ITTF World Team Table Tennis Championships Finals Busan 2024

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Mizutani: Have you read my book?
Hayata: Yes, I have
Mizutani: Miu-chan, too?
Hirano: Yes
Mizutani: Have you read it?
Ito: I don't know where it is
Mizutani: Hey, I'm sure I have sent it to your home
Ito: I absolutely won't read it. Absolutely not. I don't want to. Not when forced to. But my mom has probably read it...

https://youtu.be/OWN_Pf2xJ0w?t=236

迷马女士女王行为 (Miss Mima Queen Behavior)
https://tieba.baidu.com/p/8900192531
Mizutani: This dumb girl, I wrote the secret to securing Olympic singles in that book! How do you think I won All Japan 10 times?
 
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This is the exam training for IU-exam. Should be a rather easy call. The only thing the umpire must to is to descide if it isa a disturbance or not.

To me it looks like you're misinterpreting the question a bit. Here there's a crucial distinction between an umpire and referee and one the question is asking what are the limits of the umpire with respect to the referee.

Answer b. is not the only choice that an umpire can make as provided in the explanation. Answer b is just the only acceptable choice amongst the choices listed.

The explanation states clearly that if the player commits a "serious offense" then the umpire shall suspend play and report to the referee.

The missing piece of the puzzle is whether the tournament referee can give penalty points for serious offenses. If they can then the SWE point can be justified by the rules if the referee was called over to make the decision or if the woman scoring the game at the time wasn't just an umpire but also a referee.

Finally, I can get behind the idea that the SGP player thought her long serve was going out and thus shouted at that exact moment. I think if she explained this to the ref, then I'd also prefer that this be considered a lesser offense and a let replay called. This is the only explanation that makes sense other than an attempt at cheating.
 
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To me it looks like you're misinterpreting the question a bit. Here there's a crucial distinction between an umpire and referee and one the question is asking what are the limits of the umpire with respect to the referee.

Answer b. is not the only choice that an umpire can make as provided in the explanation. Answer b is just the only acceptable choice amongst the choices listed.

The explanation states clearly that if the player commits a "serious offense" then the umpire shall suspend play and report to the referee.

The missing piece of the puzzle is whether the tournament referee can give penalty points for serious offenses. If they can then the SWE point can be justified by the rules if the referee was called over to make the decision or if the woman scoring the game at the time wasn't just an umpire but also a referee.

Finally, I can get behind the idea that the SGP player thought her long serve was going out and thus shouted at that exact moment. I think if she explained this to the ref, then I'd also prefer that this be considered a lesser offense and a let replay called. This is the only explanation that makes sense other than an attempt at cheating.
The umpire can award point for misbehaviour from the Penalty Point System (PPS). Yellow (0 point), next is Yellow/Red (1 point), then Yellow/Red (2 points), then call the referee who will stop the match. If it is a serious offense the first time, the umpire may call the referee already here. The referee can not give any penalty point, but can give a red card and end the individual match. The referee can disqualify the player, in a team match normally for the remains of team match.
 
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The umpire can award point for misbehaviour from the Penalty Point System (PPS). Yellow (0 point), next is Yellow/Red (1 point), then Yellow/Red (2 points), then call the referee who will stop the match. If it is a serious offense the first time, the umpire may call the referee already here. The referee can not give any penalty point, but can give a red card and end the individual match. The referee can disqualify the player, in a team match normally for the remains of team match.
Ah okay. So the only system for awarding penalty points is through the card system?

So you can attempt to distract the player at least once and the worst that can happen is a yellow card and replay.

This actually now makes me think that the SGP player did it intentionally. Pretty smart move to bring out in critical situations. Either umpire doesn't catch it and you win the point, or you just get a yellow card and get to serve again while you've gotten your opponent annoyed.
 
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Ah okay. So the only system for awarding penalty points is through the card system?

So you can attempt to distract the player at least once and the worst that can happen is a yellow card and replay.

This actually now makes me think that the SGP player did it intentionally. Pretty smart move to bring out in critical situations. Either umpire doesn't catch it and you win the point, or you just get a yellow card and get to serve again while you've gotten your opponent annoyed.
Correct. However "the worst thing that can happen" is probably that you outsmart yourself - if the other player still makes a good return and win the point, or that it is so blatant that the referee comes with the red card. But points for misbehavior is only by the penalty point system.
 
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This is the exam training for IU-exam. Should be a rather easy call. The only thing the umpire must to is to descide if it isa a disturbance or not.
So you are saying that an umpire is *only allowed* to give warnings for the first disturbance?
 
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So you are saying that an umpire is *only allowed* to give warnings for the first disturbance?
Yes, that is correct.
If we start in HMO, it says:

12.1.4 The umpire must never award points for reasons that are not supported by the laws, perhaps
because he or she considers that one player “deserves” a point or that another should be
penalised for an unfair action. The umpire should always be able to justify any decision he
or she makes by reference to a law, and it is for this reason that he or she should study
carefully and understand all of the reasons for which a point may be scored.

If we go to the law 2.10, it says how you score a point:
2.10.1 Unless the rally is a let, a player shall score a point
2.10.1.1 if an opponent fails to make a correct service;
2.10.1.2 if an opponent fails to make a correct return;
...and then the few situations otherwise
-obstruction
-deliberate double hit
-strike with a side without ITTF-rubber
-moving the playing surface
-touches the net assembly
-free hand on playing surface
-out of sequense in doubles
-expedite
-para/wheelchair: no contact with the seat
-para/wheelchair: any hand on table before striking
-para/wheelchair: footrest or foot on floor during play
-para/wheelchari: chair or foot crossing the center line

2.9 Tells us the 8-12 reasons for a let. This includes disturbance that makes the opponent miss, if the conditions are disturbed in a way that it could affect the outcome of the rally, and to warn or penalise a player or adviser.

Well, then how can you penalise a player or adviser? Then we are in 3, the regulations for international competitions. We are in 3.5.2, where we find the yellow cards, yellow/red, penalty point system and calling the referee to stop the match. For context - shouting is normally considered less serious (=PPS), but of course there could be situations where it is considered serious (call the referee - red card - stop the match):

3.5.2.2 If at any time a player, a coach or another adviser commits a serious offence
the umpire shall suspend play and report immediately to the referee; for less
serious offences the umpire may, on the first occasion, hold up a yellow card
and warn the offender that any further offence is liable to incur penalties.
3.5.2.3 Except as provided in 3.5.2.2 and 3.5.2.5, if a player who has been warned
commits a second offence in the same individual match or team match, the
umpire shall award 1 point to the offender's opponent and for a further
offence he or she shall award 2 points, each time holding up a yellow and a
red card together.
3.5.2.4 If a player against whom 3 penalty points have been awarded in the same
individual match or team match continues to misbehave, the umpire shall
suspend play and report immediately to the referee.

So, yes, the normal in this situation will be: Let, yellow card, replay the point.

As for "you almost never replay the point", this is correct outside of the 8-12 reasons for let in 2.9. Typical if there is an edge/side, hit/miss, obstruction/not obstruction, there is only point to A or point to B as the options. But this is totally different from e.g. let for disturbance + let for warning a player.

I hope this helps.
Kind regards
 
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Yes, that is correct.
If we start in HMO, it says:

12.1.4 The umpire must never award points for reasons that are not supported by the laws, perhaps
because he or she considers that one player “deserves” a point or that another should be
penalised for an unfair action. The umpire should always be able to justify any decision he
or she makes by reference to a law, and it is for this reason that he or she should study
carefully and understand all of the reasons for which a point may be scored.

If we go to the law 2.10, it says how you score a point:
2.10.1 Unless the rally is a let, a player shall score a point
2.10.1.1 if an opponent fails to make a correct service;
2.10.1.2 if an opponent fails to make a correct return;
...and then the few situations otherwise
-obstruction
-deliberate double hit
-strike with a side without ITTF-rubber
-moving the playing surface
-touches the net assembly
-free hand on playing surface
-out of sequense in doubles
-expedite
-para/wheelchair: no contact with the seat
-para/wheelchair: any hand on table before striking
-para/wheelchair: footrest or foot on floor during play
-para/wheelchari: chair or foot crossing the center line

2.9 Tells us the 8-12 reasons for a let. This includes disturbance that makes the opponent miss, if the conditions are disturbed in a way that it could affect the outcome of the rally, and to warn or penalise a player or adviser.

Well, then how can you penalise a player or adviser? Then we are in 3, the regulations for international competitions. We are in 3.5.2, where we find the yellow cards, yellow/red, penalty point system and calling the referee to stop the match. For context - shouting is normally considered less serious (=PPS), but of course there could be situations where it is considered serious (call the referee - red card - stop the match):

3.5.2.2 If at any time a player, a coach or another adviser commits a serious offence
the umpire shall suspend play and report immediately to the referee; for less
serious offences the umpire may, on the first occasion, hold up a yellow card
and warn the offender that any further offence is liable to incur penalties.
3.5.2.3 Except as provided in 3.5.2.2 and 3.5.2.5, if a player who has been warned
commits a second offence in the same individual match or team match, the
umpire shall award 1 point to the offender's opponent and for a further
offence he or she shall award 2 points, each time holding up a yellow and a
red card together.
3.5.2.4 If a player against whom 3 penalty points have been awarded in the same
individual match or team match continues to misbehave, the umpire shall
suspend play and report immediately to the referee.

So, yes, the normal in this situation will be: Let, yellow card, replay the point.

As for "you almost never replay the point", this is correct outside of the 8-12 reasons for let in 2.9. Typical if there is an edge/side, hit/miss, obstruction/not obstruction, there is only point to A or point to B as the options. But this is totally different from e.g. let for disturbance + let for warning a player.

I hope this helps.
Kind regards
Thanks. There could be situations where it is considered seriously and needs referee opinion. So I guess the question is whether the referee was involved in the decision or not.
 
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I totally agree. Normal situation is "let, yellow, replay". If it is serious, "let" - up with the hand and call the referee. Then the referre will say a) "let, yellow, replay" or b) "red card, disqualification normally from the team match" - and the other player (and depending on the situation - the other team) win.
Thanks. There could be situations where it is considered seriously and needs referee opinion. So I guess the question is whether the referee was involved in the decision or not.
 
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Post-match interviews with Harimoto and Matsushima. Harimoto is very humble, saying the match could have gone either way and that he and LYJ are neck and neck but still thinks he's inferior to LYJ even though he won today.

Wei Qingguang/ISEKI Seiko comments on Harimoto's growth, saying he handles shots to his crossover much better expected this time, almost perfect and Harimoto agrees when told about it in his interview. He stresses that LYJ's form is not poor at all but he couldn't pull himself together after dropping G1.

大一番を制した日本男子。張本智和、松島輝空の試合後の囲みインタビューを全文紹介
https://world-tt.com/blog/news/archives/161748
「最初から競るとわかっていたので、その準備をして最後粘り強くやれた。初めて対戦したけど、みんなから粘り強いと聞いていて、やったら本当に粘り強くてベテラン感があった。最後、9−9で勝負できたのが勝ちの要因でした。最終ゲームは勝ちたいという気持ちが強かったので1球目から声を出していきました。

緊張はしなかったんですけど、あの場所で、いろんな人の応援が力になりました。試合前は前について荘選手よりも下がらない、粘り強く、サービスをきっちりと狙ったところに出すことを注意した。

普段の試合と違って、緊張感のある舞台で盛り上がるし、やっていて楽しい舞台でした。この1勝は大きいですね」(松島輝空)

(トップに入る前の心構えは?)

「いやもう、1番で負けるのは論外だと思っていたので。もし負けたら0ー3、良くても1ー3でチームも負けてしまう。自分が2番手に負けたら話にならない。ぼくの相手も強いですけど、強かろうが弱かろうが、ぼくは林選手以外には絶対に負けてはいけないと思っていた。その意志で2、3ゲーム目を取り切れた。意志の強さが相手より上だったのかなと思います。

 (2ゲーム目は4回ゲームポイントを取られても非常に冷静でしたが?)

 数年前より、ジュースの時でも落ち着いて戦えるようになったと思います。逆に自分がリードしても決めきれない気持ちを知っているし、1点取り切る難しさも知っている。自分が間違いをおかさなければ、相手はミスが出てくるし、たまにはトリッキーな奇襲も仕掛けていく。そのバランスが今日は良かったですけど、昨日はジュースで取られたゲームもありました。ジュースは全部取れるものではないですけど、できるだけ多く取れるようにとは思っています。

4番の林昀儒選手には、勝つなら3ー2、よくて3ー1くらいだと思っていた。もちろんストレートで勝てるとはさらさら思っていない。やっぱりゲームを落とした後の修正力はすごいなと改めて思いました。同じ戦術で2ゲーム連続で取れる選手ではない。それでも5ゲーム目、自分が取る番でしっかり取れた。それは1ゲーム目を取れたことが大きかったと思います。ずっと取って、取られての流れだった。その中で、どちらかというとぼくのほうが5ゲーム目に危機感を持って臨むことができた。

(WTTフランクフルトでは悔しい思いをして臨んだ試合でしたが?)

フランクフルトではノータッチで抜かれたボールも、ミスしても返したり、逆にカウンターを決めたり、この2カ月、3カ月よく頑張った証が出たと思います。引き続き、この調子で練習を頑張っていきたいと改めて思いました。

右利きの選手は林選手のバッククロスのボールは本当にキツいと思うんですけど、そこをうまく返せたことで林選手も少し焦ったり、逆にぼくのバッククロスも効いたりした。お互いの有利な展開の中で、ぼくのほうが少し多く点を取れたかなと思います。それでも僅差ですし、また明日やったらわからない。うれしいことはもちろんうれしいですけど、取ったゲームと落としたゲームをしっかり反省して、もっと強くならないといけない。

 レシーブについては完璧に取れてはいないですけど、前よりはチキータできたり、ストップやツッツキを混ぜていける。1種類だけのレシーブで勝てる相手ではないですし、今日はチキータができない、今日はツッツキができないというケースもある。いろいろなパターンを想定して、この時はこのレシーブが最善、という絶妙なところで少しだけ上回れた。最終ゲームも11ー3ですけど、ちょっと間違ったらこちらが3点だったかもしれない。8ー0になってもまったく余裕はなかった。点差というより3ー2というスコアがすべてで、3ー2か2ー3で決着がつく試合だったかなと思います。出足でリードしたゲームは、リードしたほうが勝つという感じでした。

 林昀儒選手に勝てたのは大きいことですし、自信はとてもつきましたけど、まだ予選ですから。これがトーナメントだったらより意味がありますけど、林選手もおそらく予選は通過してくるでしょうし、ドローがどちらが良くなるかも運なので。そんなに喜びすぎる必要もない。互角だなと思います。今日勝っても林選手と互角か、まだぼくは自分のほうが下だと思っています。本当に、もっともっと向かっていきたいです。

 (相手ベンチの偉関晴光さんはミドルの処理がうまくなったと言っていましたが?)

 そうですね、ミドルからフォアサイドの遠いところにかけて、やっぱり一歩足が出たり、手が出たり、体のひねりができたり、そこは今日試合をしながら感じましたし、田勢監督からも「今日は前回とは違うぞ」と言ってもらった。自分でも周りからも自信を得ながらプレーできました。

 (松島選手の勝利は勇気になりましたか?)

 もちろん後輩があんなに良い場面で回してくれて、決めないわけにはいかない。松島選手もそうですし、その前の篠塚選手も負けはしましたけど、本当に素晴らしかった。2ー3までいって、1ー3でもおかしくないところを逆転した。今日はみんな良いプレーだったと思います。内容で言えばみんな、ほぼ完璧だったと思う。松島選手も篠塚選手も初出場とは思えない素晴らしいプレーだったと思います」(張本智和)

チャイニーズタイペイの男子監督、「イーさん」こと偉関晴光さんが語った張本智和の成長
https://world-tt.com/blog/news/archives/161866
「張本くんの出来(でき)が良かったですね。彼があそこまで良いとは思っていなかった。動きが良くなったし、特にミドルの処理が素晴らしかった」。ミックスゾーンで開口一番、そう語った偉関さん。

「張本くんのミドルの処理は今回、ほぼ完璧な状態だった。私の想像以上でした。林昀儒の調子は決して悪くなかったです。最近、強化練習もしていたし、Tリーグでの勝率も高かった。張本くんとは相性もそんなに悪くないけど、1ゲーム目を取られてちょっと気持ちが整理できなかったところがある。ネットやエッジでも不運なところがあり、流れが変わってしまいましたね」(偉関さん)

3番でプレーした松島輝空についても、「最後の5ゲーム目、9ー9での2本のレシーブには(松島の)すごい成長を感じた。びっくりしましたね」と語った偉関さん。5ゲーム目、9ー6のリードから9ー9に追いつかれ、荘智淵のサービス。松島にとっては苦しい場面だったが、冷静にレシーブからラリーを組み立て、最後はフォアハンドの強打を決めた。

2勝の張本智和「頑張ってきた証が出た」「みんなほぼ完璧だった」<世界卓球2024>
https://rallys.online/topic/international/240216wttc-harimoto/

【世界卓球2024団体戦】エース・張本智和が躍動!パリ五輪出場権獲得へ負けられない台湾戦を制し、3連勝!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=koUKaXXB6x0
 
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The umpire can award point for misbehaviour from the Penalty Point System (PPS). Yellow (0 point), next is Yellow/Red (1 point), then Yellow/Red (2 points), then call the referee who will stop the match. If it is a serious offense the first time, the umpire may call the referee already here. The referee can not give any penalty point, but can give a red card and end the individual match. The referee can disqualify the player, in a team match normally for the remains of team match.
I think you raised a fair point.

I don't like how ITTF handles its umpire/referee dispute management.
I'm not sure if there is anything behind the scenes (ie apologies to national associations), but since TT has 200 national associations members and claim to be one of the biggest sports in the world, it would be better if ITTF technical committee gives press releases on different umpire/referee incidents and give explanations and what not.
so far, it is only forum or social media talk and no one serious is wanting to give voice.

If any, ITTF technical committee are at fault with this incident, but now, it seems to be a Singaporean cheater versus a Swedish moaner... the players are the victim to me if the umpires can't withhold the rule book correctly.

I love ITTF to talk about this too:


In the case of the latter, I know there was no apologies by ITTF given to the 2 victims.

and then you have that incident of Ma Long blocking the balls path while the ball is still live and within the boundary of the table. WTT social media then puts a post to ask the fans, if it is in or out... I was like, I want to hear that answer from the ITTF Technical Committee, as your umpire said its out, while camera angle does show Ma Long blocking a live ball (whether the ball will land in or not, is not the debate). So they rather make a social media post for engagement, but silent from technical committee.

and I also feel, post match punishments on unsportsmanlike behavior needs to be in placed - given by the same technical committee via press release or press conference.
IE, throwing rackets across the playing area.
Either a fine and/or banning on participation and/or reduction or ranking points.

that red card (if even given) is nothing and if TT wants to be serious, it should learn from the bigger sports. That is my take
 
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More details on how much stuff Ovtcharov lost.

Passport - 1
Wallet - 1
Blade - 4
Rubber - 40

He had a spare passport and a spare blade at home, contacted UMEMURA Aya (the one who beat Zhang Yining at WTTC 2004) of TBE (Tamasu Butterfly Europe) to get 40 more rubbers and flew to Busan the next day.

Jorgen Persson caught a cold as well and chose to "bench" himself in the spectator seat during SWE vs HKG to avoid close contacts.

オフチャロフ、カバンが盗難にあい、ラケット、ラバー、財布が! ただし、釜山ではなく、ドイツで
https://world-tt.com/blog/news/archives/161912
その手荷物がまさかの盗難を受けた。パスポートがないと国外にはいけないのだが、トップアスリートは頻繁に海外に行くために、パスポートに代わる身分証明書を自宅に置いていた。オフチャロフは自宅に戻り、さらに1本だけあったスペアラケットを持ち、ラバーはすぐにTBE(バタフライ・ヨーロッパ)の梅村礼さんに連絡が入り、また40枚ほど調達して、翌日に釜山に出発した。

また、今大会は日本の戸上、アルナ(ナイジェリア)、ボル(ドイツ)など多くの選手が体調を崩している。冬の開催の難しさだろう。
果ては、スウェーデン男子のベンチには監督のヨルゲン・パーソン(元世界チャンピオン)が座らず、観客席にいた。香港戦で勝利して、ベンチに来てもグータッチ。「選手との亀裂? 監督外(はず)しか」(ヨーロッパでは珍しくない)と推測したのだが、聞けば、「風邪を引いたので、選手にうつさないため」だったらしい。
世界大会は何が起こるかわからない。卓球以外での対応力も試されているのかもしれない。
 
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More details on how much stuff Ovtcharov lost.

Passport - 1
Wallet - 1
Blade - 4
Rubber - 40

He had a spare passport and a spare blade at home, contacted UMEMURA Aya (the one who beat Zhang Yining at WTTC 2004) of TBE (Tamasu Butterfly Europe) to get 40 more rubbers and flew to Busan the next day.

Jorgen Persson caught a cold as well and chose to "bench" himself in the spectator seat during SWE vs HKG to avoid close contacts.

オフチャロフ、カバンが盗難にあい、ラケット、ラバー、財布が! ただし、釜山ではなく、ドイツで
https://world-tt.com/blog/news/archives/161912
how do you have a spare passport....
I can understand dual nationality, so 2 different passports.... but spare passport is new to me.

4 blade is normal,
40 rubbers for a tournament.... that is not normal to me. haha
it is basically 5 pairs per blade
It is normal to have 4 pairs (on the 4 blades) on already, and have around another 4~8 pairs as spares.... (so he carried extra 2 to 3 pairs per blade as spare's spare) lol
 
says Shoo...nothing to see here. - zeio
says Shoo...nothing to see here. - zeio
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how are they making the draw for the KO tournament ? are all the teams already pre-arranged somewhere according to their positions or is it a new random draw ?
1st in group (8 teams) get a bye in R24 of main draw
2nd and 3rd get drawn in R24 of main draw
Those reaching QF qualify for team event of Paris 2024 and get 2 singles spots automatically.

That's why JPN vs TPE was so heated. Losing there could mean running into CHN sooner than wanted.

 
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