Advice on my serves and everything else

[joshmak10]

This was me playing in a tournament about a month ago (I have since changed my equipment and had much more training since). I (turquoise shirt) was the lowest rated player at this tournament and my opponent was the 5th lowest rated. This video was the second game in a best of 3 that I lost. Any advice on my play is appreciated, especially my serves. (Before anyone mentions my FH technique I have fixed it through help from a high level friend)

 

[joshmak10]

More footage from same tournament against a provincial level player (LP BH I think). This was recorded from 5-5 1-1 in a best of 3 and I lost.

 

[blahness]

There is a recovery and quality issue in your serve because you dont use weight transfer and hip rotation well. Similar to loops, it is required for high level service.

So for FH serves, start with weight on left foot, then use the transfer from left foot to right foot to throw the ball up, then when you brush the ball you transfer weight from right foot to left foot. There is a Ryu Seung Min video on this. And this last weight transfer from right foot to left foot powers the hip rotation which you can use to get into ready position very quickly. Currently you're still stuck in recovering position when the opponent receives, instead of already being in position and watching the opponent's bat like a hawk.

And also the movements can be tightened a bit - use more body and less arm for the serve, more fingers/wrist. To control service length while putting huge power into the serve movement you can drag the ball upwards and sideways and even a bit backwards. This will produce a lot more spin while reducing forward momentum. For fast long serves just dont do that and just drag the ball forwards onto the table.

Secondly, it appears that you're overwhelmed by the sidespin in your opponent's return, so you dont dare to loop the long return directly. What I would suggest is to learn how to go with the sidespin in looping your return ie use it to your advantage. For eg if you serve reverse pendulum and opponent uses BH to receive your serve in left side, it would be exactly like looping a FH pendulum serve from your opponent.

I actually dig your reverse serve, it has some potential in it.

 

[joshmak10]

There is a recovery and quality issue in your serve because you dont use weight transfer and hip rotation well. Similar to loops, it is required for high level service.

So for FH serves, start with weight on left foot, then use the transfer from left foot to right foot to throw the ball up, then when you brush the ball you transfer weight from right foot to left foot. There is a Ryu Seung Min video on this. And this last weight transfer from right foot to left foot powers the hip rotation which you can use to get into ready position very quickly. Currently you're still stuck in recovering position when the opponent receives, instead of already being in position and watching the opponent's bat like a hawk.

And also the movements can be tightened a bit - use more body and less arm for the serve, more fingers/wrist. To control service length while putting huge power into the serve movement you can drag the ball upwards and sideways and even a bit backwards. This will produce a lot more spin while reducing forward momentum. For fast long serves just dont do that and just drag the ball forwards onto the table.

Secondly, it appears that you're overwhelmed by the sidespin in your opponent's return, so you dont dare to loop the long return directly. What I would suggest is to learn how to go with the sidespin in looping your return ie use it to your advantage. For eg if you serve reverse pendulum and opponent uses BH to receive your serve in left side, it would be exactly like looping a FH pendulum serve from your opponent.

I actually dig your reverse serve, it has some potential in it.

Thank you, I took inspiration from FZD and ZJK haha!

I actually think that this makes sense for my serving issues. Thank you I will try to incorporate using my hips and rotation to serve better and recover quicker. I have been working on returning side spin serves so I will implement your advice on those.

 

[blahness]

Thank you, I took inspiration from FZD and ZJK haha!

I actually think that this makes sense for my serving issues. Thank you I will try to incorporate using my hips and rotation to serve better and recover quicker. I have been working on returning side spin serves so I will implement your advice on those.

Basically there are just 7 types of spin in TT. Heavy under, no spin, topspin, clockwise sideunder/sidetop, anticlockwise sideunder/sidetop. Once you know what to do precisely for each of these 7 types of ball, your success rates will skyrocket. Dont just mentally treat every ball as an incoming ball. Be precise with your ball reading and ball contact.

 

[Gozo Zyreruna]

Josh,
1. Beautiful Reverse Pendulum ( R.P. ) Serve. Nice!
2. For me, what makes R.P. scary for me is when the server starts of with a regular Pendulum serves motion but at the last second change to RP. This messes up with my anticipation.
3. However, if one always serves R.P. all the time, then to me, it is no different that a normal BH serve.
4. Something to ponder upon young one.

 

[joshmak10]

Basically there are just 7 types of spin in TT. Heavy under, no spin, topspin, clockwise sideunder/sidetop, anticlockwise sideunder/sidetop. Once you know what to do precisely for each of these 7 types of ball, your success rates will skyrocket. Dont just mentally treat every ball as an incoming ball. Be precise with your ball reading and ball contact.

This is a big weakness of mine that I am practicing nearly every day

 

[joshmak10]

Josh,
1. Beautiful Reverse Pendulum ( R.P. ) Serve. Nice!
2. For me, what makes R.P. scary for me is when the server starts of with a regular Pendulum serves motion but at the last second change to RP. This messes up with my anticipation.
3. However, if one always serves R.P. all the time, then to me, it is no different that a normal BH serve.
4. Something to ponder upon young one.

Thank you Gozo means a lot from you! Yes I try to very my RP with regular pendulums as much as I can

 

[ck1407]

This was me playing in a tournament about a month ago (I have since changed my equipment and had much more training since). I (turquoise shirt) was the lowest rated player at this tournament and my opponent was the 5th lowest rated. This video was the second game in a best of 3 that I lost. Any advice on my play is appreciated, especially my serves. (Before anyone mentions my FH technique I have fixed it through help from a high level friend)

I think your reverse pendulum serve is stable which is a good thing since it is reliable. If you watch the first 50sec of the vid, you are serving to the middle of the table which makes it easier for your opponent. Then at the 55sec mark, you serve to your opponent short forehand side which have proven effective since you won the point due to opponent's error.

Takeaways: you need to be more mindful on where you aim your serves. A good routine will be to serve forehand short and backhand long. Once your opponent is focusing on the extreme ends of the table, you can mix in middle and backhand short to throw them off every now and then

In this vid, you been missing backhand. You seem to struggle with the timing to hit the ball with your backhand. Based on the video, you drive more with your backhand. This will require you to contact the ball at the highest point which you managed to do during the backhand rally. However, whenever your opponent push the ball to your backhand, you waited for the ball way passed the optimal time to drive the ball. For those type of balls, you need to backhand loop them instead.

Takeaway: understand what type of shots can you make base on the timing you contact the ball and make good shot selection during matches

 

[Leno]

The serve is really nice and clean.

I'm not gonna recommend anything about your technique, since a lot of people will do so. The only thing I will say about the technique is your BH top spin. That's what we call a stiff arm over here. You need to learn to loosen up, gather strength and accelerate with your BH. Otherwise you have a hard time controlling your shots and are really deceptive to any kind of spin. Suggesting to start with a small motion instead off full arm.

So back to the part I want to talk about. The simples way to increase your match is to stop staring and start preparing. For example you chopped long and your first instinct is to keep chopping. However, the first instinct should be preparing to block or topspin depending on opponents action. This way you are prepared for the opponent strong shots instead of the rather weaker chop. What I can see in the first video is all your own topspin are split decisions after you realize that a chop would be hard to play.

 

[joshmak10]

I think your reverse pendulum serve is stable which is a good thing since it is reliable. If you watch the first 50sec of the vid, you are serving to the middle of the table which makes it easier for your opponent. Then at the 55sec mark, you serve to your opponent short forehand side which have proven effective since you won the point due to opponent's error.

Takeaways: you need to be more mindful on where you aim your serves. A good routine will be to serve forehand short and backhand long. Once your opponent is focusing on the extreme ends of the table, you can mix in middle and backhand short to throw them off every now and then

In this vid, you been missing backhand. You seem to struggle with the timing to hit the ball with your backhand. Based on the video, you drive more with your backhand. This will require you to contact the ball at the highest point which you managed to do during the backhand rally. However, whenever your opponent push the ball to your backhand, you waited for the ball way passed the optimal time to drive the ball. For those type of balls, you need to backhand loop them instead.

Takeaway: understand what type of shots can you make base on the timing you contact the ball and make good shot selection during matches

Yeah I have worked on serve placement and placement in general cuz I tend to place the ball where my opponent is all the time.

My BH has been my weaker side. In this tournament I had equipment which did not help or suit my BH at all (W968 Prov with D09C BH). I have since switched to Viscaria and D80 on BH and had some BH training with higher level friends to help with timing

 

[joshmak10]

The serve is really nice and clean.

I'm not gonna recommend anything about your technique, since a lot of people will do so. The only thing I will say about the technique is your BH top spin. That's what we call a stiff arm over here. You need to learn to loosen up, gather strength and accelerate with your BH. Otherwise you have a hard time controlling your shots and are really deceptive to any kind of spin. Suggesting to start with a small motion instead off full arm.

So back to the part I want to talk about. The simples way to increase your match is to stop staring and start preparing. For example you chopped long and your first instinct is to keep chopping. However, the first instinct should be preparing to block or topspin depending on opponents action. This way you are prepared for the opponent strong shots instead of the rather weaker chop. What I can see in the first video is all your own topspin are split decisions after you realize that a chop would be hard to play.

Yes, everything i said to ck’s advice goes to yours too and I have worked on being more relaxed in general during play. Thank you to you both for the advice

 

[ck1407]

Yeah I have worked on serve placement and placement in general cuz I tend to place the ball where my opponent is all the time.

My BH has been my weaker side. In this tournament I had equipment which did not help or suit my BH at all (W968 Prov with D09C BH). I have since switched to Viscaria and D80 on BH and had some BH training with higher level friends to help with timing

Remember to stick to 1 equipment setup and avoid unnecessary changes since each blade gives different feedback. With each successful shot you make, it creates a certain feedback to your hand which creates a muscle memory for yourself. This gives more time to think about placement rather than "am I doing this with the right technique?" during matches since your instincts kick in from the build up muscle memory

Improving is a great way to enjoy the sport so train hard and hope you produce even better results in your future matches

 

[joshmak10]

Remember to stick to 1 equipment setup and avoid unnecessary changes since each blade gives different feedback. With each successful shot you make, it creates a certain feedback to your hand which creates a muscle memory for yourself. This gives more time to think about placement rather than "am I doing this with the right technique?" during matches since your instincts kick in from the build up muscle memory

Improving is a great way to enjoy the sport so train hard and hope you produce even better results in your future matches

So a bit of context. My blade before was a FZD ALC that I have used for year and learned table tennis on it. Then I sold It and got a discounted W968 provincial. Obviously I was very used to outer carbon so I switched back to a new Viscaria and now I’m playing better than ever before. This setup I have with H3N Blue sponge on FH and D80 on BH has made me much more consistent and powerful while having good control in my strokes. I believe that my muscle memeory was used to the FZD ALC and that’s why I struggled with the BH of the W968. Plus a hard rubber like 09C on Bh did not help me technique either.

 

[WheatBeers]

Hi Everyone.
My question pertains to serve placement. A lot of folks here talk about spin and different kinds of service techniques. In my limited opinion, I find that what wins me a lot of points is serving just behind the net of my right handed opponents bh side from my bh corner. I am a righty using a fh serve motion and serving side backspin. I find that the opponents I play can not flip it back on their bh side and it's so short behind the net pulling them off the table as well. Any comments on my serve strategy and more importantly how would better players return it? Thanks.

 

[blahness]

Hi Everyone.
My question pertains to serve placement. A lot of folks here talk about spin and different kinds of service techniques. In my limited opinion, I find that what wins me a lot of points is serving just behind the net of my right handed opponents bh side from my bh corner. I am a righty using a fh serve motion and serving side backspin. I find that the opponents I play can not flip it back on their bh side and it's so short behind the net pulling them off the table as well. Any comments on my serve strategy and more importantly how would better players return it? Thanks.

From this position good inverted players can do a lot, from loop (as the 2nd bounce is off the table it can be looped), chiquita, strawberry, short push, long push, sideswipe, etc..

 

[WheatBeers]

Merry Christmas blahness! Your advice is greatly appreciated. And also very true indeed as I quickly discovered playing intermediate opponents. I have observed that they will adjust their return position to be diagonally opposite. Therefore allowing easier reach to do the aforementioned shots. I guess it works better on players with limited mobility. Would anyone like to comment on good service positions on the table that I can serve to? Thanks.

 

[WheatBeers]

It has to be very low and close to the net with heavy side back spin if it’s unflippable on their backhand side. If it’s truly like that then even a pro player will either push short or push long if they want to kill your opening loop or start a rally right away. Tho the quality of pushing is exponentially better as you start playing better players.

Happy boxing day Robin. Thank you for your advice. I have been practicing my serve to that part of the table after watching several youtubes. Even though I am using Uranus I find that for my level of rec play is very adequate to the extent that it annoys the returner all who are older adults with limited mobility. Once I sense that they are too used to this short and wide service, I go down the line with a top spin or flat service. From my perspective I am forcing 2 options on the receiver, short and wide to their rh bh or long and fast to the fh. Once again, how would better players handle this service strategy. Much appreciated and hope everyone is enjoying a good holiday.

I saw this video on YT. Seems very applicable.