Daily Table Tennis Chit Chat

[Tyce]

Well, we played the #2 team, including the #1 rated player in the group.

Right off the bat, it was me vs him. OX long pips BH lefty, I've played him twice before and lost both encounters - although the last time was a lot closer than the first.
This time though, he wasn't warmed up and I was, which lead to me taking the first two games pretty quickly. That gave me enough of a cushion to not get overly stressed losing the next one, and even when he took it to the decider I was mainly just working on getting myself in a good, relaxed state while keeping placement tight. In game 5 it clicked and I took it 11-8 which made me really happy and gave me 10 points of rating, which is more than I get in total on some other nights despite winning my games...
My teammate took down the other guy pretty easily, playing against a dead old rubber is quite a good matchup for him as he'll just slap through as soon as the ball is a cm too high
I managed to win that other singles game too, and we went home with a 3-2 win, extending our lead to 3 points going into the second half of the season. I *really* hope we can bring it home this time...

 

[andymagata]

I reduced the size of my Yinhe 980, glued on my fh short pips and bh Moon 12, and realized that I suddenly can play all my strokes with confidence. Stiga Pure, Haitian 5 ply and Yasaka Ma Lin Extra Offensive was not the answer. My path points towards the Defensive blades. I am happy I finally realized this.

 

[Takkyu_wa_inochi]

Went to a small round robin tournament but gave up after winning 3-0 the first match as I felt pain again in the lower back . Had some painkillers but didn’t do much and I spread tiger balm which was a mistake I think.

I still have some hope I can play this Sunday in a more important tournament

 

[NextLevel]

Couldn't play the past week - too busy studying. So I went to play today and jist as life would have it, I felt like I was on fire. Maybe the rest did my body well, was moving and hitting the ball and blocking on time. Then I hit my racket and finger on the table. Tore the rubber, cut my finger and to add injury to insult upon injury, hit my forehead with my racket on the follow through. Cut my forehand and finger invisibly and will have to glue through a torn fresh sheet of Tenergy 19. All salvageable but annoying. Life goes on...

 

[Takkyu_wa_inochi]

Went to a small round robin tournament but gave up after winning 3-0 the first match as I felt pain again in the lower back . Had some painkillers but didn’t do much and I spread tiger balm which was a mistake I think.

I still have some hope I can play this Sunday in a more important tournament

Well had to give up. my back still f*ckin hurts to do normal things such as standing up or curve a bit. Probably out of TT for a while, hoping its not much worse than that. It sucks.

That tournament on Sunday I won last year, couldn't defend my chances. My teammate whom i beat in the final last year took it this time without any strong opposition.

 

[NextLevel]

Well had to give up. my back still f*ckin hurts to do normal things such as standing up or curve a bit. Probably out of TT for a while, hoping its not much worse than that. It sucks.

That tournament on Sunday I won last year, couldn't defend my chances. My teammate whom i beat in the final last year took it this time without any strong opposition.

Not sure how old you are or how much gym work you do. But there are lots of mobility channels on youtube now. If I have any recommendation for young people, it would be to start these things young when they are somewhat easier. But even people at our age, especially people with desk jobs, can see massive benefit just getting into a program.

 

[NextLevel]

Not sure how old you are or how much gym work you do. But there are lots of mobility channels on youtube now. If I have any recommendation for young people, it would be to start these things young when they are somewhat easier. But even people at our age, especially people with desk jobs, can see massive benefit just getting into a program.

Right now there is a lot of hype around creatine supplementation. Skeptical but I am trying it out, 5-10g a day. Along with collagen peptides for my joints. I don't like gyms but I have 4 50 lb kettle bells at home and 1 100 lb one which will probably soon have a companion. Trying to regain my Asian squat and hip mobility. It is going to be long and painful but all these things are connected. Sitting ruins your body parts in ways that you don't realize until you challenge yourself with sports like table tennis.

 

[Takkyu_wa_inochi]

Not sure how old you are or how much gym work you do. But there are lots of mobility channels on youtube now. If I have any recommendation for young people, it would be to start these things young when they are somewhat easier. But even people at our age, especially people with desk jobs, can see massive benefit just getting into a program.

in my mid 50s.

I think the main cause is not TT, although the pain appeared first while playing.
I am moving and have been carrying a lot of big heavy boxes. I think i shouldn't have done that. 10+ years ago a friend predicted that i would suffer back problems later as my back clearly lacked flexibility.

At current stage, i can't do any exercise at all, actually the max pain (by far) i endured was just after I went to a sports massage therapist as I tried to put my pants on, i just shrieked. tried my best, it was impossible to stand up. so i had to lie down a bit for 15mns and then barely managed to stand up. Couldn't get on my bicycle to go home, I had to pull it. I don't want any more business with that therapist again.

The next day i had to use a stick to walk but now it doesn't feel necessary now.

But i am now wary to do any massage / exercise before i see a specialist as it could do more bad than good.

-
i dont like going to the gym, and one more "excuse" is a shoulder injury from 10 years ago + elbow injury last year, i'm afraid of reigniting this.
although occasionally when the TT hall is full i go there use some machines but mostly for lower body. but until Sep last year, i used to have an outdoor workout around weekly

I've heard about this creatine supplementation, that its even good for the brain so im taking a bit everyday as you say.

I know your knee joints are your main problem. have you tried regenerative treatments ? Thats what healed my elbow, and i would be looking to do that again for the back if i don't see any quick progress from more traditional treatment.

 

[NextLevel]

in my mid 50s.

I think the main cause is not TT, although the pain appeared first while playing.
I am moving and have been carrying a lot of big heavy boxes. I think i shouldn't have done that. 10+ years ago a friend predicted that i would suffer back problems later as my back clearly lacked flexibility.

At current stage, i can't do any exercise at all, actually the max pain (by far) i endured was just after I went to a sports massage therapist as I tried to put my pants on, i just shrieked. tried my best, it was impossible to stand up. so i had to lie down a bit for 15mns and then barely managed to stand up. Couldn't get on my bicycle to go home, I had to pull it. I don't want any more business with that therapist again.

The next day i had to use a stick to walk but now it doesn't feel necessary now.

But i am now wary to do any massage / exercise before i see a specialist as it could do more bad than good.

-
i dont like going to the gym, and one more "excuse" is a shoulder injury from 10 years ago + elbow injury last year, i'm afraid of reigniting this.
although occasionally when the TT hall is full i go there use some machines but mostly for lower body. but until Sep last year, i used to have an outdoor workout around weekly

I've heard about this creatine supplementation, that its even good for the brain so im taking a bit everyday as you say.

I know your knee joints are your main problem. have you tried regenerative treatments ? Thats what healed my elbow, and i would be looking to do that again for the back if i don't see any quick progress from more traditional treatment.

The collagen supplementation helps quite a bit. If I had to try regenerative stuff I woukd probably go forum shoulder if possible before knee. My shoulder really scares me lol.

But yeah everything is stiff. That is why I want to see how far I can go. One of the things I realize is that everyone is carying damage even the people who move well so structure isn't everything even if important. I also think I underestimate the importance of rest. But just so many things going on at once... table tennis is probably the least important of them...

And yes, I find that doing physical things outside of TT if you dont work out the body generally will cause the most damage, especially to the lower back. That is why I try to lift heavy things for fun. Doesn't have to be body builder heavy just something that I know I don't usually do ao my body will preserve something. It has paradoxically made my mower body and unrelated body parts stronger.

 

[dingyibvs]

I haven't been able to play much lately. Had a week of vacation in Korea, caught a cold there so was out of action most of last week. This week is gonna be busy at work and soccer is starting back up.

I went to a different club this weekend after being invited by a club mate. The level of competition was pretty low, but their Butterfly tables gave me a ton of trouble. I'm wondering if there are some tricks when dealing with changes in the table. The BTY tables are soooo much stickier than the Stiga and Joola tables I'm used to, and it makes me very hesitant with my attacks. It took like 5 matches before I finally felt comfortable. After thinking about it for a while, I'm thinking that maybe what I should do is use a smaller motion, hit the ball closer to my body, and take the ball a little bit later to compensate for the unfamiliar ball trajectory after the bounce. What do you guys think?

 

[NextLevel]

I haven't been able to play much lately. Had a week of vacation in Korea, caught a cold there so was out of action most of last week. This week is gonna be busy at work and soccer is starting back up.

I went to a different club this weekend after being invited by a club mate. The level of competition was pretty low, but their Butterfly tables gave me a ton of trouble. I'm wondering if there are some tricks when dealing with changes in the table. The BTY tables are soooo much stickier than the Stiga and Joola tables I'm used to, and it makes me very hesitant with my attacks. It took like 5 matches before I finally felt comfortable. After thinking about it for a while, I'm thinking that maybe what I should do is use a smaller motion, hit the ball closer to my body, and take the ball a little bit later to compensate for the unfamiliar ball trajectory after the bounce. What do you guys think?

Dealing with different playing environments (ball, table, playing hall size/acoustics/airflow) is a problem at every level. No magic solutions other than preparation. Sometimes a ball skids through one table while it slows down on another. High friction is normal for Butterfly and Gewo and even top class tables in some other brands but skidding is normal for older tables and even some Stag/Tibhar tables. People who play with the Nittaku ball primarily might get used to the power game it encourages, but then struggle when having to face the spin game of the opponent when the ball is changed to DHS or Butterfly or Double Fish etc. Even with all the practice, I generally play worst with the Nittaku ball and am usually happier when I see another ball with Butterfly being the minor exception - that ball gets away from me so I need extensive practice before using it in a tournament.

Ideally if you played there more you would adjust - that's the long and short of it. Whether a mental/technical hack will sufficiently compensate for reading the ball trajectory, I don't know, the game is too fast for that IMHO. The illusion I think is that the hack will give you something to work on while getting in the reps, but the reps are the key to playing better and then you might credit the hack, when the real benefit was the reps.

 

[blahness]

I haven't been able to play much lately. Had a week of vacation in Korea, caught a cold there so was out of action most of last week. This week is gonna be busy at work and soccer is starting back up.

I went to a different club this weekend after being invited by a club mate. The level of competition was pretty low, but their Butterfly tables gave me a ton of trouble. I'm wondering if there are some tricks when dealing with changes in the table. The BTY tables are soooo much stickier than the Stiga and Joola tables I'm used to, and it makes me very hesitant with my attacks. It took like 5 matches before I finally felt comfortable. After thinking about it for a while, I'm thinking that maybe what I should do is use a smaller motion, hit the ball closer to my body, and take the ball a little bit later to compensate for the unfamiliar ball trajectory after the bounce. What do you guys think?

Yeah the different tables and bounces really wreak havoc with bigger strokes.... better to play more controlled spin with smaller movements and a huge focus on watching the ball, before increasing quality later on. The way the ball kicks and retains spin can also be vastly different. I played on some "tacky surface" tables where the ball just kicks like mad once it hits the surface and loses spin like crazy, and there's also ultra slippery tables where it doesnt kick so much after contacting the table surface but the spin retained on the ball is huge.

If you watch some of the old ZJK videos he also does this, just slower controlled topspin to get used to the conditions and "warm up", then only start hitting harder once he felt comfortable.

 

[dingyibvs]

Yeah the different tables and bounces really wreak havoc with bigger strokes.... better to play more controlled spin with smaller movements and a huge focus on watching the ball, before increasing quality later on. The way the ball kicks and retains spin can also be vastly different. I played on some "tacky surface" tables where the ball just kicks like mad once it hits the surface and loses spin like crazy, and there's also ultra slippery tables where it doesnt kick so much after contacting the table surface but the spin retained on the ball is huge.

If you watch some of the old ZJK videos he also does this, just slower controlled topspin to get used to the conditions and "warm up", then only start hitting harder once he felt comfortable.

At the clubs where Butterfly tables are used I usually don't get a good warmup either, so that might contribute, though the balls I have the most issues with is probably the opening up. Sidespin especially destroys me as they curve so much more than I expect on the sticky tables. Tomorrow I'll have a training session, I think I'm gonna focus on watching the ball and using a smaller motion.

 

[Tyce]

Last night was a bit weird.

Initially, I was asked to sub in the other team that's playing the same division as us. That alone was a task in the making, as we also had a match the same night, and one of my teammates (D) has knee problems that prevented him from playing most of the season.
He was feeling OK, so we settled on him playing our match with my other teammate. Next, I got a text from the guy in the team I was going to play with (me as a sub) that he's not feeling well and has to cancel. So I informed D, who is also our club's contact for league related stuff.
We actually have a fourth person registered on our team, even if that's only so he can sub in on higher teams. Anyway, D called him but turns out he hurt his back just the other day.
As a result, D arranged to postpone our match, and me and D played the other team's (away!) match as a full team sub last night crazy stuff.

The club there was situated in a big sports center, so a large, high hall and with stiff, bouncy floors. I overshot quite a few balls, and also whiffed almost every single opening loop. Despite that we managed to take a good 4-1 win and I took my own two singles diligently. I'd say the other team owes us a few beers now 🍺

 

[dingyibvs]

Had a training session yesterday with my now 2 training partners (they come to my place back to back). On the FH side I worked on using a smaller motion mostly. I also tried to fine tune my backswing a bit, load my right leg a bit more and rotate to the right a bit more. It took a bit of time to adjust to the new timing, which wasn't a big issue, but man was it harder on my leg!

On the BH side, I worked on a lower stance with more forward lean combined with a higher racket. These two things work well together as lower stance and more forward lean would bring my racket lower, so holding it up higher counters that. I tend to stay rather low and my FH shots are from a low stance, so having a low stance on the BH side should help with FH/BH transitions.

An unexpected finding is that holding the racket higher means that I have less natural supination with my forward swing and therefore less closing of my racket during the forward swing. To compensate for that, I had to maintain a more closed racket during the backswing or else I hit the ball with too open of a racket and there isn't enough brushing. Before this I was actually practicing to open my racket more during the backswing to hit into the rubber/blade more, so now I'm doing the opposite.

Another thing I'm working on is my BH grip. I tend to hold the racket a bit looser on the BH side, allowing the racket to fall toward my fingertips a bit, but now I'm keeping it closer to my thenar. I find this gives me a lot more control and provides a much more solid contact with the ball. It also allows much easier FH/BH transitions as that's closer to my FH grip.

It's pretty incredible how much little changes can help your game. I'm hoping to continue to work on my BH mainly, and gradually add some more service/receive trainings over the next few months. I expect shoring up these weaknesses should give my game a pretty big boost.

 

[BackhandSteve]

Are people still posting here? 😋

 

[Tyce]

Last night I lost my second match of the season against a player I easily beat 3-0 in our home game... He has been on a roll lately also beating the highest ranked player in our group last week, but I am pretty pissed about getting 2-0 ahead only to throw it all away after that losing 17 points will take around 4 wins to recover...

Meanwhile, my feet are acting up with what seems to be metatarsalgia. Having the scale point to an all time high *really* doesn't help here, I would need to lose about 10kg to be in a more comfortable territory again. There's one more match upcoming Thursday (a subbing job again) and after that I will be off the hook for two weeks. Hopefully that will give me some time to recover.
I don't think I've ever had a foot injury like this and it makes me feel sad about the state I'm in as a whole... Probably gonna have to get some extra padded insoles and/or TT shoes with more support because this is not sustainable.

 

[dingyibvs]

Are people still posting here? 😋

We sure are!

I just had a super long session at the club, 5 hours, starting with a 1 hour coaching session. I always spend most of the time working on the basics, there seems to always be some room for improvement. On both sides I tried to work on a slight grip change mentioned in my previous post. I'm extending it to my FH side as well as I realized my grip also slips sometimes on the FH side. On the FH side I also felt that I was still using my arm to hit the ball a bit too much, so focused on driving the ball forward solely by my lower body.

On the BH side I'm focused on the forward lean, which turned out to be a bigger change than I expected. I think I started closing my racket a bit too much, so spent a good amount of time trying to find the optimal racket angle. The racket is also a bit further back relative to my eyes, so have to adjust the timing as well. Lastly it gives me more room for backswing, so per the coach's advice I worked on backswinging a bit more, or as he put it "swing from inside the body."

After that I did some FH/BH transitions, trying to apply these changes when hitting alternating FHs and BHs. It's actually a lot of changes, I think it might take me a while to learn all of them. I finished the session with my first flick lesson, both the banana flick and the FH flick. I need to not raise my elbow too much when I do the banana flick, and I need to hit from the side of the ball a bit, kind of slap the racket into the ball, to get better contact. On the FH side my footwork is woefully inadequate and I've been attempting flicks way too far from my body. I need to get closer to the ball whether I'm pushing or flicking, and if I'm flicking the motion itself is actually pretty simple as it's quite similar to the FH loop.

After that I played some matches. I did really well today, beat 2 guys I rarely beat and another who's been pretty even with me. Tomorrow I have 2 guys coming to my garage for practice for back-to-back sessions. I'm definitely gonna need a day of rest on Wednesday before soccer on Thursday, which is super exhausting as well! I'm going camping Fri-Sun though, so will have plenty of time to rest then.

 

[Archosaurus]

Well that was a long break. I got injured in late 23 after pushing it too hard, then life happened and I just couldn't get back into the sport. In the meanwhile I fixed some other skeletomuscular issues I had, so I was ready to play again. I couldn't take it anymore and just started. I guess it's technically been almost a decade since I last really played.

I did a couple hours session in a club a while ago, just light hitting and mostly serves. I have entirely lost my game, the only thing I can still do is light serves which are low and short and to return short serves. In all other respects I'm like a 500 rated beginner. It was rough on my unconditioned body and I am taking a break now; but I didn't get injured this time. In the meanwhile I'm doing bed serves at home and getting some feeling back.

It's also great to see many of the same posters from a decade ago still active here.

 

[Tyce]

It was one of those nights, playing against people rated 200, almost 300 points below me. It's a certain type of game that just sucks all the energy out of the ball, and then I have to put it back in. It's also the typical kind of game where I struggle to use my rubber, and I keep doubting whether I should be using something that's just easier to engage with less risk of overshooting.
My ultimate goal is still to escape this hellhole division and just not have to encounter these types anymore.
We won 5-0, but it was a constant struggle for both of us. My teammate did have less problems and I think it's in big part due to him just using slower equipment.
My gain: 3 rating points total might have been a personal record for lowest score while winning all games.


Edit: oh, feet update! The new shoes took some getting used to, but it doesn't hurt-hurt today so that's improvement. They're still pretty sensitive and I'm hyper aware of every little sensation going on, but there's no actual pain. I really hope this is the right band-aid until I lose enough weight and things can heal up.