Slow blade with fast rubbers vs. Fast blade with slow rubbers

[JJ Ng]

Nowadays I hate blades that give me vibration. I prefer stiff blade. I still use hurricane on the forehand and soft ESN rubber on the backhand side. I think different people prefer different things.

 

[z0uLess]

Reviving this thread because I noticed something lately.

Basically, everyone in my club who is playing in the 1st or 2nd team is using a Timo Boll ALC or something similar with soft rubbers such as Vega Europe. These guys have around 1700-1800TTR (German League).

Meanwhile, most ppl in the 3rd and 4th team are using slow blades (mostly allwood) with harder / spinnier rubbers. This definitely has made me left thinking, that maybe a fast carbon blade with soft rubbers would be more ideal for playing a controlled offensive game.

Any additional thoughts on that topic?

I think hard blades with soft rubbers is its own style of equipment that make use of the bottom out effect of the rubbers to get control of the ball. I suppose Truls Moregardh has developed like this and it has made his flat attack shots really effective even at the highest level. The chinese players are "machined" to respond to only topspin so the fast nospin ball from below the net is something that annoy them and is one of the things that is able to break through the chinese machinery.

 

[JJ Ng]

I think hard blades with soft rubbers is its own style of equipment that make use of the bottom out effect of the rubbers to get control of the ball. I suppose Truls Moregardh has developed like this and it has made his flat attack shots really effective even at the highest level. The chinese players are "machined" to respond to only topspin so the fast nospin ball from below the net is something that annoy them and is one of the things that is able to break through the chinese machinery.

Lol, you mean the under the table slow underspin fishing shot that Truls gave to Fan Zhendong in the Olympics final? Yes, CNT definitely has trouble with those shots

 

[z0uLess]

Lol, you mean the under the table slow underspin fishing shot that Truls gave to Fan Zhendong in the Olympics final? Yes, CNT definitely has trouble with those shots

Well, specifically just the different trajectory of the ball and the amount of variability you are able to do away from the table when you have a super fast blade that can hit flat shots effectively away from the table while still have superior touch on the ball to be able to switch it up and generate spin with this setup (negate the bottom out effect). So, in effect, you can do a fast flat shot that curves since you are far enough from the table that simple gravity will have effect on the ball to make it go over the net, but the bounce on opponent side is higher than when topspinning. It simply makes more variability in the ball curve than chinese rubbers. They can also switch up the level of spin, but probably not in this dramatic way that Truls is doing.

 

[NetProphet]

I think the fundamental flaw here is in the question.
It doesn't have to be 'Slow blade with fast rubbers vs. Fast blade with slow rubbers' so I'd disagree with the initial premise. Why discuss the extremes when a vast majority of the time the ideal setup is going to be found somewhere in the middle?

Give me a stiff carbon blade with R7soft and I won't be able to loop and short game properly with it. Likewise the slowest blade with T05 and D09c ain't gonna work for 90% of us either.

A blade you can control (I'm defining control as ability to use it properly for all of your shots) with rubbers that are also within your skillset is likely to yield the best results.
I'd recommend forgetting about professional grade rubbers like T05 and D09c unless you're an amazing player who excels at short and long game with them. Purely from the point of view as to what's necessary.

I'm not poo pooing people who choose these rubbers. I understand that people still love playing with T05 and D09c because of the ability within these rubbers regardless of whether or not they can extract everything from them and that's absolutely fine too but below a certain level I'd argue that they can reach their max potential with less potent (and cheaper) rubbers on their blade that lead to (in my limited experience) less errors.

My 2c on it as I settle for now with mid speed Ma Lin EO and relatively slow Rakza 7 and Rakza Z.

 

[NetProphet]

I think hard blades with soft rubbers is its own style of equipment that make use of the bottom out effect of the rubbers to get control of the ball. I suppose Truls Moregardh has developed like this and it has made his flat attack shots really effective even at the highest level. The chinese players are "machined" to respond to only topspin so the fast nospin ball from below the net is something that annoy them and is one of the things that is able to break through the chinese machinery.

Where have you seen this?
I don't agree here and wouldn't even say Moregard beating WCQ can be attributed to what you say.
It was more Moregard arrived ready and on form while WCQ did not. His overall play at the games was below the level he set in the previous year and Moregard proved his game was on song by making the final and putting it up to FZD.
Moregard simply outplayed WCQ but on a good day WCQ doesn't have a problem with this, I believe (but not 100%sure) this is the only time Truls has beaten him. And this is before mentioning the broken racket 😂
Maybe I'm wrong and maybe I need to watch more matches but I have to say, apart from unorthodox styles posing an adjustment challenge for everyone I've not really seen what you describe.
I reckon more Chinese losses come V outright attacking players than to players like Moregard or similar.

 

[z0uLess]

Where have you seen this?
I don't agree here and wouldn't even say Moregard beating WCQ can be attributed to what you say.
It was more Moregard arrived ready and on form while WCQ did not. His overall play at the games was below the level he set in the previous year and Moregard proved his game was on song by making the final and putting it up to FZD.
Moregard simply outplayed WCQ but on a good day WCQ doesn't have a problem with this, I believe (but not 100%sure) this is the only time Truls has beaten him. And this is before mentioning the broken racket 😂
Maybe I'm wrong and maybe I need to watch more matches but I have to say, apart from unorthodox styles posing an adjustment challenge for everyone I've not really seen what you describe.
I reckon more Chinese losses come V outright attacking players than to players like Moregard or similar.

I think it was a professional player I saw mentioning this in an interview or something, maybe Patrick Franziska, but also from my own simple theoretical understanding of the game as a game of reaction times and habit building with two major schools (institutions of habit building) separating the longstanding rivalry between Sweden and China.

 

[Rastaman]

I prefer a slow blade with a little flex.
One thing with fast blades is that they are normally very stiff. This makes looping harder and more uncomfortable. This way I get to play with faster rubbers too.

When I restarted after 40+ Years I had a Primorac carbon that was given to me. I started with this one and to make it playable for me I had to put some slow rubbers on it. It worked but wasn’t the best. Since I tested a lot of blades and I find that an all+ works excellent and give me access to faster rubbers.

Cheers
L-zr

Have you played with the old Primorac Wood? And what rubbers?

 

[Lazer]

Have you played with the old Primorac Wood? And what rubbers?

Only with my old Primorac carbon from 1997. I got i as a go away from my (mostly) Chinese friends as we were playing the last two months before I left US after working there for 13 years. That was the blade I had when starting again in 2021.

I used Sriver because that’s what I used back in 1974. I really had no idea the ball size had changed…

I suppose that after aging the primo carb has slowed down but it was still pretty fast…

Now I am a firm believer in fast blades and slow rubbers. But the fastest blades are often too stiff so I settle for off blades.

Cheers
L-zr

 

[Tyce]

Slow blade fast rubber usually means a difficult short game due to the rubber, and a lower power ceiling due to the blade.
What you get in return is a lot of medium range.

A fast blade with a slow rubber would usually be more controlled at the short game and have more power at the high end, but the medium range can be a little bit all or nothing.

My teammate is really struggling to find the middle gears, he can do good touch play and has a highly destructive finisher but opening up, and thus starting to set up for a good opportunity to finish, is really hard.

 

[Rastaman]

Only with my old Primorac carbon from 1997. I got i as a go away from my (mostly) Chinese friends as we were playing the last two months before I left US after working there for 13 years. That was the blade I had when starting again in 2021.

I used Sriver because that’s what I used back in 1974. I really had no idea the ball size had changed…

I suppose that after aging the primo carb has slowed down but it was still pretty fast…

Now I am a firm believer in fast blades and slow rubbers. But the fastest blades are often too stiff so I settle for off blades.

Cheers
L-zr

Ok, I just bought a special Butterfly Matilda Ekholm blade from 2016 that is a copy of the Primorac. Thats why I wonder what rubbers you had. Will not play so much with it just fun to have blade I think.

 

[Lazer]

Ok, I just bought a special Butterfly Matilda Ekholm blade from 2016 that is a copy of the Primorac. Thats why I wonder what rubbers you had. Will not play so much with it just fun to have blade I think.

You should be able to use whatever rubbers… I have a Sanwei Nova Carbon with a similar design that I’m going to put into service eventually, gonna use H3 on FH, undecideds för BH, beef something light though…

Cheers
L-zr