Looking for a Fh Rubber

[NextLevel]

I actually cut out the ladys quality since she was demolishing me in the other sets. I only put the late 2nd set into the video and since noone would be interested to watch the entire match anyway. So I only picked out the part where I was somewhat in the game. Both first and 2nd set I was like 0 6 behind not understanding whats going on. Even the last and final set I lost 4-11 with her attacking every ball.

In the match I have no time to think about my stroke in detail. I don't have the ability to change my swingpath in little details. It's mostly full up when I take it very late. His serves would land half long or a bit long but never just fast long. The bigger problem was his backspin and his toopspin both with sidespin had the same pace so I just tried to flick somehow on the table and get into the rally. But I was also not allowed to hit to his bh. But by the nature of his serve it wants me to flick to his bh still... Skillissue.

I also seem to rush when I am going for the backhand flick especially and don't predict the balls trajectory right.

A lot of people told you the solution to this and you argued to high heavens with them so they left you to go your own way. You need to develop short stroke (forearm and wrist technique. but mostly forearm) that can use small swings at the ball to generate quality on both forehand and backhand for serve return and to some degree for countering. So that you can wait longer and until the last second before initiating the stroke and be less surprised by ball deviations.

Will this solve the problem? Not entirely because stroke preparation is about ball anticipation, so if you anticipate wrongly, you tend to select the wrong stroke. But having backup technique that enables you to play reasonably when you are late is what allows you to take more risks when your anticipation is early. IF you don't have the backup technique, then you are stuck trying to anticipate and generate early, and this will cost you many points out of frustration.

The reality is that you never let any of the serves double bounce or come off the table. So we will never know if the opponent truly served short - you are claiming the serves were perfect but the opponent is not Ma Long, and you probably gave him more credit than he deserved after not getting what you liked early. Many things about table tennis are in your head. You need to get outside your head when someone else is telling you there is a bigger reality out there.

 

[NextLevel]

yes and I am only confident with d09c if I know what type of ball am getting and in matches I just don't so to compensate that I want a more forgiving rubber instead until I can work on reading the ball and trajectory better.

I do still think d09c fits my playstyle age and technique. I can fully use this rubber in drills but just not in matches. So I want to move to something that gives me more confidence

Then your drills are poor and do not challenge your anticipation.

 

[Zezima]

No, the thicker player doesn't slap his forehand, he is big and strong so his spin is much heavier than yours, he doesn't need to put in special effort to get a quality ball. You need to understand what you are watching, even you have a higher quality ball than you realize you do, the problem is that you keep putting your game down rather than trying to find someone you can pay to develop it objectively and give you a system. These players just know what they are doing on every point far better than you do. Because you don't play at their level, you are surprised by the things they do. But once you get used to those things, you will start playing faster too.

In any case, go ahead and do what you want, but it is a bit annoying to continue to hear about how this or that is your issue when the bottom line is that you need to put yourself in a situation where you can train against better players if you want to improve faster. Your game is pretty complete other than maybe some over the table aspects, what you need to do is deploy the weapons and improve the placement and quality so that you can anticipate the opponent far better. But doing things like improving quality is harder when you don't have a quality opponent or coach pushing your level by showing you it still isn't good enough.

Yes slap is not the right word he is obviously still trying to apply a lot of spin. But his focus was as much hitting as possible and just enough brushing to make the ball land on the other side.
Almost the opposite of what I am doing. I don't limit test like he does. I focus much more on brushing than hitting.

As I wrote earlier I have 2 players I planned to train together. The dude is away and I think he comes next week. He told me he will message me when he will be back and on monday with this female player who is even better than anyone I can hope for. I would also be happy to pay for a coach but there aint one..

But we still drifted away from the topic... So would going from d09c to a 45° be too much in the middle of the season? This thursday it will be 3/8 round. So even if I buy a sheet I would put it next week earliest.
Least riskiest choice would be g1 but honestly a 3month old d09c plays same as a new g1 sheet. Maybe the g1 sheet feels harder at first even.. I kind of want to buy a 45° rubber and if that turns out to be too soft go back to a 47° but maybe something with a lower throw than g1 so I can focus easier on hitting more than brushing aspect unless I misunderstand that characteristic.

 

[Zezima]

A lot of people told you the solution to this and you argued to high heavens with them so they left you to go your own way. You need to develop short stroke (forearm and wrist technique. but mostly forearm) that can use small swings at the ball to generate quality on both forehand and backhand for serve return and to some degree for countering. So that you can wait longer and until the last second before initiating the stroke and be less surprised by ball deviations.

You mean in this thread? Not sure which stroke we are talking about. Flips/flicks over the table?

Will this solve the problem? Not entirely because stroke preparation is about ball anticipation, so if you anticipate wrongly, you tend to select the wrong stroke. But having backup technique that enables you to play reasonably when you are late is what allows you to take more risks when your anticipation is early. IF you don't have the backup technique, then you are stuck trying to anticipate and generate early, and this will cost you many points out of frustration.

My serve return is very onesided. I am working on this to have multiple solutions to a serve. But main problem is not being able to read backhand serves properly atm. I am just stupid. In the match I was guessing mostly wrong. Not even guessing I was looking at the ball contact but even without deceiptive aftermotion (or maybe it was so slim I didn't figure it out) the incoming ball was different than I have expected. Sometimes it's that drastic that the ball kicks into me when I was expecting a float serve..

The reality is that you never let any of the serves double bounce or come off the table. So we will never know if the opponent truly served short - you are claiming the serves were perfect but the opponent is not Ma Long, and you probably gave him more credit than he deserved after not getting what you liked early. Many things about table tennis are in your head. You need to get outside your head when someone else is telling you there is a bigger reality out there.

I did. This is just a short clip of the 2 matches from that day that my brother filmed from the fans club. He only filmed this much. So I have no more footage from that day. I will still write it down for myself that I should let the serve bounce longer instead of trying to take it at its peak.
I also don't want to blame the rubber but I am not a big fan of looping slow ass balls with this rubber. The trajectory gets even more unpredictable then when looping against blocks lets say where I get some pace atleast.

 

[Zezima]

Then your drills are poor and do not challenge your anticipation.

I have to admit I wasn't working on this much since my focus was getting good quality topspins first. Also noted down that atleast during the season I have to practise this more.

 

[NextLevel]

Yes slap is not the right word he is obviously still trying to apply a lot of spin. But his focus was as much hitting as possible and just enough brushing to make the ball land on the other side.
Almost the opposite of what I am doing. I don't limit test like he does. I focus much more on brushing than hitting.

As I wrote earlier I have 2 players I planned to train together. The dude is away and I think he comes next week. He told me he will message me when he will be back and on monday with this female player who is even better than anyone I can hope for. I would also be happy to pay for a coach but there aint one..

But we still drifted away from the topic... So would going from d09c to a 45° be too much in the middle of the season? This thursday it will be 3/8 round. So even if I buy a sheet I would put it next week earliest.
Least riskiest choice would be g1 but honestly a 3month old d09c plays same as a new g1 sheet. Maybe the g1 sheet feels harder at first even.. I kind of want to buy a 45° rubber and if that turns out to be too soft go back to a 47° but maybe something with a lower throw than g1 so I can focus easier on hitting more than brushing aspect unless I misunderstand that characteristic.

Do whatever you want. What you are looking for is not in equipment. I have not drifted off topic, I have told you that taking every problem you have to the forum is a waste of time. If you are going to train with the players, pick the equipment you want to train with, hit a couple of balls with them, get their quick opinions, settle it there, and move on. You will be playing league next year, you have to learn quickly. Find the balance between trial and error and improvement.

When a player is physically stronger, they can do more with less. And the reason he can hit the ball is that you are not challenging his anticipation. If you have a shot that brings him over the table or that makes him move wide or even a chop block to change the pace, you will make him think. But just floating the ball back and forth during the rally tends to favor the physically stronger player and can give a lower rated player chances if he can counter/block well.

 

[Tyce]

I think on serve receive, what you need most is patience. Don't step in unless you really can't reach the ball otherwise, and just let it run its course a bit longer. It will lose spin and the trajectory will be easier to see

 

[NextLevel]

You mean in this thread? Not sure which stroke we are talking about. Flips/flicks over the table?

My serve return is very onesided. I am working on this to have multiple solutions to a serve. But main problem is not being able to read backhand serves properly atm. I am just stupid. In the match I was guessing mostly wrong. Not even guessing I was looking at the ball contact but even without deceiptive aftermotion (or maybe it was so slim I didn't figure it out) the incoming ball was different than I have expected. Sometimes it's that drastic that the ball kicks into me when I was expecting a float serve..

I did. This is just a short clip of the 2 matches from that day that my brother filmed from the fans club. He only filmed this much. So I have no more footage from that day. I will still write it down for myself that I should let the serve bounce longer instead of trying to take it at its peak.
I also don't want to blame the rubber but I am not a big fan of looping slow ass balls with this rubber. The trajectory gets even more unpredictable then when looping against blocks lets say where I get some pace atleast.

On another thread. How many threads on serve return issues do you have?

Being unable to consciously read a serve is a problem, but very often, if you have a technically correct return stroke, you will find that you will return many serves when you cannot read then. This happens simply because ultimately table tennis is unconscious and a stroke that returns the serve will be selected if you are in position to make a good a return.

Like I said, you can change the rubber. Just do it and see what happens, the forum is not going to give you anything you cannot figure out yourself. Moreso because you tend to already know what you want to do.

 

[ThePongCommenter]

You mean in this thread?

On this thread, where pretty much everyone told you your backhand receive technique is too unreliable and that the main issue isn't reading the serve or trajectory, and your response was basically "what the fk is going on, nobody knows what they are talking about, the issue is reading the trajectory". I do think moving to a softer, "easier power" rubber is a step in the right direction for you for reasons stated before but nothing will fix the technique issues that still remain.

 

[dingyibvs]

I know I need to work on my technique. I am actually working on it especially lately (I have another thread dedicated to just my fh form)

I don't know what you mean by "

You mean just hit it hard like 90%hit and 10% brush lets say not caring about whether they land on the table or not?
The first "thick" dude (2nd place currently in the league) plays like that. He was slapping these balls very hard. He missed some but if those landed on the table it didn't matter where he was aiming.

I am actually focusing only on fh form right now and 0 about the game. Thats why you see me playing as if I have no gameplan (tbh I had no gameplan). As you can see I was busy reacting to balls and could only think about topspinning when I had the serve (3rd ball attack). In the Rallys it felt like I had no time for a backhand loop because I saw it too late where they gonna play the ball. I am playing more on survival mode even then I ran out of time and did stupid mistakes by just holding the racket into the ball. But thats a different issue.

I was practising very simple fh topspins in my training and even if I do 2fh-2bh drills it works really good. But these better players tend to play balls where I just feel like I have no time. Even though against weaker players where I don't know where they are gonna loop I feel like I have all the time in the world. I even have time to think about placement, speed, spin variation against them.

vs Better players I am waiting for that random weak ball that looks like when warming up with fh. And even then I tense up and do a random bad looking fh stroke very far away from how it looks in the practise I think.

I see what your issue is, you think that thick dude is "slapping" the ball. No, the woman was slapping the ball from time to time, the thick dude has the right amount of hit/spin ratio. Whatever sponge you use, you need to loop like him.

 

[Ultravisitor]

Yes slap is not the right word he is obviously still trying to apply a lot of spin. But his focus was as much hitting as possible and just enough brushing to make the ball land on the other side.
Almost the opposite of what I am doing. I don't limit test like he does. I focus much more on brushing than hitting.

As I wrote earlier I have 2 players I planned to train together. The dude is away and I think he comes next week. He told me he will message me when he will be back and on monday with this female player who is even better than anyone I can hope for. I would also be happy to pay for a coach but there aint one..

But we still drifted away from the topic... So would going from d09c to a 45° be too much in the middle of the season? This thursday it will be 3/8 round. So even if I buy a sheet I would put it next week earliest.
Least riskiest choice would be g1 but honestly a 3month old d09c plays same as a new g1 sheet. Maybe the g1 sheet feels harder at first even.. I kind of want to buy a 45° rubber and if that turns out to be too soft go back to a 47° but maybe something with a lower throw than g1 so I can focus easier on hitting more than brushing aspect unless I misunderstand that characteristic.

Thats a drastic change your planning to do. Wait till season ends. Or at least try this on a spare blade. I still think glayzer09c and glayzer are what you're looking for.

 

[Ninja26Go]

Hey folks,

I want to give up on d09c. I already went down with the blade going from long5 then to W968 and now to Petr Korbel jp. I feel like I get more feedback which I need to self adjust my stroke. Now after a couple months with d09c both sides I think its time to go down to an easier to activate rubber but with linear properties.

Why linear? I struggled with shorter slower balls with h3 because of the hard dampening effect. It was only good when opp served short. But in my league they mostly serve halflongish longish serves. Noone really serves short.

My most recent games:

against +300 rated players.

Even with a different rubber I would have lost still but I am still showing these clips so you can see how I use my fh and that d09c just feels wrong even though I like the fact it gets better and easier to play the longer I play with this rubber.

I actually played more safe with a 8month d09c compared to a fresh sheet...

I have also tried g09c. It feels like the little brother of d09c. But I think I am looking for something even easier to activate than g09c. I have seen much better players like 2200ttr with a really good fh with r48. So I feel like I might need to go even softer than that like r45 type of softness maybe?

Last 7 years I havent had anything softer than 47,5° rubber on my fh. So I don't even know how that would feel. Played the likes of g1, aurus prime, r48,mx-p,g09c,r7, mx-d

Please recommend some rubbers you think it would greatly benefit and get more confident in using my fh even if I am standing not perfect to the ball but still easier to activate the sponge.

With d09c I can activate it only when I am standing correct.

My ideal rubber would have the same linearity in block and catapulty/linearity like d09c but it can be slightly less speed softer feeling so I can tell if I activated the sponge. But not too soft since I would hate it to bottom out when I go all in (I want to blame my technique not the rubber giving up)

I also struggle with soft loops on receive. I am sometimes too slow and dont overcome the incoming speed. So slight misread makes the ball go out or into the net when I loop.

Its really not the rubber problem. I don't know what to say. You forehand just isn't fast enough. You hit the ball like you are scared it will go flying, but if you don't force the ball forwards, it will go up anyway due to topsin. You HAVE to go hard on the ball you CAN'T be afraid of swinging hard

 

[Ninja26Go]

Equipment really isn't the issue here. If someone has the right technique, any rubber will at least work right?

 

[Zezima]

I think on serve receive, what you need most is patience. Don't step in unless you really can't reach the ball otherwise, and just let it run its course a bit longer. It will lose spin and the trajectory will be easier to see

I just have too much respect to take their backhand serve with my fh(loop). So I try to step in asap and try to flick and get into the rally. When a weaker player uses his backhand serve I seem to have no problem receiving with my fh.
And I am good at seeing when its half long or short so those balls I always take it with my right foot in front, so if its half long I can loop or if its too short I can push.

But either way in matches I don't really have that click sound when using my fh topspin. I was hoping if I switch to a different easier rubber that I will get that more often atleast.

But the fundamental problem is still the same that only in warmup when I do fh to fh I slap like the thick dude but never do that stroke in a match because my brain only wants more brush than hit. Thats why I said he has the different approach of hitting as much and brushing as less as possible. My mindset has to shift here aswell.
I just don't know if I should force to do short snappy strokes instead of a long normal topspin stroke in training. Because in Training I have the time for the longer stroke.

But because I am never really training the short forearm wrist stroke (like a fh flip or a faster drive with brush still but very little) I obviously don't feel confident in the match aswell. But training "suboptimal" strokes when you have time felt wrong in training atleast. Now that I think of I would prob benefit a lot from these "fast" open multiball drills. But I would need to wait for my brother to get better at feeding me fast balls. Unless you guys know better drills to fix this issue.

This thursday it will be very competitive. One 1650 and others are 1500 and 1470. So all 3 doable but I lost to 2 of them last time. I might post it in my other thread to get some tips on how to beat them and what their weaknesses are.


Nevertheless what do we do with the fh rubber now?

Thats a drastic change your planning to do. Wait till season ends. Or at least try this on a spare blade. I still think glayzer09c and glayzer are what you're looking for.

I tried g09c only and on the w968 blade. It just felt the lil bro of d09c. But honestly I didn't feel much difference mostlikely because I couldn't get the most out of d09c to begin with. I just wanna go something softer I think and pray to gods I learn or get forced to hit harder and have more confidence.

 

[Ninja26Go]

Focus more on the technique and less on the equipment. Go watch how pro players play. Do they ever go as slow as you? No, they use full power or like 90%.

 

[Zezima]

Focus more on the technique and less on the equipment. Go watch how pro players play. Do they ever go as slow as you? No, they use full power or like 90%.

I actually watch a lot of pro play and tutorials that at this point it actually confuses me.

Even this simple advice people have different opinions about. Some say make it land on the table first consistency over power. Others come and say hit as hard as possible and hit it into the net once you do that apply as little brush as possible etc..

I tried both ways the latter only a month. Either way I play like pus pus in the match because I am busy reacting and have no time for preparing the stroke properly.

 

[ThePongCommenter]

I actually watch a lot of pro play and tutorials that at this point it actually confuses me.

Even this simple advice people have different opinions about. Some say make it land on the table first consistency over power. Others come and say hit as hard as possible and hit it into the net once you do that apply as little brush as possible etc..

The way you are trying to utilize the internet to improve your table tennis game isn't going to be productive and it seems like it hasn't really yielded many results over the past year either. Best you can do is find the people who give advice that has worked for you and ignore the ones who haven't given useful advice, inefficient as it may be, but on top of all that, you come across as very stubborn too which probably leads to many people not bothering to engage.

 

[Ninja26Go]

I actually watch a lot of pro play and tutorials that at this point it actually confuses me.

Even this simple advice people have different opinions about. Some say make it land on the table first consistency over power. Others come and say hit as hard as possible and hit it into the net once you do that apply as little brush as possible etc..

I tried both ways the latter only a month. Either way I play like pus pus in the match because I am busy reacting and have no time for preparing the stroke properly.

Play how the pros play. If it makes them good, then surely it works right>

 

[dingyibvs]

The way you are trying to utilize the internet to improve your table tennis game isn't going to be productive and it seems like it hasn't really yielded many results over the past year either. Best you can do is find the people who give advice that has worked for you and ignore the ones who haven't given useful advice, inefficient as it may be, but on top of all that, you come across as very stubborn too which probably leads to many people not bothering to engage.

It's hard to get advice from the general public. With that said, I think if a lot of people are saying the same thing, especially if many of them have gone through similar things as him, he should at least give their advice a try instead of just constantly arguing with them. It's really looking like he's more looking for affirmation than advice at this point.

 

[NetProphet]

Yes but the problem is I usually get one good chance to attack for my current level. Let's say 3rd ball attack, because I am also mentally prepared to attack after my serve since I know 99% the ball will end up long somewhere. So I need to use that chance. As you can see in the video when I did that I won the point straight. That in return makes me atleast a bit more relaxed in the game. With R7 I would loop the ball and then lose the point. The more points I lose the harder I try to go and make even more stupid mistakes. In the end I will end up playing worse.

I don't want to lose so much spin as going back to R7 maybe something that can generate more dangerous balls (how is it compared to R45 actually?). But in terms of hardness it should be around that 45°.

So the goal is the rubber should make me want to play more balls actively than currently where I am waiting for the right incoming speed and height of the ball. For me it's also a huge mental thing. I don't need bounciness from rubber just close to the same characteristic as d09c but softer (g09c is not enough soft I think).

I think we're back to the difference between immediate match results and practicing so our technique becomes better and better so as to be readily available for us to take on the shots that we currently don't take in matches.
It's a step backwards to take three steps forward.

Saying you would loop with R7 and lose the point makes no sense to me. I know players better than me who use it and can place the ball wherever they want with enough speed at this level to win points.
We're not playing at 2000+ level competition.