adapted to my normal loop.

Still need to develop it further, right now there is very very little whip but it's something.

 

[NextLevel]

Tried whipping a little more today. I think I got a miniscule amount of more "free spin" with no added risk, because people kept putting out the whip shots even if they are now adapted to my normal loop.

Still need to develop it further, right now there is very very little whip but it's something.

Without video feedback, you can be doing things very wrong. Just keep that in mind.

 

[NextLevel]

EDIT: @NL you mentioned that I should put MX-P on my forehand. isn't its sponge even harder than the vega pro's one? And what about EL-P?

It's a common recommendation for people coming off hard Chinese sponge. Don't over think it. You can adjust to anything you use, you just have to think about your ball quality and continue to look for maximum controllable whip.

The main thing you have to continue to test is your contact depth when brushing on all your strokes. On loops you have to swing into and around the ball really hard, thought for softer spin shots, the contact is not as deep and it is more important to feel the rubber stretch. For serves, it depends a lot on what you are trying to do but you have to stretch the topsheet/sponge even more but without hitting as hard into the ball (though you will be hitting it somewhat).

 

[OldschoolPenholder]

Right shoulder sore ... may have been overdoing TT (3x/wk) and martial arts (2x/wk) - will try TT 2x/wk instead.

Last night, got to club late, ~6pm, jammed already. One table had no one next... B1 was hitting with someone who left after 5 mins. B1 started working his serves with me, previous night, i blocked his loops and then we worked on serves. After about 15 mins, he called it a night.

Went to another table and hit with 'Si-hing' - no one had next, so we just practiced. I started looping for a few mins, felt discomfort in shoulder, so i stopped. we then practiced BH - my punch/block and his RPB/loop. ~30 mins. Someone called next, we started a match. Won 1st game close, 2nd game lost at 5 or so, won 3rd close, lost 4th at 1 (it was 10-0 when i won a point), then lost 5th at 5 or so. when I looped felt the discomfort/soreness of shoulder. Shouldn't have played a match, but i did. Now i know better. No video.

Will scale back TT to 2x/wk and see how it goes. Think i've been feeling soreness/discomfort for 2 weeks or so.

 

[OldschoolPenholder]

Since I've been back into TT after the long layoff, i have tried a few rubbers but nothing suited me. When I tried DHS H3, overall my game has gotten back to some semblance of what it was before.

PingPongHolic made a passing comment that i was doing too much work with the DHS. 42andbackpains suggested i try MX-P... i ordered one but didn't have a chance to try it when Der_Echte had me test out Nexy Amazon CPen which he put on a MX-P. Der felt the MX-P/Amazon combo would suit my close-to-the-table play and I'm loving the combo.

My thanks to PPH, 42&bp, and to Der!

 

[Archosaurus]

@NextLevel

Yeah, true. Next time I play, I'll get some more video. This time we weren't there too long, so there was no time to charge my phone. Damn thing won't let me film at low battery. I should really just charge it up fully for the next time.

 

[JeffM]

Right shoulder sore ... may have been overdoing TT (3x/wk) and martial arts (2x/wk) - will try TT 2x/wk instead.

Will scale back TT to 2x/wk and see how it goes. Think i've been feeling soreness/discomfort for 2 weeks or so.

Take care OSP! Take care of your body first!

Tmr I will be hitting with my friend, unfortunately he has suffered an injury to his non playing elbow around 2 weeks ago, so we are both injured in some ways. I was looking forward to playing a match with him as we always do yearly, but will see how it goes.

I also have an excuse to buy a new pair of TT shoes, as I didn't bring my old pair over due to too much luggage. Shouldn't be too hard though.

Also, if any TTD users in HK would like to have a hit with me, let me know so we can have a game and you can teach me stuff!