Trying to fix my robotic forehand

[dingyibvs]

When I said robotic I mostly meant not following through the shot when performing my FH stroke. Previously I would stop half way through and that looked very robotic to me

I don’t think I’m following 100% of what you’re saying. When you say pros arms and wrist is at their most streched after the forward strole do you mean that their arm is more “straight” after the stroke? Straight might not be the right term but maybe “extended”?

Yea that's what I mean, the entire body moves like a whip

 

[pedro.dantas]

I had an unplanned training session last night with one of the guys visiting for the tournament. Awesome dude, pretty high level. We were trying to fix my robotic forehand. As you watch the video you can see my fh getting better and better and towards the end its honestly the best it ever felt and looked. Still need to work on standing wider and being more consistent, but man did this make a big difference. Towards the end I'm waiting and watching the ball, hitting through the ball and following through it. I also left some of his advice uncut in case anyone benefits from it. Any feedback as usual is welcome!

Don't know if anyone told you this but you're ending the motion with the racket above your head.

 

[PenHoldSandro]

Youre great bro! All I have to say is just relax your arm more. Your stance, hips, waist, footwork, are great! Keep it up

 

[blahness]

In addition to the stance comments which I agree with - something I noticed in the feet - your feet are jumping/shifting throughout the swing instead of rotating (like snuffing out a cigaratte with the shoes as some old Chinese tutorials say). I think technically it is about pronation/supination of the feet. If you watch some old Bruce Lee movies you can also see that feet rotation in some of his moves.

The other thing is with the fingers, you can try out applying some pressure using the first joint of the index finger during the shot for some extra explosiveness. Similar to thumb applying pressure during BH.

 

[Gozo Aruna]

Yea that's what I mean, the entire body moves like a whip

I like this statement a lot. So much is said with so little! ❤️

 

[Novarac23]

In addition to the stance comments which I agree with - something I noticed in the feet - your feet are jumping/shifting throughout the swing instead of rotating (like snuffing out a cigaratte with the shoes as some old Chinese tutorials say). I think technically it is about pronation/supination of the feet. If you watch some old Bruce Lee movies you can also see that feet rotation in some of his moves.

The other thing is with the fingers, you can try out applying some pressure using the first joint of the index finger during the shot for some extra explosiveness. Similar to thumb applying pressure during BH.

Agreed 100% and have heard feet comment from several places! Thank you will work on that!

Don't know if anyone told you this but you're ending the motion with the racket above your head.

hmm interesting, I felt like on at least some of those I was trying to finish at my left eyebrow. Around what time did you see that?

 

[Novarac23]

don't need to focus on that, just have a wider stance, a loser arm and do the right weight transfer. here is a video of tomislav pucar, that is the same height as you and maybe it helps for reference of how wide you need to stand

Now this guy has a wide stance and that’s exactly how I need to stand. I think standing this wife and being more relaxed will fix some of the issues!

 

[pedro.dantas]

Agreed 100% and have heard feet comment from several places! Thank you will work on that!

hmm interesting, I felt like on at least some of those I was trying to finish at my left eyebrow. Around what time did you see that?

Just a tip, put more weight on your feet, you need a solid base, so you can make the weight transfer more easily.

 

[K.K]

Now this guy has a wide stance and that’s exactly how I need to stand. I think standing this wife and being more relaxed will fix some of the issues!

exactly! get your foundation right first, then the rest will come on the way. don't overcomplicate it and try those three things (relaxation for transfering power from the hip, wider stance, weight transfer) and this will be enough to make a lot of progress already.
someone on this forum send a video in a different thread that i happily forward to you. you can try these shadow exercises everytime before training
have fun and i hope it works!

 

[latej]

exactly! get your foundation right first, then the rest will come on the way. don't overcomplicate it and try those three things (relaxation for transfering power from the hip, wider stance, weight transfer) and this will be enough to make a lot of progress already.
someone on this forum send a video in a different thread that i happily forward to you. you can try these shadow exercises everytime before training
have fun and i hope it works!

This is imho the best video about the FH topspin...

@Novarac23 Doing this - you can also close the eyes - you *feel* (as many others suggested the feeling is so important) how the motion of the arm is induced (without muscles) by the rotation. First feel it in that exercise, but important is that later on you can also feel it during real shots. It really matters.

It is also related to the question you had on @dingyibvs, about when is the arm stretched. You see when the motion is induced, the arm will move with some delay - it is like the body is already rotated and then the arm shoots - it is this delay (I say it then shoots faster to make up for the delay, but that is just mnemonics). You actually have it too in your stroke already - you can see it on the motion of the left hand - it moves (or feels like) moving earlier than the playing hand... So, imo, you're on a good track, and I'd not worry about looking robotic... Cheers.

 

[McSmasher]

Yea that's what I mean, the entire body moves like a whip

To elaborate more on the concept of the whip, it's like a chain reaction that starts at the hand of the whipper, and transfers its power further down the whip, all the while generating more power, so by the time it comes to the end of the whip, all the power is unleashed, and you get that satisfying crack at the end.

This is similar to a table tennis forehand, where it starts at the push of the feet, through your leg, then your right hip drives forward, then the shoulder, forearm, wrist and fingers. The order of this is important, otherwise the power from this chain reaction will be lost.

@Novarac23 the biggest thing I noticed with your stroke throughout the video is that when you contact the ball, your weight looks like it's still on your right leg, and your weight only transfers after you connect with the ball. Imo you're leaving a lot on the table in terms of power and spin with this one thing. After your backswing, if you activated your right hip forward first before activating your arm, this would make a noticeable difference.

So in general, when I'm playing a forehand, I look for this activation sequence to be done in order:

1. Backswing with weight on right leg: yours looks ok
2. Start pushing off with right foot
3. Start driving right hip forward: you may have heard lots of people say that your weight transfer needs to go from the right foot to the left foot. This is a natural consequence of driving the right hip forward.
4. Drive the shoulder: probably a more advanced thing to do, so I wouldn't worry about it for now, but driving your shoulder forward and relaxing on impact can add some real explosiveness to your shot. It was covered in the Timo Boll video earlier in this thread
5. Forearm activation. After the backswing, as your weight goes forward from the right hip going forward, your forearm should naturally recoil backwards (i.e. straighter). Then, when the ball starts to get closer, you can start actively moving the forearm forward to generate more acceleration before contacting the ball. Note that this works best if your arm is super relaxed, and for me the easiest to do this is to mainly hold my bat loosely with the little finger and ring finger (but just tight enough where the bat doesn't go flying out of your hand lol), and the rest of the fingers are there as guides.
6. Wrist activation. After the backswing, when the weight goes forward and forearm starts activating, the weight of the hand should naturally be a bit further behind the forearm. Therefore, just before contacting the ball, you can bring the hand forward (by flicking your wrist) to add further acceleration.
7. Finger pressure. Right before contact with the ball, you can press the thumb and index finger together to add more stability and power to your shot. If you do this too early, then this will tense your wrist and forearm and the acceleration will not be as good.

Wow, so much to read! So TLDR; in your case, if you keep your shot the same, but activate the right hip forward before contacting the ball, this would be the easiest thing to do to add to your shot quality. And keeping your grip relaxed will also help generate spin with your forearm and wrist. Good luck!

 

[Gozo Aruna]

Here is my version of robotic forehand. Figure it is only fair to show mine if I am to comment on others.

 

[Novarac23]

exactly! get your foundation right first, then the rest will come on the way. don't overcomplicate it and try those three things (relaxation for transfering power from the hip, wider stance, weight transfer) and this will be enough to make a lot of progress already.
someone on this forum send a video in a different thread that i happily forward to you. you can try these shadow exercises everytime before training
have fun and i hope it works!

This is awesome, thank you! I am goin to practice this 100% and I loved the tip latej gave to close the eyes after I get a hang of it so will try that as well!

To elaborate more on the concept of the whip, it's like a chain reaction that starts at the hand of the whipper, and transfers its power further down the whip, all the while generating more power, so by the time it comes to the end of the whip, all the power is unleashed, and you get that satisfying crack at the end.

This is similar to a table tennis forehand, where it starts at the push of the feet, through your leg, then your right hip drives forward, then the shoulder, forearm, wrist and fingers. The order of this is important, otherwise the power from this chain reaction will be lost.

@Novarac23 the biggest thing I noticed with your stroke throughout the video is that when you contact the ball, your weight looks like it's still on your right leg, and your weight only transfers after you connect with the ball. Imo you're leaving a lot on the table in terms of power and spin with this one thing. After your backswing, if you activated your right hip forward first before activating your arm, this would make a noticeable difference.

So in general, when I'm playing a forehand, I look for this activation sequence to be done in order:

1. Backswing with weight on right leg: yours looks ok
2. Start pushing off with right foot
3. Start driving right hip forward: you may have heard lots of people say that your weight transfer needs to go from the right foot to the left foot. This is a natural consequence of driving the right hip forward.
4. Drive the shoulder: probably a more advanced thing to do, so I wouldn't worry about it for now, but driving your shoulder forward and relaxing on impact can add some real explosiveness to your shot. It was covered in the Timo Boll video earlier in this thread
5. Forearm activation. After the backswing, as your weight goes forward from the right hip going forward, your forearm should naturally recoil backwards (i.e. straighter). Then, when the ball starts to get closer, you can start actively moving the forearm forward to generate more acceleration before contacting the ball. Note that this works best if your arm is super relaxed, and for me the easiest to do this is to mainly hold my bat loosely with the little finger and ring finger (but just tight enough where the bat doesn't go flying out of your hand lol), and the rest of the fingers are there as guides.
6. Wrist activation. After the backswing, when the weight goes forward and forearm starts activating, the weight of the hand should naturally be a bit further behind the forearm. Therefore, just before contacting the ball, you can bring the hand forward (by flicking your wrist) to add further acceleration.
7. Finger pressure. Right before contact with the ball, you can press the thumb and index finger together to add more stability and power to your shot. If you do this too early, then this will tense your wrist and forearm and the acceleration will not be as good.

Wow, so much to read! So TLDR; in your case, if you keep your shot the same, but activate the right hip forward before contacting the ball, this would be the easiest thing to do to add to your shot quality. And keeping your grip relaxed will also help generate spin with your forearm and wrist. Good luck!

Thank you this was super detailed but very helpful and tldr is straight on point!

Here is my version of robotic forehand. Figure it is only fair to show mine if I am to comment on others.
View attachment 34988

I’ll show you mine if you show me yours looks like we have the same problem of weight transfer not making it to the left leg

 

[Gozo Aruna]

I’ll show you mine if you show me yours looks like we have the same problem of weight transfer not making it to the left leg

Hello my friend. It is only fair. If I need to comment, I should also allow reciprocity.

Back to your comment, thank you. You have good eyes. I knew something is off, just not right but just could not put my finger to it. Thanks and I'll work on that. I was too engrossed in imparting spin, forcing too much even. Forgotten the other component of a FH stroke.