People who switched from carbon back to wood, how’s it going?

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From my understanding, the initial purpose of composite layer was to reduce the weight of the blade. Sweet spot, speed, etc, are byproducts.
How come then most composite blades are heavier than equivalent allwood blade?

The composite layer makes the difference between individuals less…

It makes it easier to control the stiffness and the hardness depending a bit on the top layer.

I believe those two are the main reasons.

Not to forget how they come up with strange combinations that they charge an arm and a leg for….

But for a player the sweet spot is a huge point as well.

Cheers
K-zr
 
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How come then most composite blades are heavier than equivalent allwood blade?

The composite layer makes the difference between individuals less…

It makes it easier to control the stiffness and the hardness depending a bit on the top layer.

I believe those two are the main reasons.

Not to forget how they come up with strange combinations that they charge an arm and a leg for….

But for a player the sweet spot is a huge point as well.

Cheers
K-zr
Weight was the initial intent. The design criteria and technologies must have changed over the years. But generally, if two blades are at the same speed and power, composite blades should be thinner and lighter than all wood right? I don't have much experience with equipments. To me, composite blades just have higher passive speed so it feels easier to hit around.
 
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Just want to add some personal experience to this topic, which might also be controversial: not all all-wood blades are provides better feeling or better control.

A few years ago I bought a Stiga Maplewood NCT V since it was going out of production, and my coach has been using one for years, so I wanted to test it out. It felt hard AF, so I gave it to a co-worker who also uses one and want to have a backup blade. And I recently tried out two Koki Niwa Wood 90th anniversary edition blades, and comparing them to my w968 and the newly arrived SDC Valkyrie, I would say it feels harder and not as controllable. But if you search online you'll see most people saying how good Stiga Maplewood NCT V is for looping, how the flex of the blade spins the ball and cataples it. And just look at how Koki Niwa plays, he switched back to the all wood blade for a reason. But why does it contradicts what I feel when I tried the blade.

Before I continue, this is how I define a blade with perfect control: landing the ball on the spot with the spin and speed the player wanted, all the time, with minimal effort.

Most all-wood blades have lower top speeds compared to most composite blades, so if you want to hit a ball to a spot with the same speed you want, you'll have to put in more effort (turning your body, tensing up your arms and fingers, etc.), and with more effort you lose more and more control of your body (over tension, bad form, etc.). But we all know that to achieve the best shots you want your body to be in a "relaxed" form, so do you really have more control with an all-wood blade while trying to hit a powerful shot? I don't think so.

But on the other hand, most all wood blades can produce slower shots much easier than composite blades, because with a composite blade you need your body to be much more precise on the touch, and to be more precise you need to put in more effort, and more effort means less control.

IMO, the "control" aspect of a blade is not an objective property, it's more of a subjective feedback of the player using it. So what I'm trying to say is you need to know what style you prefer playing, is it "spin and location" or "speed and power"? You need to choose the correct equipment to match your play style, and the one that matches the best is the one that has the most control, for you.

So, like @NDH said above "If you want to improve, pick a set up and get used to it - Don't overthink the rubbers/blades (within reason), and focus on training." Also adding to that, know your play style, then pick your setup accordingly.

Btw, I've seen this mentioned in a lot of Chinese forums, and videos on Bilibili: faster blades pairs with slower rubbers, and slower blades pairs with faster rubbers. Or what I call it: balance.

i can 100% agree on. it all just depends for every person.

i mean sure, if you re using like the fastest catapult tensor rubbers money can buy, getting a super fast Blade on top might be complete overkill. however if you re a budget minded person and you cant be bothered to pay 40-80$ for a sheet of rubber and you rather pay 10-30$ for 2 sheets of chinese rubber and be set for a few months its a completely different story. 5ply all wood feels almost unplayable with how slow and flexy they are for hard tacky rubber. even carbon blades dont feel fast at all...

when i started, i started with a Fextra 7 and oh boy is that a slow blade with chinese rubber. my old 5ply 20$ spinlord prebuild racket was way faster already to a point 7ply is barely even cutting it. for basic shots, my buddy on a carbon blade barely needs to move, i literally need to put in full force, resulting in basically sweaty and done after like 2 games tops because you need to put so much energy into it to get up to speed.

and i m only playing for 2 months already 3-4 days a week. when we swap blades and i play with my buddys carbon blade with tensor rubbers, ngl... i feel almost zero loss in control what so ever. you need to tame down your power a bit for everything but besides that... zero difference. i dont suddenly shoot every ball into the sky or dont hit the table anymore, loops, attacks and whatnot are incredibly easy on the fast blade too.

when i was trying other testblades of people, something in the realms of viscaria together with some Battle 2 just felt so amazing. way easier to handle than my fextra and i can play for way longer without running out of steam because i need to put less power in wich result in a way more relaxed and controlled play.


besides, i honestly think, that it also depends on who you ask. from my observation, its primarily people who play for like 20-30 years who dont like carbon blades or who tell everyone that its uncontrollable and stuff. i belive, it might have more to do with muscle memory. if you play allwood for a very long time, and you grew up in celluloid era and you learned to play like that and you are used to that, it is probably WAY harder... to switch to carbon and kind of relearn a different type of playstyle compared to rather fresh new players who straight up start carbon and learn that playstyle from the start.

maybe it just depends on what you are used to and what you grew up with and what your muscle memory is already used to. for example when we play on some old celluloid balls for fun, we found somewhere... it almost feels like cheating. like literally cheating. its insane on just how easy it is to play high spin and with how much precision you can place the ball. it feels like a completely different game honesly.
 
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Absolutely…
I just switched from 2+5 outer, Nittaku S-CZ to an allwood 7 layer all ayous blade, Nittaku Ma long 7 LG. The new blade is significantly faster. I switched for the large handle and I knew it was gonna be faster so I was a little reluctant… But as it turns out it was a great change.

FH loos are more challenging but due to the low throw my BH is way more dangerous now. And it blocks really nice and fast. Now I put my opponents under more pressure, this is certainl.

Cheers
L-zr
Hello!

I've been reading all the info available on the S-CZ and came across this thread. Here you are saying that the Long 7 is "significantly faster" than S-CZ but that contradicts the rest of the info available online about both of that blades!

So could you please elaborate on your setups? What's the weight of the blades? Did you test them with the same rubbers or not?

Thank you in advance
 
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Hello!

I've been reading all the info available on the S-CZ and came across this thread. Here you are saying that the Long 7 is "significantly faster" than S-CZ but that contradicts the rest of the info available online about both of that blades!

So could you please elaborate on your setups? What's the weight of the blades? Did you test them with the same rubbers or not?

Thank you in advance
Yes, it’s faster, stiffer and heavier. Same rubbers. But the S-CZ feels better. The S-CZ is one of the slowest composite outer blades I have played. The S-CZ head is small and the Long 7 head is large.

Cheers
L-zr
 
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Yes, it’s faster, stiffer and heavier. Same rubbers. But the S-CZ feels better. The S-CZ is one of the slowest composite outer blades I have played. The S-CZ head is small and the Long 7 head is large.

Cheers
L-zr
Well, that explains it - a heavier blade with a more head heavy balance indeed should be faster.
Do you know the exact weight of both blades? That would be very helpful because I want to buy an S-CZ but I don't know which weight to choose.
 
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Well, that explains it - a heavier blade with a more head heavy balance indeed should be faster.
Do you know the exact weight of both blades? That would be very helpful because I want to buy an S-CZ but I don't know which weight to choose.
Mine were:
S-CZ 83g (listed avg 82g)
Long7 89g (listed avg 90g)

Note that the Long7 is discontinued...
I chose dit due to the increased handle size so I don't have to play with grip tape.
Most handles today are so puny...

Cheers
L-zr
 
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Mine were:
S-CZ 83g (listed avg 82g)
Long7 89g (listed avg 90g)

Note that the Long7 is discontinued...
I chose dit due to the increased handle size so I don't have to play with grip tape.
Most handles today are so puny...

Cheers
L-zr
Thanks for the reply. The weight difference is there and i guess the balance must have played an even bigger role.

Oh yes the struggle of finding a comfy handle is real :) I'm playing with grip tape myself.
Good to hear that you've found the one that you like!

Cheers
 
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