i dont think chinese rubbers do most people any favours

[Tony's Table Tennis]

how would i know about every person on the entire world?

how would I know you don't know every person in the entire world?
since you did put MOST in capital letters.
so that is a big scream and it sounds like the entire world to me.

 

[mocker88]

It's all about what you need when playing. I need tacky rubbers with a less elastic top sheet and a harder sponge, because I often close my racket angle much and like high amount of spin and brush loops. I also have a faster carbon blade with my rubbers to give me the speed I need in combination with my not so bouncy rubbers. I really like this way of playing, to swing fast and hard and to get the most out of it I need this kind of setup to engage the less elastic top sheet with the harder sponge.

Other players like other setups Now there are a lot of Chinese rubbers that have softer properties, but they are not just that bouncy like tensor rubbers. These will give you better opportunity to play in a controlled way without swinging like crazy. Just saying that Chinese rubbers aren't all similar to Hurricane III.

Just compare Yinhe - Mercury III Euro to Yasaka - Rakza 7 Soft. Similar, but M3E doesn't bounce in the same way and cost 1/3 of R7S. Rubbers like 729 - Presto MAX Spin or Sanwei - Gear Hyper are really quite similar to European tensors in 47-50deg, but without the bounce, giving more control in all parts of the game. You often just need a bit faster blade to get them going in the same speed as tensor rubbers.

Don't be afraid. Release your inner China-man and go exploring. Your coach shouldn't tell you that you should play in specific ways or only recommend rubbers that he/she plays with. Of course the coach knows the setup of his own the best, but there Isn't a single table tennis player that plays in the same way as another and they all have different needs. So why limit everyone to use the rubbers and blade that YOU play with? That's just plain stupid in my opinion

 

[joshmak10]

There is a difference between giving a recommendation and saying something very definitive. I recommend players who don’t know anything about equipment and are notmal attackers to use chinese/hybrids for FH and hybrids/tensors for BH, based on my personal experiences. Ofc everyone is different but I’m not saying most people ALWAYS benefit from chinese rubbers on FH or most people ALWAYS WONT benefit from tensors on FH. This is just a tip that I would give but people may play differently and thus my advice would be useless to them, and I respect that. I’m not going around saying “MOST PLAYERS NEED TO PLAY WITH CHINESE RUBBERS BECAUSE I PLAY A CHINESE GAME” which is basically what OP is saying about tensors.

 

[Arkady]

Interesting thread.
I was completely against Chinese rubbers because they require constant boosting and full body swing in order to fully utilize their power, which most amateur players can't support.

But just the other day, a friend of mine had a Nittaku Hurricane Pro 3 Turbo Blue on his FH. I tried it and I was really AMAZED: With just a snap of the wrist, it was generating twice the spin my Nittaku G1 was generating.
I made a little research about it and found out that it has a Japanese sponge and Chinese tacky topsheet.
It's main disadvantage though is that it's really heavy, probably one of the heaviest rubbers in the market.

While I didn't have a full practice with it to test its power, block, push etc, I am definitely inclined to buy and have a try with it.

 

[longle]

why not use the best of both worlds ? tacky topsheet + tensor sponge all in 1: the hybrids (more profits for the brands also)

everyone around me are using 09c/K3 and attack like crazy. And here I am still sticking with my DHS rubbers and let them do the attacking while I block and counter..

 

[Tyce]

why not use the best of both worlds ? tacky topsheet + tensor sponge all in 1: the hybrids (more profits for the brands also)

everyone around me are using 09c/K3 and attack like crazy. And here I am still sticking with my DHS rubbers and let them do the attacking while I block and counter..

Because hybrids are expensive and don't last long

 

[canonFH]

I use H3 on both sides. In my opinion, H3 is a good training rubber. It might not win you as many points, but you always know what mistake you made when the ball hits the net or goes out. H3 Prov is about half the price of Tenergy/Dignics where I live, lasts longer, and stays almost the same.

ESN rubbers on FH turn whitish in about a week for me, and start playing like shit. I would go so far as to say that ESN rubbers are mostly scam. Most of them play similarly, and only play good for a short period of time, so no reviews of them can be trusted.

If you don't train much and only play matches, I can understand your opinion. Still, for me, peak match performance is a freshly boosted H3 with 3 layers.

So for serious players who are not sponsored, H3 is where its at. I don't want to play like a God for the first week I paste a rubber and then have it turn dead on me. Also, I have tried Yinhe, and Loki rubbers, and nothing comes close to H3. So I will strictly talk about H3 and not lump all chinese rubbers: If you are training seriously, there's nothing else. The only other rubber I would consider is G1.

Of course, this is assuming that money is a consideration.

 

[longle]

Because hybrids are expensive and don't last long

that's why I said more profits for the brands.. it would benefit the sport in every ways

 

[Tyce]

I use H3 on both sides. In my opinion, H3 is a good training rubber. It might not win you as many points, but you always know what mistake you made when the ball hits the net or goes out. H3 Prov is about half the price of Tenergy/Dignics where I live, lasts longer, and stays almost the same.

ESN rubbers on FH turn whitish in about a week for me, and start playing like shit. I would go so far as to say that ESN rubbers are mostly scam. Most of them play similarly, and only play good for a short period of time, so no reviews of them can be trusted.

I wonder what that is... I've never seen a Euro rubber turn whitish in real life unless they're really, really old, but I've seen pictures from other parts of the world that looks absolutely horrible. Really wonder what makes it go that bad, that quickly.
I know UV kills rubber like nothing else, and maybe water with a high mineral content? I can't think of much else.

On the other hand, Hurricane 3 oxidizes pretty quickly. But that's pretty much a cosmetic problem, it plays the same afterwards.

If you don't train much and only play matches, I can understand your opinion. Still, for me, peak match performance is a freshly boosted H3 with 3 layers.

So for serious players who are not sponsored, H3 is where its at. I don't want to play like a God for the first week I paste a rubber and then have it turn dead on me. Also, I have tried Yinhe, and Loki rubbers, and nothing comes close to H3. So I will strictly talk about H3 and not lump all chinese rubbers: If you are training seriously, there's nothing else. The only other rubber I would consider is G1.

Of course, this is assuming that money is a consideration.

 

[boretennis]

and on the 9th day, ITTF introduced a rule that 1. boosting isnt allowed and there are (god forbid... people who actually follow rules) and i dont care if ''everyone is doing it anyways and gets away with it. rule is: boosting is not allowed, therefor i will not boost.

i dont cross the street when traffic light says red, just because no car is coming and noone cares either. i ll stand there and wait until its green because thats what the rules say.

there is a reason doping in sports isnt allowed. boosting is basically doping for your equipment. if i would boost my body in a way to get an advantage over people who dont do that, would you be okay with that?

neither do i want to nor do i have the time to constantly worry about boosting and buying boosters, and praying and the reboosting every few weeks.

if pros do it... its a different enviroment. they simply boost, use the rubber for a week and then put a new rubber on anyways but for most normal people, its completely unpractical to do these kind of things on top. its just such a fkd up mentality somehow. ''lets buy a super hard rubber and because its way to hard and feels like playing with a frying pan, we then use illegal things to make the rubber somehow playable instead of just buying a playable rubber to begin with''

when i buy a product, i expect it to work. if i have to manually make a product usable, the product itself is fundamentally flawed

tell me you are german without telling me you are german

 

[canonFH]

I wonder what that is... I've never seen a Euro rubber turn whitish in real life unless they're really, really old, but I've seen pictures from other parts of the world that looks absolutely horrible. Really wonder what makes it go that bad, that quickly.
I know UV kills rubber like nothing else, and maybe water with a high mineral content? I can't think of much else.

On the other hand, Hurricane 3 oxidizes pretty quickly. But that's pretty much a cosmetic problem, it plays the same afterwards.

Something like this: only more pronounced. (This is not my picture)

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I guess worn out would be a more appropriate term. I use a plastic film to cover my H3. Never had oxidation problems. Usually, with H3, the sponge dies for me before the topsheet.

 

[Lazer]

I dont think this topic do most people any favours...

Cheers
L-zr

 

[Tony's Table Tennis]

Chinese rubbers are so good, now even non Chinese rubbers are trying to become Chinese rubbers

 

[Lazer]

Chinese rubbers are so good, now even non Chinese rubbers are trying to become Chinese rubbers

Yeah, good point.... In TT everyone and everything wants to be Chinese.

Cheers
L-zr

 

[Migzkulit]

Chinese rubbers are so good, now even non Chinese rubbers are trying to become Chinese rubbers

Anti spin is even better, as time passes, any type of inverted rubber turns into a slippery mess.

 

[NetProphet]

when i say ''most people'' i am assuming that people can understand what i mean by that in the first place. everything you say is always coming from a point of view.

you see my country flag on the left? when i am saying ''most people'' and you dont see a chinese flag there, obviously i am talking about most people... HERE... in europe.

same as statements like ''most people use chinese rubbers'' arent true, depending on where you re coming from. for example, i havent even met a SINGLE person here anywhere who even plays with chinese rubbers OR blades. not a single one. if i ask people at local clubs what they think about hurricane or yinhe or something, i am sure they dont even know what yinhe even is or you re getting looked down upon because using stuff like aliexpress or buying from china is really something most people dont even support at all. 99% of people here (especially club players) play either butterfly or andro equipment, including rubbers. i am literally the only person i have ever encountered who uses chinese rubbers in general.

we also have huge communities in street tabletennis. hundreds of people meeting up every day to play. havent seen a single person even using something with a chinese name on. they dont even buy online either. everyone is buying in local stores shopping local brands.

if you run around with a chinese blade here, you literally feel like a complete alien and the only people i constantly hear talking about chinese stuff... are people online. i havent met a single person actually using it in real life.

but if you happen to live in a country where you have coaches teaching chinese style, hey good for you...use it then because it makes sense. but over here where i live, you stick to what your coach says and when your coach uses european gear and tells you that you should use european gear because it will fit the style of play way better... you use european gear. you re not like ''nah coach.. i rather use that weird chinese thing there, noone here even heard about''

i actually thought to be clear on this and assume people are as intelligent enough to read between the lines that everything i say comes from my standpoint, based on where i live. heck its even in my very first sentence.
''I want to state that this is just my opinion, based on my observations but also on various people trying and playing my setups.''

Yes, it's what YOU think.
And fair enough.

But if you expect anyone to respect your thoughts on it then you have to also respect theirs and there are plenty outside of your tiny corner of em world (Germxn of Europe if you prefer) who think differently.

I personally think you are wrong because you are trying to make it perfectly black and white, so I find that a bit ridiculous because it's definitely not black and white.

I personally know 8 or 9 players who use Chinese rubbers. Most of the players I know use ESN or Butterfly but the fact that many can play VERY well with Chinese rubber already tells me that you might just be wrong. They don't have Chinese coaches but they can control the ball, defend and hit winners, no issue.

Another thing is that most of the ESN and Butterfly players have never actually tried Chinese rubber so how can anyone know how they would get on if they tried? It just takes a while to get used to something I reckon so my thought is that most would play just fine with Chinese rubber once the got used to it - I actually think you're exaggerating the difference of the rubbers somewhat....

It's an opinion based on your experience and of course you're entitled to it. But since you cannot ever prove it correct, nor prove those with opposite opinions to be wrong then just accept other opinions to carry as much weight as your own.

 

[Tyce]

Something like this: only more pronounced. (This is not my picture)

Shared album from Vadym 📸

Tap to view!

photos.app.goo.gl

Yeah, it looks like what I thought you meant, but how does that happen in a week? I only see this kind of wear/discoloration after a few months.
Might be a difference in the environment. Airconditioning? Most halls don't have that over here.

I guess worn out would be a more appropriate term. I use a plastic film to cover my H3. Never had oxidation problems. Usually, with H3, the sponge dies for me before the topsheet.

Yeah as I said, it doesn't really have an effect on how it plays. I do use a cover sheet, but if I forget, like on a tournament day, or there's just a little bit too much moisture under the cover sheet, it ruins the look of the topsheet.

I'm definitely not debating the quality of H3. It's a very well engineered rubber even with the boosting requirement. I just think the majority of European players won't make much use of it because they have been trained to play tensor.
It can be a helpful tool to learn how to get the best out of hybrids though. Understanding both ends of the spectrum is helpful in understanding how a mix of those things would work.

 

[Jslick89]

Interesting thread.
I was completely against Chinese rubbers because they require constant boosting and full body swing in order to fully utilize their power, which most amateur players can't support.

But just the other day, a friend of mine had a Nittaku Hurricane Pro 3 Turbo Blue on his FH. I tried it and I was really AMAZED: With just a snap of the wrist, it was generating twice the spin my Nittaku G1 was generating.
I made a little research about it and found out that it has a Japanese sponge and Chinese tacky topsheet.
It's main disadvantage though is that it's really heavy, probably one of the heaviest rubbers in the market.

While I didn't have a full practice with it to test its power, block, push etc, I am definitely inclined to buy and have a try with it.

H3N does require boosting, but i feel like most people overestimate how much time and effort it takes to boost. it's really quite a simple process:

1) Open vacuum sealed rubber (10 seconds)
2) remove white protecting sheet off the sponge side (10 seconds)
3) open and apply booster (1-2 minutes tops, honestly I spend more time getting the booster off the brush back into the bottle than I do actually applying the booster to the sponge)
4) wait 24 hours for booster to dry
5) apply second layer of booster (1-2 minutes)
6) wait another 24 hours for second layer to dry

Once you finish these 6 steps, all you have to do is glue and cut your rubber, just like you would any other rubber. Most of the time spend is actually just waiting, which you dont have to sit there and watch the booster dry. you have a whole day to do whatever you want lol. The actual time of effort it takes to boost a brand new rubber takes a total of 4 minutes and 30 seconds.

Also, you don't need a full body swing every time. you just need to engage the rubber. To me. that means using the power from your kinetic chain, swinging fast, hitting with a slightly more open racket face, and then using the flick of the wrist at the point of contact to control the spin.

btw, i'm curious if a 3 times boosted and 2 times glued H3N weighs close to the nittaku hurricane pro 3 turbo blue. i imagine they have to be pretty close in weight since the booster and glue definitely adds at least several grams of weight to the rubber.

 

[Tyce]

Funny thing, this thread is making me want to try H3 again. I won't make the mistake of putting it on a 5ply, that's just too little base power for me. But a provincial sheet, and national seamoon... Who knows.

 

[Scarfed Garchomp]

btw, i'm curious if a 3 times boosted and 2 times glued H3N weighs close to the nittaku hurricane pro 3 turbo blue. i imagine they have to be pretty close in weight since the booster and glue definitely adds at least several grams of weight to the rubber.

Turbo Blue is still heavier. Cut to standard Butterfly headsize it can weigh as much as 60g