Technique correction - Trying to Fix my FH backstroke + hitting through the sponge

[andymagata]

Did someone talk about forehand stroke?

 

[andymagata]

I have a little bit of advice to give, but understand if it is not a good one for you. I try to follow it myself.

1 Watch that video many times
2 Do 5 minutes of shadow practice trying to imitate the stroke every day for a year
3 Do not overanalyze every bit and piece - I have a theory that the perfect form for you will come naturally when you are ready for it
4 At the table, consistently treat each and every ball as an opportunity to improve!

 

[Zezima]

I can feel soreness on my front side shoulder now. I wonder if its really the technique or just too much roboter (first time this many fh topspins in a row. Entire session I was just doing this exact ball).
In that "The Perfect Forehand Loop HD" Video I mean he hits different balls aswell but I don't see him lifting his arm before starting to accelerate forwards. I think that also messes up my chain and the weight goes more to the left sometimes and somehow my front shoulder activates more.

Right now I need someone who can really see the mistake in detail why my chain breaks and how to fix it without shortening the backswing. I want to learn the whole motion first shortening it later when the ball comes faster is a smaller problem later that I can fix I think.

I also want to experiment with a more individual backswing next time and see what happens if I don't lift up my hand before accelerating forwards for example. Also my whip at my elbow/forarm when accelerating forearm is jiggly. Like its a whip but its too big motion and too "loose/uncontrolled" When I look at FZD whip motion its like 2/10 mine is like 9/10 in terms of bigness of the motion.

I am 99% sure the wrong part is at my elbow atleast you can read it from my elbow. The movement of the elbow is too small and jiggly. It's not in a plane and if its in a linear plane its sometimes too short. But these are things that are hard to see when doing the stroke without any outside live feedback.

I also want to film myself at a slower pace and see if my form gets better (I hope so) and at what pace it breaks down. It will look like something between a drive (pure hit) and a brush loop like 5/10 of my current power that I used in that last video.

 

[andymagata]

Do the japanese spaghetti excercise, let your arms hang down beside your body and let them swing freely when you turn your upper body left and right. It will help relax those muscles.

 

[Zezima]

Do the japanese spaghetti excercise, let your arms hang down beside your body and let them swing freely when you turn your upper body left and right. It will help relax those muscles.

my problem I was talking about is that I am too relaxed now.
And because I am too relaxed you can see my forearm open up and my elbow a bit unstable during the forward motion. I need to find the right "tension" so the arm is not wiggling during the forward movement without it being too stiff.

 

[Zezima]

Alright.

2nd Session: Focus on: Activating the Sponge

My goal this time was not to care too much about what each body part has to do. I only tried to relax with the arm and turn my hips back and inwards. Sometimes if I reminded myself I did turn my hips forwards instead of from right to left. But that needs more practise to automate it.

I actually have no clue how my form looks like. But I can finally say that I now know how it feels like to topspin by activating the sponge and it feels great. The Blade gives me really good feedback. (All those years wasted with the long 5 and W968 - Great blade terrible to understand the feeling of activating the sponge its just a super soft feeling while playing with hard to activate rubbers combined with only "controlled" slow topsheet loops)

Anyway.. I will stick with this blade for now. I really got addicted to these topspins. Each hit gives me extra dopamine. Before I only got that when I really brushed the ball and my opp would block it out cuz of the spin. But now watching them not even able to hold the racket and that "click" sound is really satisfying.

The timestamps for different drills in the video: I made chapters this time to make it clear when the next "drill" starts
0-4:54
4:54-9:18
9:18-16:10
16:10-18:19
18:19-End Match
Bonuspoint 19:29


If you can only watch for a short time then watch the Section 3(16:10-18:19)

Analyses with @NakiMaki:

1. Hitting too late and that causes the elbow to be wobbly. Acceleration needs to happen earlier. Forearm has to start closing already before hitting the ball.
2. More impact BEHIND the ball. Hit the ball more
3. If the incoming ball is fast -> Hit the ball less at the back / Use less Power
4. Forearm hold it stable - Don't throw it backwards /skipping a stone

Best shot 16:13
17:04 2 good TS

There was one shot in Section 3 (I couldn't find it right now) where the rubber bottoms out I think. It happens once or twice so its not a big deal. But thats a good sign that I am actually trying to get the most out of the sponge aswell.

 

[jk1980]

you are so enthusiastic about improving, i am sure you will give this arm cast a shot. It will definitely force you to use a different stroke. I just searched my mails and saw that i bought it via superbuy which is a service that buys stuff in asia for you, in case it is not available for shipping to europe.

Hope this link works

https://www.superbuy.com/en/page/buy/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fitem.taobao.com%2Fitem.htm%3Fid%3D606717725155%26ali_trackid%3D2%3Amm_117358474_33384934_118778578

I just found somebody on aliexpress who seems to sell it. Thats probably the most easy way to get it for cheap:

https://de.aliexpress.com/item/1005009108236573.html?channel=twinner​

good luck

 

[Zezima]

Info: Added notes on my Session from 16.12.2025 and what I will be working on next.

I am also using a personal OneNote to track and write down useful comments, feedback anything that is worth noting to me.

I see this as an entire project itself and it also motivates me a lot.

I will go into every training session with atleast 1 thing in mind to fix. Maybe it will take a week or longer on some aspect I don't care. I only care about progress. I think I will make the videos shorter aswell or atleast each drill down to max 2-3min (first do a warmup of that same drill for 2-3min and then start filming it) .
Right now the Drills are very "1 dimensional" without much footwork at all. But thats gonna change if I am satisfied with the base technique and consistency.

Yesterdays multiball (section 3) showed that I am quite consistent already to land the shots on the table. The goal will be to have more higher quality shots still. So I will not be satisfied just making the ball land on the table but go further than that. Right now I also understand what sound and what feeling I am looking for (thanks to this blade).

 

[ajtatosmano2]

Didn't read through all the replies, but I've seen other mentioning what I think as well: your FH stroke is not bad at all. Don't bother focusing on elbow, wrist etc. Try to fix your footwork, that seems to be the no.1 issue with your play. Keep your center of gravity down and forward, you're quite tall, look at Omar Assar's posture for reference. If you want to hit harder, just tighten your core and don't be afraid of using more power for the rotation, don't overthink it.

 

[Zezima]

A bit late but here is from the 3rd Session:

Again many Drills. Just skip forwards otherwise. 2 Matches in the end.

A topspin I didn't quite understand what went wrong is this for example:

5:16 Why did this Topspin not work?


Best shots (only a few there are more):
2:49
4:10
5:00
7:20
7:33
16:48
34:40
36:30

1. Match (starts a bit earlier):

38:33 good point
2. Match against youth coach I lost 2-3 9-11 in my Last league game. Won this time quite comfortable.
--------------
@NakiMaki what we analysed and discussed:

• Timing at contact is good now. I am hitting the ball more infront.
• Now I need to focus on brush feeling to give the ball a higher arc for more consistency
• Elbow needs to be in a straight line.
• Go more upwards at contact. Accelerating into the ball is good now. Focus should be more on HAND now
• On Higher balls need racket more open not so closed.
• I need to turn hips into the ball and more Upwards motion with the arm -> Trying out at compression to loop as high as possible and experiment with it.
• Wider stance
• Borrowing power faster shots I need to focus more on brushing less on accelerating myself (hitting into the ball less)

Still unsure of D80 on my BH. Makes me passive on some shots because I am afraid of the bouncy effect of the rubber. I don't really need extra speed from the rubber. Might glue d09c and give it a shot on this blade.

 

[songdavid98]

A bit late but here is from the 3rd Session:

5:16 Why did this Topspin not work?

5:16
The ball is lower.

Compare with 5:21
The ball is higher.

The harder you hit, the more you need to care about these small details

 

[ajtatosmano2]

I watched quite a lot from the video. For me it still seems like your FH form is quite good, sometimes just the shots need more spin, more arc. I've seen misses when you had to move but mostly when dealing with more dead balls, then you sometimes tried to attack them with your usual fast and low loop and they've gone into the net. Otherwise you play well.
As general advice not going far from the table, but maintaining the distance you use in your drills and just trying to get a more arc (just a little bit, not saying to do slow/high arc loops) would be good.
Why did the ball at 5:16 hit the net? It's just a bad contact, accelerating a tiny bit later than needed so the rubber didn't grab the ball enough, maybe your hand was too loose, impossible to tell, just by looking at the motion it could've been a good shot as well. Small detail what I would describe as 'general skill', which only improves when you train more and with time you get a better feeling for it.

 

[Zezima]

I watched quite a lot from the video. For me it still seems like your FH form is quite good, sometimes just the shots need more spin, more arc. I've seen misses when you had to move but mostly when dealing with more dead balls, then you sometimes tried to attack them with your usual fast and low loop and they've gone into the net. Otherwise you play well.
As general advice not going far from the table, but maintaining the distance you use in your drills and just trying to get a more arc (just a little bit, not saying to do slow/high arc loops) would be good.
Why did the ball at 5:16 hit the net? It's just a bad contact, accelerating a tiny bit later than needed so the rubber didn't grab the ball enough, maybe your hand was too loose, impossible to tell, just by looking at the motion it could've been a good shot as well. Small detail what I would describe as 'general skill', which only improves when you train more and with time you get a better feeling for it.

Yeah I am not at a point yet where I can control these fast balls where I focus on activating the sponge. Still couldn't figure out the threshhold.

Appearently if I activate the sponge I get more spin and it lands on the table and if I hit too thin (same speed as with thr thicker contact) and brush it can go out still. So thats a bit of mindfuck to learn still.

Getting enough arc while hitting thicker is also harder especially if the ball is not so low. When the ball is low I seem to do well by adding arc. But at a higher ball I keep thinking I will hit it out so I hit more forwards with a closed angle.

I also miss many balls not trusting my gut and thinking about my backstroke. Dont want it to look like my old technique. But in matches when I dont think about my technique I bring those balls on the table.

Still same issues as the training before. Only thing I got rid of fast was the timing when hitting the ball. Its more in the front now. So thats good atleast.

Its also hard to track consistency. Maybe I should start counting how many topspins I can do in a row but for that I would also need a better blocking partner.. the moment I hit a good 60-80% topspin they fail to block.

The drill with the topspin serve into that girld backhand was also quite hard for me because of the angle she brought the ball back. Even If I hit with fh I stay out of position for the next ball.


Anyway step by step. Next Sessions I will work on getting a good arc while hitting somewhar hard still. I prob just need to use more wrist at contact

 

[schrodingerskoalabear]

you are so enthusiastic about improving, i am sure you will give this arm cast a shot. It will definitely force you to use a different stroke. I just searched my mails and saw that i bought it via superbuy which is a service that buys stuff in asia for you, in case it is not available for shipping to europe.

Hope this link works

https://www.superbuy.com/en/page/buy/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fitem.taobao.com%2Fitem.htm%3Fid%3D606717725155%26ali_trackid%3D2%3Amm_117358474_33384934_118778578

I just found somebody on aliexpress who seems to sell it. Thats probably the most easy way to get it for cheap:

https://de.aliexpress.com/item/1005009108236573.html?channel=twinner​

good luck

Is this https://www.ebay.com/itm/317626397716 similar to the j31 or is it a different product altogether?

 

[schrodingerskoalabear]

I actually have no clue how my form looks like. But I can finally say that I now know how it feels like to topspin by activating the sponge and it feels great. The Blade gives me really good feedback. (All those years wasted with the long 5 and W968 - Great blade terrible to understand the feeling of activating the sponge its just a super soft feeling while playing with hard to activate rubbers combined with only "controlled" slow topsheet loops)
sponge aswell.

I have similar issues for FH and have been trying to develop a more "contact" based stroke. I have been using Long 5 for about 6 months and am wondering if I should change to develop more feeling.

Could you say what the biggest differences for you have been since you switched to a wood blade?

 

[jk1980]

Is this https://www.ebay.com/itm/317626397716 similar to the j31 or is it a different product altogether?

It's different and funny enough that the pictures for the product actually show 3 different versions. Mine is more rigid, while the product in the link mainly shows something strap based which you probably could recreate with two regular belts

 

[Zezima]

I have similar issues for FH and have been trying to develop a more "contact" based stroke. I have been using Long 5 for about 6 months and am wondering if I should change to develop more feeling.

Could you say what the biggest differences for you have been since you switched to a wood blade?

So in short: you get the feedback of how much you activated the sponge better than with a long 5. There you don't really get that feedback. Its just a soft aka light feeling when you hit the ball. You can barely feel the ball going in and out.

 

[dingyibvs]

So in short: you get the feedback of how much you activated the sponge better than with a long 5. There you don't really get that feedback. Its just a soft aka light feeling when you hit the ball. You can barely feel the ball going in and out.

I'd argue that it's the opposite. You did get the feedback, and the feedback was that you were not hitting into the sponge and blade enough. In some ways what you describe is kinda like Goku training with weights. Once you take the weights off, i.e. switch to a setup that's much easier to activate, you realize just how good your swing has gotten.

When I first got D09c for example, I thought it was a hard rubber, difficult to activate. I'd marvel at how easy my old T05 was to use whenever I switched back to it. After using H3 for a while though activating D09c now feels like a trivial exercise, it's like how I felt back then when I switched back to T05. So don't lament the "wasted" time, I say you didn't waste it at all. You strapped "weights" to your arm and that's made you a stronger player!

 

[StreamOfWater]

A bit late but here is from the 3rd Session:

Again many Drills. Just skip forwards otherwise. 2 Matches in the end.

A topspin I didn't quite understand what went wrong is this for example:

5:16 Why did this Topspin not work?


Best shots (only a few there are more):
2:49
4:10
5:00
7:20
7:33
16:48
34:40
36:30

1. Match (starts a bit earlier):

38:33 good point
2. Match against youth coach I lost 2-3 9-11 in my Last league game. Won this time quite comfortable.
--------------
@NakiMaki what we analysed and discussed:

• Timing at contact is good now. I am hitting the ball more infront.
• Now I need to focus on brush feeling to give the ball a higher arc for more consistency
• Elbow needs to be in a straight line.
• Go more upwards at contact. Accelerating into the ball is good now. Focus should be more on HAND now
• On Higher balls need racket more open not so closed.
• I need to turn hips into the ball and more Upwards motion with the arm -> Trying out at compression to loop as high as possible and experiment with it.
• Wider stance
• Borrowing power faster shots I need to focus more on brushing less on accelerating myself (hitting into the ball less)

Still unsure of D80 on my BH. Makes me passive on some shots because I am afraid of the bouncy effect of the rubber. I don't really need extra speed from the rubber. Might glue d09c and give it a shot on this blade.

The topspin at 5:16 failed because your arm path was too horizontal. The swing needs to be diagonal — from bottom to top. Your elbow drifts away from the body, and at times the motion turns into a scooping action. Keep the elbow tucked in, close to yourself

Overall, your forehand topspin technique isn’t truly fundamentally wrong. The real problem is rotation, swing trajectory, and tension. Your arm is too stiff. You need to relax it and practically let it go during the swing, keeping no tension. Start with the elbow close to the body, racket near the side or slightly behind the thigh in the backswing. Push off with the leg, contact the ball beside your body, as in the ball needs to be almost parallel to your body, right side, which you already do fairly well

Important detail: the elbow should stay tight to the body at the start. Only release it once acceleration has already begun. That’s what creates a proper outer arc and real acceleration. Find the contact point where your acceleration peaks — that’s where the ball should be struck

Your follow-through also needs work. It should finish around eye level or higher. Right now, you’re often forcing the racket down at the end, pressing down, which kills penetration. The goal is to drive through the ball forward, not press it down. However, this issue mainly seems to surface because of your height — you seem like a tall person, so you need to assume a wider stance and squat a little more

P.S. Your biggest issue is overcomplication. You’re paying attention to details that don’t matter while missing the fundamentals — "activating sponge", feedback this, activating that... It's like trying to study the inside of the leaf without seeing it as a whole, or its shape. Table tennis works like a machine, except it's your body — the more unnecessary moving parts you add, the faster it breaks. Keep movements compact and close to the body. Anything that drifts away loses control and will break down under pressure. Move your feet. And above all: keep the elbow beside your body during forehand attacks. If it leaves before a proper kinetic chain is initiated, the whole stroke collapses because that means you have already done something wrong besides the technique itself — wasn't fast enough to prepare, perhaps too far away from the ball, poor positioning

That's my 2 cents. I have nothing else to add. Hopefully it helps. I have been training my technique rigourously since I started (little over 2 years ago), so, if needed, I may provide what I deem to be a correct stroke in "shadow form" which has been approved by multiple actual professionals, trainers, high level players

 

[StreamOfWater]

I just skimmed through your videos. You are so stiff, and i had the exact same issue a little while back. Forehand is very stiff backhand is pretty good. It's atleast not as stiff of course consistency could be better. Your forehand is mainly forearm driven and it's probably because you are strong enough to get decent quality with this type of stroke. If you take a 11 yo. kid they would not be able loop like you, but they can get good quality with the correct technique. This is often why adults who start a bit later develop this "weird" technique. Also you said you play with H3N 39degree, i play the exact same. You are almost always not hitting through the sponge, you can hear the *thud* sound when you hit and not the *Crack* that H3 usually produces. This is because you only get into the topsheet and a little into the sponge. But when you do get that *crack* sound you tend to shoot long or into the net, this is because your swingpath is wrong, and the angle you contact the ball with is wrong.

My suggestion for the forehand would be try to play a bit with the robot. Here you should focus on relaxing the arm and the hand (dont grip the racket to death), lengthen the backswing, straighten the arm and just before contact accelerate with your strong power. Make sure the swingpath is the exact same when you start the forward motion, it should be a straight line going forward and upwards, if you change the direction of the power you will lose it to momentum. Most of the forward momentum into the ball also starts at the hips. Your hips and arm move in unison not in succesion. First hips while hips are moving relax arm and the accelerate before hitting the ball.

Backhand is okay when you have time. Often when you miss is because your backswing is too big for the amount of time you have. You focus a lot on relaxing and retracting the hand then accelerating with your forearm. Which in itself is "textbook" for looping. You gotta remember though if the opponent gives you a speedy ball then a big backswing will lead to inconsistency. You HAVE to develop a shortened stroke aswell, look at top players backhand to backhand rallies, its not big loops with big swings, its close to the table short swings using the speed from the ball. Try again with the robot and focus on learning a shortened swing aswell. When you can adequately judge which shot to use, then you backhand is fine.


View attachment 39496
View attachment 39495

I tried to make a video of me showing how the forehand should be moving. Here the backswing goes back then its linear, and when resetting i go down then back, then relaxing and make a linear stroke. Try to look at the difference between this stroke and your stroke.

I hope this helps ))

This reference for motion seems okay, although the weight on the right leg is evidently not loaded properly — no tension, no concentration of power. Meaning the ceiling of the stroke is low. It would be unwise to make habit of this