Spinny Rubber Upgrade - depending on my playstyle

[Baschtiang]

Hi! I'd love your opinion on my equipment.

About me:
- German league level, rating ~1900, shakehand
- Close to the table / mid-distance
- Backhand is my stronger side: soft, spinny openers, then spin and placement variation close to the table
- Forehand: spinny openers, slower loops from mid-distance, counterlooping at the table
- Very short strokes, and I brush the ball very softly, almost never hitting it flat

Current setup:
- Blade: Stiga Inspira CCF (want to keep it for now)
- FH: Joola Dynaryz ACC max
- BH: Tenergy 05 FX max

Already tested: Tenergy 05, 19, 80, Xiom Vega X, Omega VIII Euro, andro Nuzn 48/50, Victas V15 Extra and V22. T05/T19 went too long when counterlooping, V22 was too hard, Vega X and Nuzn lacked spin on the opener.

What I want to improve:
- Even more spin on my openers, on both sides
- Against heavy backspin, my soft backhand openers often go into the net, and I have to hit more through the ball than I'd like
- The ball must not lose pace and drop short in rallies
- Occasionally being able to play a harder forehand loop as a winner

Question: Based on my style and these points, would you optimize anything in my rubbers (or thicknesses)?

Thanks a lot!

 

[Faker]

I believe you can use H3 BS boosted for FH. For BH maybe G1 can be an option. I tried them both. They are really good.

 

[RPB Enthusiast]

Hybrid or Chinese rubbers might be a good option to explore since the tacky topsheet will help with more spin. Since it seems you like softer rubbers, then these seem like options without needing to boost:

Forehand Options:
DHS Hurricane 3 Neo 37°
DHS Hurricane 8 37°
JOOLA Hugo Calderano Trinity Dynamic 52.5°

Backhand Options:
DHS Hurricane 3 Neo 37°
DHS Hurricane 8-80 37°

With these rubbers, you do need to put more effort than your tensor rubbers, but you benefit with the tacky topsheet with the spin as well as serves and short game. I used all of these on my backhand at one point and my favorite ones are Hurricane 3 Neo 37° and Trinity Charged 52.5°. Plus, DHS rubbers are usually cheaper compared to BTY, unless you want the National versions.

 

[Baschtiang]

I believe you can use H3 BS boosted for FH. For BH maybe G1 can be an option. I tried them both. They are really good.

What do u think is the main advantage on BH with the G1 - especially for my soft brushes?

 

[Baschtiang]

Hybrid or Chinese rubbers might be a good option to explore since the tacky topsheet will help with more spin. Since it seems you like softer rubbers, then these seem like options without needing to boost:

Forehand Options:
DHS Hurricane 3 Neo 37°
DHS Hurricane 8 37°
JOOLA Hugo Calderano Trinity Dynamic 52.5°

Backhand Options:
DHS Hurricane 3 Neo 37°
DHS Hurricane 8-80 37°

With these rubbers, you do need to put more effort than your tensor rubbers, but you benefit with the tacky topsheet with the spin as well as serves and short game. I used all of these on my backhand at one point and my favorite ones are Hurricane 3 Neo 37° and Trinity Charged 52.5°. Plus, DHS rubbers are usually cheaper compared to BTY, unless you want the National versions.

Thanks a lot for the detailed tips! 🙏

My only concern with Chinese rubbers is my stroke: I play very short strokes and brush the ball really softly. With harder rubbers like V22 or T19 I already noticed that the ball loses pace in rallies and drops short.

The Trinity and Hurricane 8-80 sound like the most forgiving options on your list. In your experience, do they keep enough pace with soft, short strokes, or do they really need full acceleration?

 

[RPB Enthusiast]

Thanks a lot for the detailed tips! 🙏

My only concern with Chinese rubbers is my stroke: I play very short strokes and brush the ball really softly. With harder rubbers like V22 or T19 I already noticed that the ball loses pace in rallies and drops short.

The Trinity and Hurricane 8-80 sound like the most forgiving options on your list. In your experience, do they keep enough pace with soft, short strokes, or do they really need full acceleration?

With the harder versions of Chinese rubbers (39°-42°), you definitely benefit with the longer strokes. With the 37° version, you can definitely play more short strokes and Chinese rubbers benefit from brushing the ball and benefit more if you do full acceleration since the tacky topsheet helps with the grip.

Trinity Dynamic is one of Hugo Calderano's rubbers, and MHTableTennis does a good job explaining both rubbers in this video.

JOOLA Hugo Calderano Trinity Charged and Dynamic rubbers

Here are 2 good reviews on the JOOLA Hugo Calderano Trinity rubbers and DHS Hurricane 8-80. If you want to explore the Chinese side, then Hurricane 3 Neo 37° and Hurricane 8-80 37° can be good startes since they're cheap so if you don't like them after using them for a certain period of time, you don't have to worry about breaking the bank.

JOOLA Hugo Calderano Trinity Dynamic and Charged rubber review

DHS Hurricane 8-80 rubber review

With how I play personally, I prefer harder rubbers, but I have used softer rubbers on my backhand and the H3N 37° was my favorite and Trinity Dynamic was my 2nd.

 

[Baschtiang]

With the harder versions of Chinese rubbers (39°-42°), you definitely benefit with the longer strokes. With the 37° version, you can definitely play more short strokes and Chinese rubbers benefit from brushing the ball and benefit more if you do full acceleration since the tacky topsheet helps with the grip.

Trinity Dynamic is one of Hugo Calderano's rubbers, and MHTableTennis does a good job explaining both rubbers in this video.

JOOLA Hugo Calderano Trinity Charged and Dynamic rubbers

Here are 2 good reviews on the JOOLA Hugo Calderano Trinity rubbers and DHS Hurricane 8-80. If you want to explore the Chinese side, then Hurricane 3 Neo 37° and Hurricane 8-80 37° can be good startes since they're cheap so if you don't like them after using them for a certain period of time, you don't have to worry about breaking the bank.

JOOLA Hugo Calderano Trinity Dynamic and Charged rubber review

DHS Hurricane 8-80 rubber review

With how I play personally, I prefer harder rubbers, but I have used softer rubbers on my backhand and the H3N 37° was my favorite and Trinity Dynamic was my 2nd.

Thanks a lot, really helpful! 🙏

I'll probably keep T05 FX on my backhand for now, since the blocking and placement work really well for me. But I might put the Hurricane 8-80 37° or Trinity Dynamic on my test racket for the forehand and compare it to the Dynaryz ACC.

One last question: in passive rallies, when you're not fully accelerating, how much pace do the 37° versions keep compared to a tensor like the ACC?

Thanks for the review link, really detailed! 🙏

Reading it, I'm not sure the 8-80 fits my style though. The author says players who brush more with arm and wrist (instead of using the body) may struggle with throw and power, and that it needs active hit-brushing to unlock its gears. That's pretty much the opposite of how I play: very short strokes and a soft, tangential brush. He also mentions that players who like softer tensors probably won't enjoy it, and I'm on Dynaryz ACC and T05 FX right now.

Since it's cheap, I might still try it on my forehand out of curiosity. But for my backhand I'll stick with T05 FX for now.

Do you think the Trinity Dynamic would suit a soft brushing style better than the 8-80?

 

[Tyce]

The only option besides T05 fx would be something like FX-D, and even that isn't necessarily better than what you are using. Harder rubbers are a downgrade for your style, especially on the BH.
And honestly, the same goes for the FH. You could try Glayzer but I don't think it's more than what you are using now. A Dignics might be an option but they're a bit harder.

Fastarc G-1 is more suitable for hard contact, Rakza 7 Hard would make more sense. Fastarc C-1 is not going to be enough for what you want.

Forget about Chinese rubber. If you made it to 1900 on Euro, I don't see anything in your story that would have you benefit from switching to Chinese.

 

[Archo]

Hurricane 8-80 and Hurricane 3 definitely aren't playable well with short, thin strokes. They are baseline somewhat slow although they can be fast enough at high power levels; the main benefit on backhand for me is immense spin on brushed strokes (as much or more than D05 and D09c) and very easy adjustment of the power level; blocks and pushes are very stable and it's easy to control the depth of the ball, and loops and counters can be fast enough but need much more effort.

I use the 37A versions on my backhand due to stability. I'm ok with it being slow (or rather, that's a huge benefit) and they're soft enough I can use them normally, and if I want more speed, I can turn my core more and use more legs with a longer swing.

The softer sponges are definitely easier to get speed out of with short strokes, but I wouldn't expect a tensor even with immense boosting on a fast blade. Did I mention boosting is basically mandatory for an offensive player?

For the forehand, H3 needs hard sponges and a high power stroke to be useful. The topsheet is extremely easy to use and even beginners can spin the ball with it, but the real utility is in sinking the ball into the sponge and using the support it can deliver. If you can't do that then it will be disappointingly slow and you will leave a lot of spin on the table.

H3 on forehand is actually not very slow when counterhitting or doing tiny counterloops close to table because the opponent's speed does the swinging for you, but it will be a problem against slow balls or awkward balls. H3 has an amazing ability to drop the ball low, half-long with low spin if you brush it just right which can be a mixup, but that will also be your typical 3rd ball quality if you don't swing with a lot of speed and mass.

I'd honestly recommend you to try them *anyway* as an experiment, with the idea that you can learn something during the off-season or whatever, but I'd probably stick to something more similar given your description.

 

[Baschtiang]

Thanks both for the detailed answers, that really helps! 🙏

It matches my own experience: harder rubbers like V22 and T19 didn't work for me, and it sounds like Chinese rubbers would force me to change my strokes quite a bit, which I don't want to do mid-season.

So I'll stick with Dynaryz ACC on the forehand and T05 FX on the backhand and focus on my technique instead, especially opening against heavy backspin. I like the idea of trying H3 or 8-80 as an experiment during the break though.

Are there any other suitable options like nuzn45, other fx from butterfly, or something else!?

 

[Archo]

By the way, here are some hardness measurements to get an idea compared to other rubbers:

DHS NEO Hurricane 3 Provincial 41A 2.10 BLACK
Topsheet 30.5 - 32.5 A / 53.0 - 54.0 O
Sponge 35.0 - 36.0 A / 55.5 - 56.0 O

DHS Hurricane 3 Provincial Blue Sponge 41A 2.15 BLACK
Topsheet 29.0 - 30.5 A / 52.5 - 53.0 O
Sponge 35.5 - 37.5 A / 55.5 - 56.0 O

DHS NEO Hurricane 3 Commercial 37A 2.10 RED
Topsheet 29.5 - 30.0 A / 52.0 - 52.5 O
Sponge 31.5 - 32.0 A / 52.0 - 53.0 O

DHS Hurricane 8-80 Commercial 37A 2.10 RED
Topsheet 25.5 - 27.0 A / 47.0 - 48.0 O
Sponge 28.5 - 30.0 A / 45.0 - 47.0 O

As you can see the hardnesses differ a lot even for the same stated measurement. I think part of that is production tolerance, but also just the actual curve of the system. H8-80 definitely feels softer than H3 for the same hardness, even if the sponge alone probably does measure the same if you do it in the right conditions.

Tenergy 05 is 23.5 Shore A on the sponge, Tenergy 05 Hard is 28.0 Shore A on the sponge, and I've measured Dignics 80 as 46.0 Shore O on both sides. Tenergy and Dignics sponges will ramp the stiffness more at very high deflections than Hurricane sponges will so they will feel slightly harder than what they measure as.

So if you're not comfortable using Tenergy 05 Hard, you're likely not comfortable using Hurricane.

 

[Tyce]

So if you're not comfortable using Tenergy 05 Hard, you're likely not comfortable using Hurricane.

I'm sorry but that doesn't make sense. T05H and H3 are completely different styles

 

[Archo]

I'm sorry but that doesn't make sense. T05H and H3 are completely different styles

Hm, yeah, I forgot that you stand on your head when you hit with Tenergy, and you need to do a backflip before you hit with Hurricane.

 

[Airoc]

Forget about Chinese rubber. If you made it to 1900 on Euro, I don't see anything in your story that would have you benefit from switching to Chinese.

+1

 

[Tyce]

Hm, yeah, I forgot that you stand on your head when you hit with Tenergy, and you need to do a backflip before you hit with Hurricane.

Joke all you want, doesn't change the facts

 

[Airoc]

Are there any other suitable options like nuzn45

As an alternative to Dynaryz AGR you might consider NUZN 50 - it is only very slightly sticky so you wouldn´t feel like playing with the brakes on (which is often the feeling with other hybrids or Chinese rubbers).

 

[Archo]

Joke all you want, doesn't change the facts

Hardness wise, not really. H8-80 sponge is less elastic in general, though; or maybe it's the topsheet tension.

It doesn't feel very far from Dignics 05 or Fastarc G-1 either. Those are even closer.

 

[RPB Enthusiast]

Thanks a lot, really helpful! 🙏

I'll probably keep T05 FX on my backhand for now, since the blocking and placement work really well for me. But I might put the Hurricane 8-80 37° or Trinity Dynamic on my test racket for the forehand and compare it to the Dynaryz ACC.

One last question: in passive rallies, when you're not fully accelerating, how much pace do the 37° versions keep compared to a tensor like the ACC?

Thanks for the review link, really detailed! 🙏

Reading it, I'm not sure the 8-80 fits my style though. The author says players who brush more with arm and wrist (instead of using the body) may struggle with throw and power, and that it needs active hit-brushing to unlock its gears. That's pretty much the opposite of how I play: very short strokes and a soft, tangential brush. He also mentions that players who like softer tensors probably won't enjoy it, and I'm on Dynaryz ACC and T05 FX right now.

Since it's cheap, I might still try it on my forehand out of curiosity. But for my backhand I'll stick with T05 FX for now.

Do you think the Trinity Dynamic would suit a soft brushing style better than the 8-80?

Chinese rubbers help with absorbing the opponent's ball more, so the ball tends to slow down more (which can help you with placement honestly), Hybrid is faster, and Tensor I feel comes off the bat the fastest.

I would say tryout the H8-80 first since it's cheaper rather than the Trinity Dynamic. You can get the Trinity rubbers for $50 USD on PROTT.vip, but normal price I think is in the 70 USD. Chinese rubbers you can't be lazy with so if you prefer laziness, you might not like it too much.

 

[Marc!_]

I liked Victas 401 on the forehand. For choppers but can be very fast. Spin is incredible (Maybe more than H3 imo?) but needs more power to activate due to 57.5 sponge. Control is very good.

 

[jonol]

If you find T19 too hard, then there's no point changing to a hybrid. The best way to get more spin is through improving technique, which would also make you more comfortable using harder rubbers with a higher spin ceiling.

I would avoid any hard sponge hybrids or chinese rubbers based on your playstyle description.