Forehand topspin against backspin

[KM1976]

Hi,

I wanted to discuss with you all the techniques which I have noticed people adopt in their forehand topspin against backspin balls. Please share your views on which technique you use and which one you feel is least stressful and best suited for the offensive game. The purpose of this discussion is to find the most optimum technique which is fluidic and is very easy to perform. I hope that all of us will get benefited with this discussion.

Technique 1: Many people do not bend their knees much. So they compensate more with their swing. To elaborate further, such players will hit a loop by taking their bat further down (the arm will almost become straight during backswing) and they will loop by quickly snapping their arm using elbow as a pivot.This technique involves applying force in the direction perpendicular to the incoming ball with finish position being high above the forehead. Such players will usually contact the ball after the peak of the bounce. Usual drawback of using such technique persistently, is getting late on the followup topspin on the blocked ball. Loss of balance etc.

Technique 2: Many players will bend on their knees and would not allow the racket to go below the knee level. Such players would use their torso, body rotation and power from hips to generate speed and power. The usual contact point is at the top of the bounce or on the rise. The direction of force application is around 60 degrees to the incoming ball, finish position being a classical salute position with a somewhat open blade angle. Force/snap is applied just before the point of contact so that maximum thrust gets transferred to the stroke. The catch in this technique is that it is difficult to master and the player should bend consistently between the shots. So that he maintains consistency. Needless to say, this technique is very demanding on your physique and is not easy to master. Blade angle plays a crucial role here as it needs to be adjusted on the accurate reading of backspin. So it is vital that the player reads the incoming backspin as accurately as possible.

Technique 3: This is most interesting of the lot. I have noticed a few highly experienced players using this technique. Such players have a good reading of the backspin. They also have a very good command on the blade angle. This technique is performed by opening your blade to almost 110 or 120 degrees and performing your stroke as you are scooping out ice-cream from a tub, the finish position of the stroke is the classic salute position. The blade will never go down below the table level as there is no need to perform a long stroke since open blade angle is taking care of the backswing here. With lots of practice, I have noticed that very good brush and loops which land in the last 1/3rd of the table can be performed consistently with this technique.

Thank you.

 

[Der_Echte]

Here are a few principles and observations...

Technique 1: Man, that is really inefficient. No wide stance, no knee bend, player is using only the arm/shoulder for speed/control. vs really heavy underspin, this would be pretty bad. Even vs a weak ball, there will not be a lot of consistency. The ball must be exactly there to do this and even then this is chancy.

The wide stance, bending down, rotating, accelerating and taking the ball in the effective strike zone give a lot of control, spin and when you open the bat and make more solid contact: more power.


Technique 2: This is only possible wen making a loopdrive vs underspin, which requires a much more forward stroke and open bat. Deciding to hit the underspin with a loopdrive is a good option vs an underspin ball that is either not very deep or bounces a little high. Not dropping bat below knees means you have more forward swing plane, which means you have to use a loopdrive stroke.

Nothing wrong with that as long as the ball is not too deep and is at least a bit high. Normally, to make a heavy slow or medium loop, you are squatting down and bat drops below knees, and swing is a lot more vertical, so to lift the ball. The point of impact is usually when ball is below net height.


Technique 3: Hmm... if blade never goes below table level, there is no backswing and very little bat speed applied, also , there is no use of large muscle groups for control. This would be solely an arm loop using shoulder and arm muscles. That generates very little bat speed or control.

 

[agold]

If there is very heavy under spin,I start low and finish high—by jumping

 

[Der_Echte]

vs heavy underspin, you can attack 3 ways effectively while still staying consistant.

Option one: (Pay Attention to this one agold !!) Option one is simply hitting through the spin without creating a lot of topspin. Why do this? The player does not have enough explosion to generate the needed bat speed to overcome the heavy underspin. Why is it effective? The player is making a quick shot as the ball is on the rise above net height as he opens bat (more for heavier spin) and swings forward. When the player places the ball well (like say at the crossover or WIDE FH), it is a very good pressure shot that sometimes win points, often puts good pressure on opponent to setup a better shot later in the rally, usually the next shot or two. If the player is too weak or young to make a powerloop or slow heavy topspin vs this heavy ball (it really takes a lot of strength and explosion to topspin heavy underspin) then this is the attacking option for you. A s a plus, because the attacking player is taking this ball earlier, he is giving opponent less reaction time and has more possible angles open, but usually, there is no substitute for a medium fast shot with next to nospin right at someone's crossover. You do not go for smash kind of power, simply a 50-70% power of normal power stroke is enough. You have to slow down the speed of the shot to ensure it lands, but you can make a pretty fast enough shot and still make it land time after time. Remember, you are playing close to table and taking it before it falls, this takes away time from opponent and allows you to hit a LESS fast shot and still pressure opponents. Automatically go for crossover or wide angle winner if it is there, if not, a medium fast light topspin or no spin right at the crossover is one difficult shot to counter. Remember that. This shot is just as effective as a fast no spin flick at an opponent's crossover as a variation.

Option two: Safe, slow, heavy topspin. You get down, way down, make HUGE backswing and trunk/shoulder rotation, drop hitting shoulder, explode upwards with a more than 90 degree open blade angle and brush the ball. You are going for maximum bat acceleration at impact and fine grazing. You are trying to land it either VERY shallow or VERY deep. The BH wing of a penholder is a good spot, same spot is also troublesome to choppers when they are close to table. Crossover is good. Whatever you do, land it deep. Avoid middle depth at all costs. Extreme shallow is also surprisingly difficult to attack if opponent is a step back from table anticipating you to hit it deep. All he can do there is lunge forward and soft tap it back.

Unless the incoming underspin is high, this is my first choice. Why? It is easy to do for me, it is very consistent, it is extremely spinny, when placed deep, it is very troublesome to opponents and I know what they will try to do to it, it sets up more powerful shots well, so it is my first choice. If the incoming ball is high, I will either make a power loop or kill it (like a power loop but even more forward swing and much less topspin)

Option three: Power Loop it. If the ball is high (even better if it is not deep), it is very easy to power loop and of course that is one good pressure or finishing shot. You get down like the heavy spin lifting loop, but you twist a little more than you crouch (but you still crouch). You are swinging a lot more forward with a more open blade angle. You are exploding through the ball. The shot is like option one, but you are exploding and applying a LOT more power to the ball. Open blade angle. Very solid contact. Very fast bat speed. Open blade more vs heavier spin. Finish a little upwards and recover. You are trying to smack the ball at almost smash speed, but with more topspin. Placement??? Right at opponent is good. BODY SHOT YEAH !!! anywhere where opponent is not is a good idea too. You are trying to finish the point or make the return so weak you will kill it on the next shot. Be careful trying to blow it by the opponent, he might get to it and it will come smoking back even if he just blocks it. That is why right at the body is a good place, especially vs choppers and good retrievers, directly at the body is the optimal place to put this shot. These players are too good bringing back blast after blast at their wings from mid distance. If opponent is locked at table, go for the wide FH or BH by him if you can.

Against lighter underspins, you have more options and can do some different shots. Of course there are other options vs heavy underspin, but they are not attacking options.

 

[agold]

vs heavy underspin, you can attack 3 ways effectively while still staying consistant.

Option one: (Pay Attention to this one agold !!) Option one is simply hitting through the spin without creating a lot of topspin. Why do this? The player does not have enough explosion to generate the needed bat speed to overcome the heavy underspin. Why is it effective? The player is making a quick shot as the ball is on the rise above net height as he opens bat (more for heavier spin) and swings forward. When the player places the ball well (like say at the crossover or WIDE FH), it is a very good pressure shot that sometimes win points, often puts good pressure on opponent to setup a better shot later in the rally, usually the next shot or two. If the player is too weak or young to make a powerloop or slow heavy topspin vs this heavy ball (it really takes a lot of strength and explosion to topspin heavy underspin) then this is the attacking option for you. A s a plus, because the attacking player is taking this ball earlier, he is giving opponent less reaction time and has more possible angles open, but usually, there is no substitute for a medium fast shot with next to nospin right at someone's crossover. You do not go for smash kind of power, simply a 50-70% power of normal power stroke is enough. You have to slow down the speed of the shot to ensure it lands, but you can make a pretty fast enough shot and still make it land time after time. Remember, you are playing close to table and taking it before it falls, this takes away time from opponent and allows you to hit a LESS fast shot and still pressure opponents. Automatically go for crossover or wide angle winner if it is there, if not, a medium fast light topspin or no spin right at the crossover is one difficult shot to counter. Remember that. This shot is just as effective as a fast no spin flick at an opponent's crossover as a variation.

Option two: Safe, slow, heavy topspin. You get down, way down, make HUGE backswing and trunk/shoulder rotation, drop hitting shoulder, explode upwards with a more than 90 degree open blade angle and brush the ball. You are going for maximum bat acceleration at impact and fine grazing. You are trying to land it either VERY shallow or VERY deep. The BH wing of a penholder is a good spot, same spot is also troublesome to choppers when they are close to table. Crossover is good. Whatever you do, land it deep. Avoid middle depth at all costs. Extreme shallow is also surprisingly difficult to attack if opponent is a step back from table anticipating you to hit it deep. All he can do there is lunge forward and soft tap it back.

Unless the incoming underspin is high, this is my first choice. Why? It is easy to do for me, it is very consistent, it is extremely spinny, when placed deep, it is very troublesome to opponents and I know what they will try to do to it, it sets up more powerful shots well, so it is my first choice. If the incoming ball is high, I will either make a power loop or kill it (like a power loop but even more forward swing and much less topspin)

Option three: Power Loop it. If the ball is high (even better if it is not deep), it is very easy to power loop and of course that is one good pressure or finishing shot. You get down like the heavy spin lifting loop, but you twist a little more than you crouch (but you still crouch). You are swinging a lot more forward with a more open blade angle. You are exploding through the ball. The shot is like option one, but you are exploding and applying a LOT more power to the ball. Open blade angle. Very solid contact. Very fast bat speed. Open blade more vs heavier spin. Finish a little upwards and recover. You are trying to smack the ball at almost smash speed, but with more topspin. Placement??? Right at opponent is good. BODY SHOT YEAH !!! anywhere where opponent is not is a good idea too. You are trying to finish the point or make the return so weak you will kill it on the next shot. Be careful trying to blow it by the opponent, he might get to it and it will come smoking back even if he just blocks it. That is why right at the body is a good place, especially vs choppers and good retrievers, directly at the body is the optimal place to put this shot. These players are too good bringing back blast after blast at their wings from mid distance. If opponent is locked at table, go for the wide FH or BH by him if you can.

Against lighter underspins, you have more options and can do some different shots. Of course there are other options vs heavy underspin, but they are not attacking options.

Thanks so much for this detailed explanation! Is option one kind of like a flick of heavy backspin? We open our bats a lot, and then follow through normally. Or am I missing something?

 

[ttmonster]

For me, Option 1 is the natural choice in case the ball is a popped up underspin. Option 2 is the go to in most cases. Option 3 I pick , either in doubles where I want to quickly finish off the rally or vs choppers once I get a hang of their underspin, but as der echte says , its risky because it might back fire if it comes back. But there is no better feeling in the world than power looping against heavy underspin , just tells me I am doing a a lot of things right when I start getting it consistently on the table.

vs heavy underspin, you can attack 3 ways effectively while still staying consistant.

Option one: (Pay Attention to this one agold !!) Option one is simply hitting through the spin without creating a lot of topspin. Why do this? The player does not have enough explosion to generate the needed bat speed to overcome the heavy underspin. Why is it effective? The player is making a quick shot as the ball is on the rise above net height as he opens bat (more for heavier spin) and swings forward. When the player places the ball well (like say at the crossover or WIDE FH), it is a very good pressure shot that sometimes win points, often puts good pressure on opponent to setup a better shot later in the rally, usually the next shot or two. If the player is too weak or young to make a powerloop or slow heavy topspin vs this heavy ball (it really takes a lot of strength and explosion to topspin heavy underspin) then this is the attacking option for you. A s a plus, because the attacking player is taking this ball earlier, he is giving opponent less reaction time and has more possible angles open, but usually, there is no substitute for a medium fast shot with next to nospin right at someone's crossover. You do not go for smash kind of power, simply a 50-70% power of normal power stroke is enough. You have to slow down the speed of the shot to ensure it lands, but you can make a pretty fast enough shot and still make it land time after time. Remember, you are playing close to table and taking it before it falls, this takes away time from opponent and allows you to hit a LESS fast shot and still pressure opponents. Automatically go for crossover or wide angle winner if it is there, if not, a medium fast light topspin or no spin right at the crossover is one difficult shot to counter. Remember that. This shot is just as effective as a fast no spin flick at an opponent's crossover as a variation.

Option two: Safe, slow, heavy topspin. You get down, way down, make HUGE backswing and trunk/shoulder rotation, drop hitting shoulder, explode upwards with a more than 90 degree open blade angle and brush the ball. You are going for maximum bat acceleration at impact and fine grazing. You are trying to land it either VERY shallow or VERY deep. The BH wing of a penholder is a good spot, same spot is also troublesome to choppers when they are close to table. Crossover is good. Whatever you do, land it deep. Avoid middle depth at all costs. Extreme shallow is also surprisingly difficult to attack if opponent is a step back from table anticipating you to hit it deep. All he can do there is lunge forward and soft tap it back.

Unless the incoming underspin is high, this is my first choice. Why? It is easy to do for me, it is very consistent, it is extremely spinny, when placed deep, it is very troublesome to opponents and I know what they will try to do to it, it sets up more powerful shots well, so it is my first choice. If the incoming ball is high, I will either make a power loop or kill it (like a power loop but even more forward swing and much less topspin)

Option three: Power Loop it. If the ball is high (even better if it is not deep), it is very easy to power loop and of course that is one good pressure or finishing shot. You get down like the heavy spin lifting loop, but you twist a little more than you crouch (but you still crouch). You are swinging a lot more forward with a more open blade angle. You are exploding through the ball. The shot is like option one, but you are exploding and applying a LOT more power to the ball. Open blade angle. Very solid contact. Very fast bat speed. Open blade more vs heavier spin. Finish a little upwards and recover. You are trying to smack the ball at almost smash speed, but with more topspin. Placement??? Right at opponent is good. BODY SHOT YEAH !!! anywhere where opponent is not is a good idea too. You are trying to finish the point or make the return so weak you will kill it on the next shot. Be careful trying to blow it by the opponent, he might get to it and it will come smoking back even if he just blocks it. That is why right at the body is a good place, especially vs choppers and good retrievers, directly at the body is the optimal place to put this shot. These players are too good bringing back blast after blast at their wings from mid distance. If opponent is locked at table, go for the wide FH or BH by him if you can.

Against lighter underspins, you have more options and can do some different shots. Of course there are other options vs heavy underspin, but they are not attacking options.

 

[Der_Echte]

agold, short answer, yes, but experiment and see what works for you. You adjust with bat angle and swing plane / follow through.

The "HIT" vs a heavy underspin (it isn't a loop, not enough topspin) (It really isn't a drive, the spin is pretty light) you take it on top of bounce, swing forward with open bat. Your follow through can be more upwards vs heavier under spin. You can figure out how you gotta hit it by serving underspin middle depth, have partner give you back a heavy push long to your FH, then you make a 50-70% power hit with open blade. In theory, if the ball is over the net, you can cream it and still land it, but you want pressure and high percentage, so lay off the power. Experiment with your blade angle and follow through, but in general, it s a very forward shot. You are not trying to overcome the spin on the ball, but only simply to adjust for it. You are trying NOT to power the ball, but simply kill the spin, add a tiny bit of your own, hitting it only as hard as you have to keep it on the table. Since you are taking it earlier than what you would when you do a slow loop, it can still pressure opponent good enough and give you options in the rally. You can anticipate opponent's weak return and cream that one, or you can look for opponent to make a quick shot with little spin to counter drive away from him or strawberry jam him. Always nice to have possibilities you are prepared for.

Again, you choose this shot because you cannot yet properly loop vs heavy underspin.

Many adult players would shake their head and not even consider this an option. To a macho male player, it is either heavy loop, medium loop, or power loop / smash. Making a half power low spin drive isn't in their thought process or TT toolbag.

The one who can be consistent after practicing this shot adds a good option to their game. Do not under-rate how effective a well placed medium speed no spin light topspin ball to the crossover can be. Even at the USATT 2200+ level, such a shot still has value. Many juniors and girl players (even some grown women players !)who are not yet strong / consistent enough to loop through or overcome the heavy spin use this shot with good effectiveness.

It is always a good thing to have more well trained ways to handle things. Heck, even a "fake" underspin return that opponent tries unsuccessfully to loop (goes off end as you snicker) is a point earned and a good option to have when you need it.

 

[ttmonster]

Agree to all that you are saying , but end of the day its a low percentage shot because it does not have topspin on it , so unless you are able to take the ball right at the top the bounce , time and place it perfectly , chances are you could get a fairly awkward return back. Thats why I prefer to smoke it that way when it pops up and gives more options in terms of when and where to hit, instead of trying it on a lower bouncing heavy underspin.

agold, short answer, yes, but experiment and see what works for you. You adjust with bat angle and swing plane / follow through.

The "HIT" vs a heavy underspin (it isn't a loop, not enough topspin) (It really isn't a drive, the spin is pretty light) you take it on top of bounce, swing forward with open bat. Your follow through can be more upwards vs heavier under spin. You can figure out how you gotta hit it by serving underspin middle depth, have partner give you back a heavy push long to your FH, then you make a 50-70% power hit with open blade. In theory, if the ball is over the net, you can cream it and still land it, but you want pressure and high percentage, so lay off the power. Experiment with your blade angle and follow through, but in general, it s a very forward shot. You are not trying to overcome the spin on the ball, but only simply to adjust for it. You are trying NOT to power the ball, but simply kill the spin, add a tiny bit of your own, hitting it only as hard as you have to keep it on the table. Since you are taking it earlier than what you would when you do a slow loop, it can still pressure opponent good enough and give you options in the rally. You can anticipate opponent's weak return and cream that one, or you can look for opponent to make a quick shot with little spin to counter drive away from him or strawberry jam him. Always nice to have possibilities you are prepared for.

Again, you choose this shot because you cannot yet properly loop vs heavy underspin.

Many adult players would shake their head and not even consider this an option. To a macho male player, it is either heavy loop, medium loop, or power loop / smash. Making a half power low spin drive isn't in their thought process or TT toolbag.

The one who can be consistent after practicing this shot adds a good option to their game. Do not under-rate how effective a well placed medium speed no spin light topspin ball to the crossover can be. Even at the USATT 2200+ level, such a shot still has value. Many juniors and girl players (even some grown women players !)who are not yet strong / consistent enough to loop through or overcome the heavy spin use this shot with good effectiveness.

It is always a good thing to have more well trained ways to handle things. Heck, even a "fake" underspin return that opponent tries unsuccessfully to loop (goes off end as you snicker) is a point earned and a good option to have when you need it.

 

[Der_Echte]

I hear you TTM, but opening the bat and taking power off the ball results in a very controllable high percentage shot once trained. At first that shot sounds awkward as heck. It doesn't seem natural that you could half hit through a ball and still land it, yet this is true. The keys are to learn the right bat angle, be in position, hit it half power or so, and place the ball at crossover. Again, one does not need to hit it very hard. The resulting shot will be a medium paced ball with little spin. When that ball is hit at or above net height while ball is on rise or peak, there is little time for opponent to react. You are giving the opponent a difficult ball under time pressure to a difficult location. If opponent wants to attack this ball, they had damned well already be moving, but you already stole a lot of their time. Opponent is often out of position to do much to this ball. If they try to attack it strongly, they often net it as there is little topspin and it is counter-intuitive to them. They think the ball ha more spin on it.

It would be a very low percentage shot if a player tries to smash, or loopkill this ball FH when they do not have enough bat speed and acceleration timing to overcome the incoming under spin. That would be a mistake. Such a player is not yet ready put those balls away, unless they are high and shallow half depth.

The player who does not yet have the bat speed or acceleration to pull off a heavy slow loop or fast loop needs an effective attacking option vs a heavy underspin. What is such a player to do? They COULD try to slow loop it, but since their body is not yet developed to be able to make such a bat speed yet, it is a fail to try this shot in a match, heck, it isn't yet time to train vs that shot, the body simply isn't ready yet. (soon down the line, but not now) Without this kind of attacking option (the half power light spin hit) vs heavy underspin, the player is handcuffed and can only cut the ball back. A smart opponent would simply keep cutting until junior player makes a mistake, goes overaggressive on attacking heavy underspin, or gives up an easier underspin ball for opponent to power loop at will.

Myself, I do not use this half hit shot, I can spin away or hit away, but when teaching a junior or woman player who cannot make really FAST bat speed, I show this shot as an option. Korean players, even old-school J-Pen attackers have this shot as an option and it can be downright difficult to face these wise ole wolves.

Instinctively, my first choice is to spin it if it is low or deep, then look for the next ball to go stronger. I make enough heavy spin that sometimes, the first topspin is enough. If the ball is shallow or high, I blast away at it right at the gut or wide angle away from player. Both my options are high percentage dependable well trained shots.

At the junior level, one needs some kind of way to do a return that is more aggressive than a fast push or underspin variation.

 

[XariuzCruz]

Hmm, there seems like more options to receive backspin balls. Often what I do is just to wait after the peak of the bounce and make a spinny topspin. The flatter one seems much more difficult to do

 

[ttmonster]

I get your points , is there any example available in youtube somewhere that will make it easier to understand the exact shot/technique you are referring too... just curious to learn ...

I hear you TTM, but opening the bat and taking power off the ball results in a very controllable high percentage shot once trained. At first that shot sounds awkward as heck. It doesn't seem natural that you could half hit through a ball and still land it, yet this is true. The keys are to learn the right bat angle, be in position, hit it half power or so, and place the ball at crossover. Again, one does not need to hit it very hard. The resulting shot will be a medium paced ball with little spin. When that ball is hit at or above net height while ball is on rise or peak, there is little time for opponent to react. You are giving the opponent a difficult ball under time pressure to a difficult location. If opponent wants to attack this ball, they had damned well already be moving, but you already stole a lot of their time. Opponent is often out of position to do much to this ball. If they try to attack it strongly, they often net it as there is little topspin and it is counter-intuitive to them. They think the ball ha more spin on it.

It would be a very low percentage shot if a player tries to smash, or loopkill this ball FH when they do not have enough bat speed and acceleration timing to overcome the incoming under spin. That would be a mistake. Such a player is not yet ready put those balls away, unless they are high and shallow half depth.

The player who does not yet have the bat speed or acceleration to pull off a heavy slow loop or fast loop needs an effective attacking option vs a heavy underspin. What is such a player to do? They COULD try to slow loop it, but since their body is not yet developed to be able to make such a bat speed yet, it is a fail to try this shot in a match, heck, it isn't yet time to train vs that shot, the body simply isn't ready yet. (soon down the line, but not now) Without this kind of attacking option (the half power light spin hit) vs heavy underspin, the player is handcuffed and can only cut the ball back. A smart opponent would simply keep cutting until junior player makes a mistake, goes overaggressive on attacking heavy underspin, or gives up an easier underspin ball for opponent to power loop at will.

Myself, I do not use this half hit shot, I can spin away or hit away, but when teaching a junior or woman player who cannot make really FAST bat speed, I show this shot as an option. Korean players, even old-school J-Pen attackers have this shot as an option and it can be downright difficult to face these wise ole wolves.

Instinctively, my first choice is to spin it if it is low or deep, then look for the next ball to go stronger. I make enough heavy spin that sometimes, the first topspin is enough. If the ball is shallow or high, I blast away at it right at the gut or wide angle away from player. Both my options are high percentage dependable well trained shots.

At the junior level, one needs some kind of way to do a return that is more aggressive than a fast push or underspin variation.

 

[Der_Echte]

Don't have a vid off the top of my head, but watch this 4 yr old girl do a medium speed hit vs weak underspin ball in push rally from 7:36 to 7:43 (from a feed from TT lady legend Hyun Jung Hwa)

She opens blade and uses body to rotate and control, doesn't yet have a ton of power, but you get the idea. Open the blade more vs heavier spin and do not go for too much power, half is enough.

This is from a Korean comedy show that often does TT stuff. many former ex-pros show up on this show from time to time and sometimes they got TT only shows team vs comedy team. Dude is a former wrestler and is about the most popular figure in Korean show biz and commercials.

The girl is also training at the 6:15 mark and you can see the medium hit vs weak underspin. She can barely see over the table.

 

[XariuzCruz]

Don't have a vid off the top of my head, but watch this 4 yr old girl do a medium speed hit vs weak underspin ball in push rally from 7:36 to 7:43 (from a feed from TT lady legend Hyun Jung Hwa)

She opens blade and uses body to rotate and control, doesn't yet have a ton of power, but you get the idea. Open the blade more vs heavier spin and do not go for too much power, half is enough.

This is from a Korean comedy show that often does TT stuff. many former ex-pros show up on this show from time to time and sometimes they got TT only shows team vs comedy team. Dude is a former wrestler and is about the most popular figure in Korean show biz and commercials.

The girl is also training at the 6:15 mark and you can see the medium hit vs weak underspin. She can barely see over the table.

Dream team?

 

[KM1976]

Thank you very much to all, who have posted on this discussion. I wanted to ask you now, how do you proceed against backspin returns which keep really low, are fast, land very deep and skid on you?
Also, what would be difference in technique, if the same return bounces slightly higher, holds up on you and seems to be right candidate for smash. But smashing such returns most of the times lands the ball in the net.

 

[Der_Echte]

If the underspin is fast deep and low... AND you still want to attack it, you can still loop it slow or fast (or medium) but you gotta get into action quickly. Legs and waist are really important.

If the ball is higher, you can safely get away with a more forward faster shot.

 

[Der_Echte]

Coach McAfee and coach Larry Hodges talk about how to smash a heavy high underspin and the shot I describe is similar to it, but the player cannot smash since he doesn't yet have enough power to do so. The link from coach Hodges has pics and an animated gif. Look at the bat angle at impact... it is open past 90 degrees. This is not natural at first. The half power medium speed hit goes just like this, but there is less power and less resultant pace on the shot.

http://www.newgy.com/ttcommunity/Archive/Sep2000article.html

http://www.newgy.com/TTCommunity/Archive/lesson75.html#SMASH

 

[Rajah*]

If there is very heavy under spin,I start low and finish high—by jumping

Frog leap- zjk!

Sent from my HTC One X+

 

[TT4Life]

Cool informations

 

[agold]

I am now using method one on my BH. I added a little wrist for more spin and speed.

 

[Der_Echte]

What is cool about making the attack, even if it is a faster no-spin or weak topspin fast attack is twofold for BH...

1) The BH has little backswing, so opponent will not easily know the direction you will hit unless you show tendencies.

2) The shot is taken early (usually) and this really robs time from opponent.

The combination of not knowing where the ball is going and the reduction in reaction time mean that the opponent had damned well figure it out pretty quickly. Often, this is overwhelming pressure, even on a medium paced no spin ball struck towards the crossover. On top of that, even if opponent realizes what is up, he has to move into a position to make a positive shot. That can be tough under pressure with little time to make a quality offensive shot. You will get a lot of errors from the over-eager attacking Brigade on that shot. Such a shot is safe (once you learn to correctly read the spin and adjust blade angle) and relatively low risk.

Later on, when the player gets better power, explosion and ball reading skills, he can go for the more aggressive options in matches, like the slow loop, medium loop, fast loop, and smash. It is good to practice these all once player gets strong enough and later start breaking them out in a match once consistent enough in practice.

Like anything else, it take s a LONG time to make consistent and successful in a real match that counts all the things you are beginning to do well in practice. Don't be disappointed when you fail using new things in a match that go well in practice, one never gets 100% success on those things in matches, it takes a really long time to make it good in a match consistent.