bh flick vs (hard) bh flip

[plunder]

(( since it's biomechanically easier with the backhand (bh), we can focus on the bh version rather than the fh flip. ))

Professionals only employ the bh flick ... which is a flicking bh stroke that can be applied to nospin balls, topspin balls, underspin balls, and heavy underspin balls (if you're up to it!) and could be compared to a superb-quality mini bh loop. The stroke definitely imparts additional topspin to the outgoing ball.

I noticed that at amateur level, experienced or skilled players employ the bh flip instead ... which is a slapping bh stroke that becomes most surprising if applied to underspin balls (and even some heavy underspin balls, if you're up to it!) and could be compared to a mini bh nospin "loop" (yet not a looping stroke at all!). On incoming underspin balls, the stroke neutralizes/overrides and eliminates the underspin (a harder bh flip); on incoming heavy underspin balls, the stroke returns much of the original incoming spin (a softer bh flip: the ball keeps rotating in the identical spinning direction while flying back and forth over the net).

Yes i know, everybody uses the words flick / flip synonymously, but after having played against so many players who devastated me 🫠 mentally with their hard bh flip, i set out to learn the technique myself and confirm that such a shot is indeed possible. What's that? — You're in a push rally (push duel), either player tries his best to produce a high-quality push (i.e. lots of underspin, low over the net, and landing anywhere short/shortish/midlong/longish/long), you believe that you succeeded in having done so, and suddenly the opponent slaps the ball back with this bh, just like that! 😵‍💫

He clearly did not employ a banana flick, not a bh loop, not a soft bh flip. It was a slap .. based on a nospin stroke, fascinating! At home, with the Omni S Pro, i am finally able to practice all related variations of the nospin stroke on balls with realistically stepped underspin levels: the nospin loop, the inverse lupfer, the soft bh flip, the hard bh flip. It's such an essential difference whether you flick (=topspinning) a shortish underspin ball or you slap it (=flipping it hard, basically "ignoring" the underspin!). Having a practice partner who is a master of the hard bh flip, and practicing it systematically with this robot, ... has been mind-blowing to me.

The word has to be out, hence this TO: there is a clear difference between a backhand flick and a backhand flip! (And it definitely helps thinking like that when one practices the attacking/opening-up of short/shortish/midlong underspin balls on one's bh side.)

Even gpt agrees with me on the topic:

ChatGPT - Table Tennis Shots

Shared via ChatGPT

chatgpt.com

My wish is to become a master too, at the bh flip (hard and soft variants, and I really don't mean the bh flick!). It's a fantastic way to open up the rally above the table. Lodziak's amateur version resembles more a soft bh flip, since he doesn't slap the ball:

 

[plunder]

well, what's the point of this thread?

First of all, to share my amazement. It's frustrating/amazing when we deliver high-quality pushes and the opponent doesn't open up with a proper bh loop against underspin but with an aggressive flip (not flick!). It's an art to low-slap underspin balls (and some heavy underspin balls)! Those amateurs who mastered the art of bh flip (not flick!) against underspin balls often cannot execute a proper beautiful bh loop against underspin; and they really doht need to. Opening up or attacking with a bh flip is just as effective.

Secondly, to share the exact parameters of the robot drills which i use to gradually learn/master the soft/hard bh flip. (the same parameters can be used to practice the bh flick, of course.)

One can practice the bh flip for an hour, without breaking a sweat.
In contrast, practicing the bh flick for an hour will break a sweat.

 

[Archosaurus]

Occasionally a BH flip is used even at the highest level to attack lower spin balls, some players like Ma Long will even feint a push.

I will say though that good luck doing this on actual heavy backspin when using high-grip inverted rubber, like a short serve that will net even if you angle the bat completely open. I doubt it's gonna work unless you find an off-axis on specific serves.

 

[plunder]

here is a vid on executing the flip (not the flick!) on the fh side: the fh flip!

Bobrow calls it the pancake flip. kinda obviously, it's nearly impossible biomechanically to brush 🖌️ a low (heavy) underspin ball with a fh flick, so by definition all fh attacks on low short balls (especially on underspin balls!) should be called fh flips, gpt agrees on that. "pancake 🥞 flip" is actually a great naming because "pancake flick" doesn't make sense.

"flick", for some TT ppl, could simply mean that the flat hit has some explosive 💣power\speed (as in 'flicking a nose with your finger'), also making that high-pitched hitting sound.

but this thread is to unconfuse the namings and teach the best way to think about that attacking stroke:

we have a bh flick (also called 'pro flick' lol) - it adds topspin to any ball,
the bh flip - with the hard variant being artful and very impressive (which prompted me to open this thread!),
and the fh flip - also called The Pancake Flip

click on Like, if you do NOT agree with this very post 📯

 

[Takkyu_wa_inochi]

Tom Lodziak is playing in ITTF masters in Korea in June. He’s got a tough draw !!

 

[NetProphet]

Tom Lodziak is playing in ITTF masters in Korea in June. He’s got a tough draw !!

Can you share where you are tracking this?
Thanks!

 

[Lula]

If i understand correct you mean a flatter hit? Ma long, Karakasevic, and especially Pistej are really good at this.
I would say it is important to:
- always start with racket angle very open, like you are doing a push. If the ball have heavy backspin - flip with that open racket angle, if the ball have more no spin or a bit top - close the racket angle and flip
- timing, need to hit the top of the bounce if you want to hit hard
- come close to the ball with the body
- if you can not flip hard it need to be deceptive with good placement. To many times we flip a worse flip than a better short or long push. Need to be able to follow up with high racket after
- best ball in my opinion is side backspin. A push on that and the ball get pretty nasty

Good Luck

 

[Takkyu_wa_inochi]

Can you share where you are tracking this?
Thanks!

wmc2026.ittf.com

 

[blahness]

There are many types of flick.

FH flick:
1) The sinking FH flick - this creates a fast sinking ball with no topspin for the opponent to borrow and even has some low amounts of backspin. This is also what the pros use the most. Basic technique is literally like pushing a door with your palm. Adjust contact points based on incoming spin. The amazing thing about this flick is that due to the pace and the lack of topspin the other player has to actually do an opening loop in a cramped position. Very useful to induce a bad quality loop or an error, and still cant be pushed back otherwise they will give you an easy opportunity ball.

2) FH topspin flick - if you pronate your forearm like a windshield wiper instead of pushing forward then this creates topspin in your flick. Problem is that this doesnt create dangerous levels of topspin unlike a loop, so it can be countered back to you quite easily. But, it can be quite a good surprise if you aim it wide. One better variation is to actually control the trajectory so that it lands short with topspin, which can be very effective if you combine it with a deep flick or push previously.

BH flick - you have the sinking flick too if you directly kinda punch the ball (very rarely used tbh and quite underrated as a receive, i only seen Truls use it from time to time), but also can be very devastating in amateur play.

Pancake flip is basically the BH version of the FH topspin flick, imo it is fine as a surprise but as a regular weapon it is quite weak because of the lack of spin quality.

But with the BH, you have a 3rd option which is the chiquita, which is the most stable and powerful option since you get tremendous spin + control which makes it very difficult for opponents to do anything aggressive on it. You can also vary the placement, trajectory, sidespin percentage, spin to speed ratio by quite a bit so it is very difficult for the opponents to manage. If you can do this it is the most OP receive, and also why almost all the pros rely heavily on it.

 

[plunder]

"flick", for some TT ppl, could simply mean that the flat hit has some explosive 💣power\speed (as in 'flicking a nose with your finger'), also making that high-pitched hitting sound.

using my naming convention, these are all fh flips, not fh flicks:

also reiterating my claim: it is easier to do attacks on short balls with your bh (than with your fh). Coton is a wonderful example of a youngster, using it all the time as his decisive weapon; he must have grown up with this technique/realization/epiphany. He does a pro flick, i.e. brush-hitting the ball, adding topspin AND hitting the ball at the same time, basically a mini version of a bh 'hard topspin' ('power loop'). All pro's know and do the pro flick. But Coton ... he does it all the time, and that's the surprising/novelty aspect! Be the master of a single annoying weapon, and you'll effectively come through a whole host of opponents.

 

[plunder]

Jeff is demonstrating nicely what i'd call a soft bh flip. It's a fun way to open up a rally. On youtube there's no tutorial or demonstration of the hard bh flip .. which is similar to the soft bh flip, just hit harder ("slapped"):