Daily Table Tennis Chit Chat

[Takkyu_wa_inochi]

Sounds like not the best week for us TTDers

I had a bad day at the club too. Went to the club with Butterfly tables, and I just can't adjust to it quickly. So many whiffs, and even against blocks I have no confidence to re-loop, which is usually bread and butter for me. Lost every doubles and singles match! Last Sunday I did well there, but that was my second straight day playing there, so I felt a lot more comfortable with the table.

I guess the all we can do after days like that is to look for some silver linings. I think I started doing better at the end by really looking the ball in and really pay active attention to timing on both the BH and the FH side. I'm already a bit weak with the timing on my BH side, playing a sticky table gives me even more trouble. Oh the FH side I don't usually pay much attention to the timing, but perhaps I should, and perhaps even on more familiar tables I can get better timing doing that. When FZD loops you see him swinging his head right and left as he looks the ball in and out, maybe I should do that too.

Last Sunday was one of the biggest tournaments of the year for us.
But I went there with no confidence due to being 3 (1 then 2) weeks out to a lower back injury and just had 10 days to come back.
While my performance wasn’t a total disaster, and as a team we qualified to the 50+ finals later this year. Only won an easy doubles in one of the 2 team events, lost a singles there too against a young guy way too strong - but played crap except for a few very good points.

And in the singles event lost 0-3 (-9 -8 -9) to a younger guy with SP on BH. I think in a good day I had a very good chance to win but in the money time i made receive errors under pressure. But where lack of confidence was worst was in my own serve games. In rallies I was doing well.

——-

On another topic, A very experimented player told me that to build confidence and technique it’s better to train always on the same table same conditions for a while. It goes against adaptability which is crucial in our sport

What do you guys think ?

 

[Tyce]

I think that's great, with more experience on one venue you can understand the difference between it and other venues better. Constantly switching between them will not give you a good indication of the reason behind the differences you're experiencing that day.
Of course you can just always blame the table and the hall when you feel off, but you might be missing factors that you have influence on and can fix

 

[Archosaurus]

Progress from this weekend:

Regressing in strokes. Will need to drill a bit more and chase that feeling in games. Strokes are better when under very low pressure against very bad opponents. This will probably just improve automatically with time as I get more used to it again.

My serves are consistently low and short now, and I've started placing them precisely again, but spin is lacking. Part of this may be 2.5+ years old rubbers left to oxidize; I might borrow someone's bat and serve with it for a minute to confirm. I don't think my contact is optimal but it feels like it should produce more friction with how much I load the sponge. My fast serve is lower, it was a bit bouncy in the first weeks.

They however still result in a lot of nets and popups because my deception is very good. Nobody's getting anything back in an ideal way unless it's a joke serve, so I guess lack of heavy spin for now is acceptable.

I've also started developing a reverse pendulum, although deception is nonexistant for now as I work on getting comfortable. That's one thing I didn't have before my break.

 

[dingyibvs]

Last Sunday was one of the biggest tournaments of the year for us.
But I went there with no confidence due to being 3 (1 then 2) weeks out to a lower back injury and just had 10 days to come back.
While my performance wasn’t a total disaster, and as a team we qualified to the 50+ finals later this year. Only won an easy doubles in one of the 2 team events, lost a singles there too against a young guy way too strong - but played crap except for a few very good points.

And in the singles event lost 0-3 (-9 -8 -9) to a younger guy with SP on BH. I think in a good day I had a very good chance to win but in the money time i made receive errors under pressure. But where lack of confidence was worst was in my own serve games. In rallies I was doing well.

——-

On another topic, A very experimented player told me that to build confidence and technique it’s better to train always on the same table same conditions for a while. It goes against adaptability which is crucial in our sport

What do you guys think ?

I think it depends. If you're developing a set of technique, it's probably a good idea to keep the variables to a minimum, kind of like how you probably don't wanna EJ while you're focused on revamping your game.

I think that's great, with more experience on one venue you can understand the difference between it and other venues better. Constantly switching between them will not give you a good indication of the reason behind the differences you're experiencing that day.
Of course you can just always blame the table and the hall when you feel off, but you might be missing factors that you have influence on and can fix

I think if there's one venue that you're very comfortable with, then venturing out can really help. Venue change to me is a lot like equipment change. A little more subtle, but they share many similarities.

For one, just warming up with some standard shots doesn't help much. You may feel some differences with the first few shots, but you rapidly adjust because everything is the same pace, everything's in rhythm. Just like with equipment, you really need to play some matches to know its true behavior.

Secondly, and maybe it's just me, but I feel that equipment/venue changes can expose some deficiencies in your game as well. When I had worse technique, the difference between equipment felt huge, I couldn't even hit warm up shots when I changed from the W968 to the Viscaria, for example. But as I improved, equipment changes felt much more subtle, and I feel much more affected by weight/balance/thickness changes than I do with equipment characteristic changes.

With venue changes, I think I see some similar things. Bad habits which are occasionally an issue in familiar venues can get magnified. A slight misjudgment that would've resulted in a suboptimal contact would instead result in a complete whiff, or maybe a poor coordination between the body and the arm that would've reduced power by 10% instead reduces it by 50%. It's kind of like how I used to loop with a huge amount of side spin, I kind of slap into the ball then try to brush over it. The issue was only the side spin when I was using the old HL5, but with the Viscaria it simply tanked into the net as it didn't have the dwell to allow a shot like that consistently.

 

[Tyce]

I did a test run of my recently acquired Fzd alc tonight. I put a well used H3N orange sponge on it, and a decent but used C-1.
What a blade. The feeling is outstanding and just like I thought there is significantly more control than I felt using Pro 01. The whole thing just oozes synergy.
I would need a lot more hours to make it work for matches, but the potential is there. The innerforce alc feels like a flimsy piece of kit after using Fzd but I did experience that same phenomenon again of training with H3 and then just ripping through the G-1 with ease.
There's a lot to consider this off season.

 

[dingyibvs]

I did a test run of my recently acquired Fzd alc tonight. I put a well used H3N orange sponge on it, and a decent but used C-1.
What a blade. The feeling is outstanding and just like I thought there is significantly more control than I felt using Pro 01. The whole thing just oozes synergy.
I would need a lot more hours to make it work for matches, but the potential is there. The innerforce alc feels like a flimsy piece of kit after using Fzd but I did experience that same phenomenon again of training with H3 and then just ripping through the G-1 with ease.
There's a lot to consider this off season.

A good piece of FZD ALC is really awesome. I'm thinking of switching back to it after my current rubbers wear out next month. I've been transitioning to a more compact motion on both sides, so I think the FZD will suit me better. It's just really hard to hit into the Q968 except with counterloops. I actually just ordered a new FZD with a bit of fish scale from prott, so hopefully that solves the backup blade issue as well.

My elbow's been hurting, maybe from too much BH practice, and I've been busy at work so I'm taking a few days off. During this time I'm just doing some thinking about how to progress my game forward based on my recent matches. On Sat I was playing a RPB guy with a solid service/receive game and a great push and BH counters. He had an atrocious opening loop, but I wasn't playing to win so I mostly wanted to practice opening up against his well positioned, spinny pushes and if my BH can overpower his BH. As mentioned in my previous post, I didn't play well, and I think it revealed some weaknesses I need to work on.

One thing I worked on during the matches against that guy that I think I did well was BH flicks. I was able to position myself much better, getting up to the ball instead of reaching with my hand and flick with the wrist only.

With my BH, as mentioned in my previous week's posts I wanted to find out just how aggressive I can be. I think I was pushing it a bit too far. Even pros don't try to kill every ball. I think I need to get into a mindset of being willing to play more shots instead of trying to kill everything. That'll be a process that'll come with experience, knowing what balls can be attacked more strongly than others.

With my FH I need to really concentrate on synergy between the body and the arm. My form is still a bit too arm based. I'd rotate my hip and then before my racket reaches the ball I'd start swinging my arm forward. This results in weaker energy transfer, but more than that, it means I need to commit to an arm motion before I need to. I think this contributes to timing issues which are exacerbated when I play in less comfortable venues. I'm working on the same thing on the BH side but it's a known issue at every venue, I'm realizing now though that I also need to work on it on thr FH side.

For my feet I need to be much more active before the open up. I've been working a lot on footwork during continuous loops, but I really need to get better before even getting to that stage. Against a player with good receives and pushes, he's not gonna give me something comfortable to open up against. I need to work on positioning myself so I can be comfortable. One big issue is that when I pivot I only move the right foot back, instead of also left foot forward, so I often end up too far from the ball and have to reach to loop.

 

[Archosaurus]

Really bad day today, I needed more recovery, so my calves were on fire. Also missing a lot of shots barely grazing the ball or hitting the edge. Part of this might be due to mostly playing with beginners who I don't really want to kill the ball with, but I should still be able to perform consistent 30-50% power shots.

Developed a bit more spin on my backhand, though, after changing to Vega Europe DF from Focus III. I planned to play on it for a month or two more to gauge it more, but it felt a bit slick, didn't really grab the ball at all anymore, so I figured it's time to change it because it's not exactly an expensive rubber and it was making me flat hit on my backhand. Maybe it took the 2.5+ year storage badly and got really oxidized and hard; the Hurricane III doesn't seem to have lost any grip.

Impressions on Vega Europe DF from a few hours of play is that it's indeed very soft, but for a tensor it's extremely slow. Maybe part of it is my 5ply wood blade. I think it would be just fine for a beginner rubber. It doesn't seem super spin sensitive either. I hit a bit on the forehand and I think even for me it's too soft there, you can really feel it bottom. It's fine for a backhand rubber and I don't foresee changing it out this year.

 

[latej]

My elbow's been hurting, maybe from too much BH practice, and I've been busy at work so I'm taking a few days off. During this time I'm just doing some thinking about how to progress my game forward based on my recent matches. On Sat I was playing a RPB guy with a solid service/receive game and a great push and BH counters. He had an atrocious opening loop, but I wasn't playing to win so I mostly wanted to practice opening up against his well positioned, spinny pushes and if my BH can overpower his BH. As mentioned in my previous post, I didn't play well, and I think it revealed some weaknesses I need to work on.

I have the same problem, it hurts in certain movements, like when I rotate the hand to the right, while there is some angle in the elbow. It doesn't hurt during practice though, but feels worse after practice. The season is over, I took small gap, did short fasting cca 3,5 days, it feels good, can only recommend. Still don't know the root cause and what exercise would help. Apart from that, being able to train with stronger players from another club last season is like heavenly gift to me...

 

[Archosaurus]

I have the same problem, it hurts in certain movements, like when I rotate the hand to the right, while there is some angle in the elbow. It doesn't hurt during practice though, but feels worse after practice. The season is over, I took small gap, did short fasting cca 3,5 days, it feels good, can only recommend. Still don't know the root cause and what exercise would help. Apart from that, being able to train with stronger players from another club last season is like heavenly gift to me...

Not medical advice, but I have some experience personally:

Rub your forearm muscles around, with some good power, and see if they are tender at any point. It shouldn't hurt even a little bit if you rub it and press load into it. If it does, you may have stiff muscles that need some work done.

 

[latej]

Not medical advice, but I have some experience personally:

Rub your forearm muscles around, with some good power, and see if they are tender at any point. It shouldn't hurt even a little bit if you rub it and press load into it. If it does, you may have stiff muscles that need some work done.

Thanks, it's located in the elbow, I feel no muscles there ;-)

 

[Archosaurus]

Thanks, it's located in the elbow, I feel no muscles there ;-)

Usually the tight spot is where the tendon meets the muscle, at that exact boundary. I've had to do a ton of scraping and pressure work on mine on various limbs and on my torso.

Of course if you're talking about the center of the ball joint then it's something different and you'd probably need a specialist.

 

[dingyibvs]

I have the same problem, it hurts in certain movements, like when I rotate the hand to the right, while there is some angle in the elbow. It doesn't hurt during practice though, but feels worse after practice. The season is over, I took small gap, did short fasting cca 3,5 days, it feels good, can only recommend. Still don't know the root cause and what exercise would help. Apart from that, being able to train with stronger players from another club last season is like heavenly gift to me...

Mine's kinda weird, it's over the medial epicondyle, which would be golfer's elbow. The TT motion that's more similar to the trailing arm of a golf swing would be FH, but my practice has been much more focused on the BH. Maybe the issue is more that I'm just gripping more tightly after my recent grip change. I'm not sure. I'm gonna treat it like I usually do with overuse injuries, adjust my technique, ice after practice plus some Ibuprofen, then heat in between practice days. Usually I'm able to work through it so we'll see.

 

[Takkyu_wa_inochi]

After many years trying, I managed in practice to receive short with 2 bounces and quality against a (knuckle/ slight topspin) serve. Best I could do used to be a receive with would go slightly off the short FH side of the table.

I was being told , just take the ball on the bounce with soft touch. But my setup is quite fast no matter how I tried the second bounce would go off.
So I gave up trying this receive in match and practicing it.

But today I realized the main missing detail is when I stepped i wasn’t putting enough weight on the right leg (and probably also too upright) so that naturally when I hit the ball, there would be room for that right leg (and the whole Body) to go forward as I play the ball and add (too much) momentum.
By putting weight my body becomes stable and I can control better.
I must remember the feeling and practice but it’s a new feeling to me

Also I’m adding something new that I’ve seen recently in 2 different videos, one from coach Xiao Han and one by Andras Levenko that in the short game we should aim for the white band of the net to keep the ball low.

That really helps a lot

 

[Tyce]

Mine's kinda weird, it's over the medial epicondyle, which would be golfer's elbow. The TT motion that's more similar to the trailing arm of a golf swing would be FH, but my practice has been much more focused on the BH. Maybe the issue is more that I'm just gripping more tightly after my recent grip change. I'm not sure. I'm gonna treat it like I usually do with overuse injuries, adjust my technique, ice after practice plus some Ibuprofen, then heat in between practice days. Usually I'm able to work through it so we'll see.

I've had both tennis and golfers variants. Golfers is usually caused by braking a stroke too early (mid acceleration) while tennis usually comes from too firm grip on high wrist movement strokes.
If you brake hard on the BH like you see some high level players do, that can be very stressful for your tendons. Gotta build that up really, really slow (if at all)

 

[TampaBayTableTennis]

Happy World Table Tennis Day!

 

[Tyce]

Happy World Table Tennis Day!

I'm celebrating it by missing the last league match of the season

 

[dingyibvs]

I've had both tennis and golfers variants. Golfers is usually caused by braking a stroke too early (mid acceleration) while tennis usually comes from too firm grip on high wrist movement strokes.
If you brake hard on the BH like you see some high level players do, that can be very stressful for your tendons. Gotta build that up really, really slow (if at all)

That makes sense, perhaps I was just overdoing it. I've still played a good amount the past couple of days, but just taking it a bit easier, and doing my typical more intensive self-care regimen for whenever I have a minor injury. Seems to be working pretty well, it barely hurts now even when I press on it (it never really hurt much with any particular movement).

 

[latej]

Looping strongly ;-)

 

[Takkyu_wa_inochi]

Participated today in another round robin type-tournament.

My rating dropped a lot recently so today I was put as the N1 out of 16 in the lower league.
I won all of my 6 matches, including 2 against players that I lost in our last encounter.
a younger guy that i lost 2-3 last year in a very tight match (iirc i had even one or more match point ?); and a veteran 1-3 a few weeks ago but tbh the fact that i didn't notice he was playing with an anti rubber had a lot to do with that.

So i feel like a battered stock which finally bounced on its support and hopefully starts a new uptrend.

I had a revelation today after decades of playing TT ... (!!)

when I play lower ranked guys or players that i think i "should" 90%+ win, I actually play too conservatively and passive. Which is a very big mistake especially in receive because at this level most serve have little spin and go long. So if Im not putting quality , sure i cannot use the spin because there's little and i would give an easy float ball that will be killed immediately.

2 days ago, in many matches i didn't put enough focus and play positively from the first point.. and thats how a supposedly easy match becomes complicated and where risks of getting under pressure and choking increase.

Every receive should be seen as an opportunity to seize to attack immediately and every serve must be chosen carefully with the next 3rd ball in mind.

Not only when playing against higher level opponents but against anyone.

 

[Tyce]

We did it! Finally managed to end 1st in the standings. Now it's a matter of decent preparations over the summer and do our best to get a foothold in the next class. This opens doors to finally get a rating boost too