Natural progression from accoustic

[chandyrandy]

Hey all,
I was wondering what people thoughts were about the blade progression of an acoustic enjoyer.

I currently use and love my acoustic so this is less of a thread about finding a blade for me but rather for showing the evolution of an acoustic enjoyer 😂. Th obvious step is to just get a carbon version but what are the other options?
I know Ma Long used to use the accoustic before the creation of his w968. How similar does the limba-ayorus-carbon Ayorus of the w968, Harimoto ALC (to my knowledge) and other softer outerply blades compare to the timeless (I know I'm glazing) limba-limba-tung of the acoustic?
Cheers

 

[MOJOJOJO-74]

You can try out DHS Hurricane Long 5, pretty cheap on PROTT compared to other websites, if you're thinking of following Ma Long's blade setup.

PROTT

 

[jonol]

I went from Tibhar SPW (5 ply,Limba-Ayous) to the Harimoto Innerforce ALC and I don't feel there has been any issues with consistency.

One thing to take into account is that my SPW was 94g though, which is quite heavy. My Harimoto ALC is 90g. The main difference is that blocks, smashes and powerful loops all feel better to me. They come off with similar spin, but slightly faster and lower. It's only slightly different in short game and serve-receive, I can still push short and have soft touch when needed, and in fact I think that long pushes have actually improved a fair bit because they come off with good speed and spin more naturally.

That said, Acoustic apparently has a softer feel than the SPW and is also more flexy. Comparing the difference between my 94g SPW and 90g Harimoto ALC might be very different to comparing the difference between the Acoustic and whatever weight Harimoto ALC you would end up getting.

I also was using Fastarc G1/C1 at the time I changed my blade - Glayzer might behave differently between the 2 blades. You could consider upgrading one of your rubbers to something with a higher ceiling and seeing how that behaves, before upgrading the blade. It's cheaper and might give you some better idea of the direction you want to go with your setup.

 

[chandyrandy]

Thanks for the suggestions but I'm not looking to upgrade rn haha, more so just curious

 

[NetProphet]

Hey all,
I was wondering what people thoughts were about the blade progression of an acoustic enjoyer.

I currently use and love my acoustic so this is less of a thread about finding a blade for me but rather for showing the evolution of an acoustic enjoyer 😂. Th obvious step is to just get a carbon version but what are the other options?
I know Ma Long used to use the accoustic before the creation of his w968. How similar does the limba-ayorus-carbon Ayorus of the w968, Harimoto ALC (to my knowledge) and other softer outerply blades compare to the timeless (I know I'm glazing) limba-limba-tung of the acoustic?
Cheers

Seeing as most players tend to plateau in their development and for 'most' (although I respectfully recognise that this may not be you) I would suggest that Acoustic is a blade for life if you're happy with it.
I have one myself and it is a great blade. After initial struggles in getting used to it's speed I finally realised that the small handle was something I couldn't get used to. I played with a friends FZD ALC and it was sooo much more comfortable in my hand (although at the same time also too fast) this made me realise id bought the wrong blade.

Faced with the prospect of buying another Acoustic with the larger handle or something else I finally settled on a Butterfly Innerforce ALC.
Not sure if this is the correct evolution for a long time Acoustic user such as yourself but I like it a lot although if I were offered a large handle Acoustic or the Innerforce ALC it would be 50/50 for me tbh so it's possibly a sideways move.

Every player being different I'm not sure there's a 'path' in terms of blade progression but if your game ever does develop to where Acoustic seems insufficient (in which case you've become a damn good player!) them I would think Viscaria is something to try next along side the Carbon Acoustic as you mentioned.

 

[merlin el mago]

If you like acoustic you can follow that path using inner carbon Acoustic or outer carbon so not a new blade but similar with less feeling but more control & speed.

 

[NetProphet]

If you like acoustic you can follow that path using inner carbon Acoustic or outer carbon so not a new blade but similar with less feeling but more control & speed.

More control and speed?
How does a carbon version of his blade allow more speed and more control at the same time?

 

[merlin el mago]

Using carbon fibers enlarge sweep spot and the same time increase speed.

 

[NetProphet]

Using carbon fibers enlarge sweep spot and the same time increase speed.

Well, Carbon = more speed, yes.
But more control, no. You have to learn that yourself by using the blade and learning (hopefully you're good enough with good enough technique) to control it.
A larger sweet spot is something else and although it can add consistency to shots where contact point may not be optimal it doesn't just give control as you are suggesting.
What I'm getting at is that so many people post comments to the effect of; Blade X or Blade Y are faster and more controlled than Blade A or Blade B.
I think you'd have to write down your definition of control for me because to me if a new blade adds more speed to shots you were previously making, then it is not adding more control to your game. You have to compensate and bring that yourself by learning to use that blade and finding the mix of speed and spin that allows you to hit the table with consistency.
It's not bad simple as finding a Holy Grail Blade to do that for you.

 

[passifid]

Bigger sweetspot but not much faster and still very soft feeling:

Xiom HAL which is an inner AL no carbon is one step
Liu Shiwen ZLF is another but hard to get


Bigger Speed but still soft feeling:
But imo the best step is innerforce ALC or Harimoto ALC if you using the Acoustic Large Handle
If you use the acoustic small handle the DHS HL5 is better, albeit needs sealing or it will explode

More speed but harder (halfway to viscaria and pretty different):
DHS Hurricane King AcB

 

[merlin el mago]

Well, Carbon = more speed, yes.
But more control, no. You have to learn that yourself by using the blade and learning (hopefully you're good enough with good enough technique) to control it.
A larger sweet spot is something else and although it can add consistency to shots where contact point may not be optimal it doesn't just give control as you are suggesting.
What I'm getting at is that so many people post comments to the effect of; Blade X or Blade Y are faster and more controlled than Blade A or Blade B.
I think you'd have to write down your definition of control for me because to me if a new blade adds more speed to shots you were previously making, then it is not adding more control to your game. You have to compensate and bring that yourself by learning to use that blade and finding the mix of speed and spin that allows you to hit the table with consistency.
It's not bad simple as finding a Holy Grail Blade to do that for you.

I own the Acoustic outer carbon so I can speak about how it's works. If for you bigger sweep spot isn't more control you have to train more to understand it.

BTW Acoustic outer carbon isn't a super fast blade, it's a blade with soft touch a lot of similar to all wood blades.

 

[victormanriquey]

The normal progression is a 7 ply wood blade with limba as a top, but many people go to a 5+2 inner carbon blade, there are plenty with limba tops. To answer this Q we would need a loooong amount of blades to discuss, so the tl;dr is that it depends per player, budget, feeeling, taste, handle, playstyle, etc

 

[NetProphet]

I own the Acoustic outer carbon so I can speak about how it's works.

Well you may own it and maybe you understand it but your post asserts it just gives additional speed AND control at the same time and didn't explain anything to help anyone else understand what you claim to know.

If for you bigger sweep spot isn't more control you have to train more to understand it.

I don't need to train anything.
You are absolutely conflating sweet spot and control without bothering to assess them as the two different things that they clearly are.
Most recommended beginner blades have a relatively small sweet spot but they do offer a lot of control Vs a carbon layered blade. Does every blade thereafter with a larger sweet spot offer the user more control?

You seem unwilling to accept that the claims you're making need to be fleshed out and explained properly so that they don't read as silly, or unfinished.

 

[merlin el mago]

If you can't understand a bigger sweep spot have more control than a small sweep spot, I'll let it go, the coin for you...

FYI Nittaku blades are very different of BTY blades, try and after speak. I'm not speaking in general carbon or fiber blades I'm speaking of Nittaku Acoustic Carbon outer in particular.

I'm sorry to said you need more training I didn't want to offend you so I apologize for that if it offended you.

Control is relative to skills and the way you play, so I said you need more train to understand what I said.

 

[Füty Imre]

I'm also an acoustic player and will dicide what to switch to in 1-2 weeks, my 3 options are ApoloniaZLC, HSALC,
TB ALC (maybe old TB spirit too) as I can try these out because some of my club players use them. I could write a comparison in the near future between these blades if your intrested

 

[NetProphet]

If you can't understand a bigger sweep spot have more control than a small sweep spot, I'll let it go, the coin for you...

FYI Nittaku blades are very different of BTY blades, try and after speak. I'm not speaking in general carbon or fiber blades I'm speaking of Nittaku Acoustic Carbon outer in particular.

I'm sorry to said you need more training I didn't want to offend you so I apologize for that if it offended you.

Control is relative to skills and the way you play, so I said you need more train to understand what I said.

No it's all good, I'm not offended.
We just disagree.
You assert that the Carbon Version of his blade automatically gives more control than the wooden version, which I believe to be a false statement.

I know what the sweet spot is on a racket and I know what Carbon does to it's performance.
All Carbon blades have larger sweetspots but that doesn't mean that they're easier to play.

Saying this is true for Nittaku is a bit of a cop out. Carbon changes the properties of the blade, that's unequivocally true.
It gives it more rebound and speeds it up.
Nothing wrong with any of that and it may be the perfect next blade for the OP. I just don't see where the control automatically comes from.
But your last statement that control comes from training seems to make my point for me so as you said, we'll let it go 👍

 

[merlin el mago]

For me diversity is good, I'm always learning not only for table tennis, open mind & think about the others says is a good manner to improve not only in sport.

Lately I'm playing with Stiga Infinity VPS in place of Nittaku Acoustic outer carbon, as you think an me too because I played with carbon blades all my life I guessed the Acoustic will have more speed and for my feelings, level & way to play I feel the Infinity with more speed & spin, the Infinity isn't like a standard 5 ply all wood blade, the 2nd outer layer have the wood thermally treated so more stiff & hard than non treated wood.

Everybody have different sense of control so I understand your point

 

[merlin el mago]

The normal progression is a 7 ply wood blade with limba as a top, but many people go to a 5+2 inner carbon blade, there are plenty with limba tops. To answer this Q we would need a loooong amount of blades to discuss, so the tl;dr is that it depends per player, budget, feeeling, taste, handle, playstyle, etc

Acoustic isn't a standard blade, is like Stiga ARC, so you can not get exact blades of others brands.

If Acoustic made a 7 ply wood, I agree is the best next step but Nittaku don't made it.

Also an important thing is not to change a lot the weight of the new blade, better for the new blade to have similar weight.

 

[victormanriquey]

Acoustic isn't a standard blade, is like Stiga ARC, so you can not get exact blades of others brands.

If Acoustic made a 7 ply wood, I agree is the best next step but Nittaku don't made it.

Also an important thing is not to change a lot the weight of the new blade, better for the new blade to have similar weight.

Yes it is a pitty that nittaku doesn't have a Long3 indeed I feel like nittaku with their thin handles like DHS but much better QA/QC than DHS, would make for a banger soft flexy 7 ply limba ayous like Long3

 

[merlin el mago]

If Nittaku will made a 7 plies Acoustic will be so good for players don't like fibers.

The touch of Nittaku Acoustic outer carbon is unique nothing like the others brands.

It seems Nittaku made a bigger handles models, mine is the thin handle. Speaking of handles I like a lot Stiga Legend handles, I own two Infinity one ST to twidle & one Legend.

Could be a Stiga Clipper with the same weight ok for the OP, but the good ones are the old models.