Form Check

[Leaseback]

Howdy all,

I posted a training update from Taiwan last week. In Taiwan there wasn't a ton of nitpicking form, the mindset there was multiball and train for so many hours and it comes naturally.

Out of curiosity I posted a video of my forehand form to reddit to get input on what to improve. Reddit left me with more questions than answers as every point of feedback people would argue with each other about. Some of the things argued was my stance being more parallel instead of right left back, wrist being loose versus fixing it. Another common feedback point was a tight shoulder.

I haven't had a ton of playing time back in the states yet but from the one day I did get to go before getting sick I would say I didn't feel like I was losing any points due to form issues, if anything I was extremely confident and hitting way better spinnier and consistent than I was earlier this year.

So I guess my questions are

1. Are there major fundamental issues in my current forehand form that must be fixed before I continue to play and drill like this and reinforce bad habbits?
2. Are there any minor optimizations that can be made?
3. What actually matters to change versus what is nitpicking and constantly adjusting form instead of focusing on playing.

For any feedback if you have suggestions on how to go about fixing it that would be appreciated as well.

Anything being done well?
While the nature of getting feedback is to improve, nitpick and optimize. I think negative feedback loops can get a bit draining. Any praise or things that are done well that should continue? It can be good for others learning to point out things that are being done well.

Videos of Play:
Reddit Post:

https://www.reddit.com/r/tabletennis/comments/1tzjzzv

TTD Training Comment: https://www.tabletennisdaily.com/forum/topics/training-in-taiwan-update.37859/page-2

If the links do not work I will update the post later today when I am home from work.

 

[Sriver1]

Relax, relax and relax. And keep your weight forward.

 

[sebi]

Relax. You are to stiff.
You are also more hitting the ball then spinning it.
If you want a better spin, you shoulf use elbow and wrist not using it is wasting muscels you could activate for more spin and speed.

 

[Draf]

I see rotation in the hip and rotation between shoulder and upper arm. Upper arm and lower arm(elbow joint) seems to maintain the same angle through out the stroke. Same with wrist. If this is considered correct form I do not know.

 

[Tyce]

I see rotation in the hip and rotation between shoulder and upper arm. Upper arm and lower arm(elbow joint) seems to maintain the same angle through out the stroke. Same with wrist. If this is considered correct form I do not know.

That depends on the source. Which directly leads to my advice: if you ask 100 people, you will get 100 opinions. It's best to stick to one "school" and put your trust in there.

 

[kindof99]

A little too much shoulder and elbow was fixed all the time. You will miss the ball quite often and hard to create good top spin without side spin.

Maybe too close to the table and have relatively big swings for fast incoming balls?

 

[kindof99]

Using too much shoulder for power will mess up your balance and make it harder for transition. That is why you were out of position after one or two balls. Use your feet/leg for power and transition and you will feel much easier.

 

[NextLevel]

Howdy all,

I posted a training update from Taiwan last week. In Taiwan there wasn't a ton of nitpicking form, the mindset there was multiball and train for so many hours and it comes naturally.

Out of curiosity I posted a video of my forehand form to reddit to get input on what to improve. Reddit left me with more questions than answers as every point of feedback people would argue with each other about. Some of the things argued was my stance being more parallel instead of right left back, wrist being loose versus fixing it. Another common feedback point was a tight shoulder.

I haven't had a ton of playing time back in the states yet but from the one day I did get to go before getting sick I would say I didn't feel like I was losing any points due to form issues, if anything I was extremely confident and hitting way better spinnier and consistent than I was earlier this year.

So I guess my questions are

1. Are there major fundamental issues in my current forehand form that must be fixed before I continue to play and drill like this and reinforce bad habbits?
2. Are there any minor optimizations that can be made?
3. What actually matters to change versus what is nitpicking and constantly adjusting form instead of focusing on playing.

For any feedback if you have suggestions on how to go about fixing it that would be appreciated as well.

Anything being done well?
While the nature of getting feedback is to improve, nitpick and optimize. I think negative feedback loops can get a bit draining. Any praise or things that are done well that should continue? It can be good for others learning to point out things that are being done well.

Videos of Play:
Reddit Post:

https://www.reddit.com/r/tabletennis/comments/1tzjzzv

TTD Training Comment: https://www.tabletennisdaily.com/forum/topics/training-in-taiwan-update.37859/page-2

If the links do not work I will update the post later today when I am home from work.

There usually isn't much benefit in posting videos like this to improve form once you already have gotten or are in an environment where you get coaching. The truth is that there is no single correct way to do any of these strokes, and that even when something is "wrong". the implications for your game are unclear. What you might look for is small tips to improve or change certain things or say what problem you are trying to solve and your question 2 points towards that but I will respond to you with a different challenge.

Usually, when people want to improve their form, their focus is usually their basic forehand topspin vs block with some justification. But a really good forrehand is built to handle a variety of situations, vs short, half long and long balls, vs downspin, upspin, no spin and even sidesspins of various lengths and placements and it sometimes produces these as well. Sometimes, high balls can be topspinned instead of smashed. And there is of course countertopspin.

Your basic form is good enough that you shouldn't waste too much time focusing on your basic forehand. Most of your improvements will come from lessons trying to adapt it t do various things, drills that force you to take the ball from lower or higher heights relative to the table,, different depths etc. Or using it to return serve or play third ball or fourth ball with different spin, speeds and placements. Work on those more, the basic forehand will improve with those lessons.

That is my take and my experience. Revisiting technique repeatedly doesn't get your functional game better except maybe over a lifetime. But expanding the use of your stroke creates lessons that do everything and can be used to improve your basic technique.

Because when you realize "my forehand cannot do this and that", the changes to do this and that usually result in good fixes.

 

[sebi]

There usually isn't much benefit in posting videos like this to improve form once you already have gotten or are in an environment where you get coaching. The truth is that there is no single correct way to do any of these strokes, and that even when something is "wrong". the implications for your game are unclear. What you might look for is small tips to improve or change certain things or say what problem you are trying to solve and your question 2 points towards that but I will respond to you with a different challenge.

Usually, when people want to improve their form, their focus is usually their basic forehand topspin vs block with some justification. But a really good forrehand is built to handle a variety of situations, vs short, half long and long balls, vs downspin, upspin, no spin and even sidesspins of various lengths and placements and it sometimes produces these as well. Sometimes, high balls can be topspinned instead of smashed. And there is of course countertopspin.

Your basic form is good enough that you shouldn't waste too much time focusing on your basic forehand. Most of your improvements will come from lessons trying to adapt it t do various things, drills that force you to take the ball from lower or higher heights relative to the table,, different depths etc. Or using it to return serve or play third ball or fourth ball with different spin, speeds and placements. Work on those more, the basic forehand will improve with those lessons.

That is my take and my experience. Revisiting technique repeatedly doesn't get your functional game better except maybe over a lifetime. But expanding the use of your stroke creates lessons that do everything and can be used to improve your basic technique.

Because when you realize "my forehand cannot do this and that", the changes to do this and that usually result in good fixes.

Thats the best adivece i have read on this forum.

 

[NextLevel]

Thats the best adivece i have read on this forum.

Thanks for the kind praise.

 

[Leaseback]

There usually isn't much benefit in posting videos like this to improve form once you already have gotten or are in an environment where you get coaching. The truth is that there is no single correct way to do any of these strokes, and that even when something is "wrong". the implications for your game are unclear. What you might look for is small tips to improve or change certain things or say what problem you are trying to solve and your question 2 points towards that but I will respond to you with a different challenge.

Usually, when people want to improve their form, their focus is usually their basic forehand topspin vs block with some justification. But a really good forrehand is built to handle a variety of situations, vs short, half long and long balls, vs downspin, upspin, no spin and even sidesspins of various lengths and placements and it sometimes produces these as well. Sometimes, high balls can be topspinned instead of smashed. And there is of course countertopspin.

Your basic form is good enough that you shouldn't waste too much time focusing on your basic forehand. Most of your improvements will come from lessons trying to adapt it t do various things, drills that force you to take the ball from lower or higher heights relative to the table,, different depths etc. Or using it to return serve or play third ball or fourth ball with different spin, speeds and placements. Work on those more, the basic forehand will improve with those lessons.

That is my take and my experience. Revisiting technique repeatedly doesn't get your functional game better except maybe over a lifetime. But expanding the use of your stroke creates lessons that do everything and can be used to improve your basic technique.

Because when you realize "my forehand cannot do this and that", the changes to do this and that usually result in good fixes.

Appreciate the advice. This is what I figured but definitely wanted to confirm it from someone else.

I do not have active coaching where I live, my coaching has been done in the past when I did have coaching available and also when I go on work trips to Asia. Thus wanted to confirm before embarking alone for the next year with no coaching and limited resources available.

My experience in Taiwan was as you said, constantly drill multiball, topspin vs block, footwork etc. It does become a bit harder as the clubs by me have too many people and you have to play a best of 5 set then rotate off so no time for drills etc.

I am going to try and find someone who may be willing to do these things so I can keep the training up. If not the best I've got is replicating those multiball drills I did in Taiwan on my Nova S Pro programming enough variety in ball height, spin speed drop point etc to try and keep it close to someone actually feeding you the balls.

But yeah your advice is someone I think a lot of people need to hear