Saudi Smash 2024

[Tony's Table Tennis]

Felix Lebrun deserves the title for a year now. But Harimoto has been the best player outside the Chinese for the last 5 years even while he has disappointed quite a few times. That's juat backed up by statistics.

since TB compares harimoto failures against top chinese players
I like to see who else has a better win number against CNT in the past 5 years.

Felix Lebrun?
2023 win against Lin Shidong??
2022 against Lin Shidong, Chen Yuanyu, Zhao Zihao

Base on Felix poorer win record, is TB going to replace HT with FL and go non stop for the next year??

Harimoto at least in this time:
2023 against FZD, Liang Yanning x 2, Lin Shidong, Xiang Peng
2022 against FZD, WCQ, Lin Gaoyuan, Lin Shidong,
can't forget the 2020 win against red hot Ma Long

Probably one of the most consistent winners against CNT between 2022 to date and he is considered a failure.... WOW

Felix may be the future, but it doesn't remove the stats of Harimoto more than this alleged "single performance" in the past 2 years.

Felix would probably have more wins as CNT becomes more frail in the coming years. Well, that is life in terms of timing, but Harimoto, despite not very likeable (ie, I don't like him), was probably the number 1 threat in CNT in 2022 to 2023 due to his wining stats against them, a period written off by the ultra high level, equipment expert and harimoto hater tensor backhand. See how blinded one can get when the mind is set.

 

[TensorBackhand]

Felix Lebrun deserves the title for a year now. But Harimoto has been the best player outside the Chinese for the last 5 years even while he has disappointed quite a few times. That's juat backed up by statistics.

I agree with that. So his official title is now "former best non-Chinese"

 

[NextLevel]

I agree with that. So his official title is now "former best non-Chinese"

You are the office so you can label as you please. The point was that who has a better record than Harimoto, especially vs the Chinese, during the period you used to argue that Harimoto was a failure. As turbozed and Tony TT pointed out, while it is a good sign that Felix is more stable in his results than Harimoto, he still lacks any big wins over top CNT players. So his problem is very different from Harimoto even if in a better and more promising way. And he still has to do it at tradirional major events like World Cup, Olympics and WTTC. Though even there he does have a WTTTC silver even if he couldn't beat Wang Chuqin. So Felix is clearly doing much better than Harimoto at the current time and seems to be the brighter prospect.

 

[Oliverpool]

Checked and I had both 2 recorded.
1st one, my opponent even said "all my family say sorry to you" after his 5 or 6th lucks, we both laugh but I laughed bitterly. But that set, I ... won 13-11 and won the match
2nd one, I got 10-7 final set then lose 11-13.
That was really bitter man, that why I feel sorry for Fan today

While I always apologies to my opponent when I get a lucky ball and I do get frustrated some times, I do not get why some people are angry and throw tantrum or become a poor loser when a opponent wins after one or a few lucky ball. At the end of the day, it is in the rules that a "lucky" ball via the net or edge of the table still counts. It work boths ways. If you always aim right at the edge, you will probably get more lucky ball as well as shots that go out of the table and you immediately lose a point. So it evens out in the end.

Yes it can be frustrating/angry especially if it is the last and winning point for your opponent. But it is in the rules and does not diminish the fact that you lost not because of this one or even 3 or 5 lucky balls over the 3/5/7 matches or your opponent won the match because he or she was lucky. So why belittle it?

 

[Oliverpool]

since TB compares harimoto failures against top chinese players
I like to see who else has a better win number against CNT in the past 5 years.

Felix Lebrun?
2023 win against Lin Shidong??
2022 against Lin Shidong, Chen Yuanyu, Zhao Zihao

Base on Felix poorer win record, is TB going to replace HT with FL and go non stop for the next year??

Harimoto at least in this time:
2023 against FZD, Liang Yanning x 2, Lin Shidong, Xiang Peng
2022 against FZD, WCQ, Lin Gaoyuan, Lin Shidong,
can't forget the 2020 win against red hot Ma Long

Probably one of the most consistent winners against CNT between 2022 to date and he is considered a failure.... WOW

Felix may be the future, but it doesn't remove the stats of Harimoto more than this alleged "single performance" in the past 2 years.

Felix would probably have more wins as CNT becomes more frail in the coming years. Well, that is life in terms of timing, but Harimoto, despite not very likeable (ie, I don't like him), was probably the number 1 threat in CNT in 2022 to 2023 due to his wining stats against them, a period written off by the ultra high level, equipment expert and harimoto hater tensor backhand. See how blinded one can get when the mind is set.

While I am rooting for Felix Lebrun. He does not have a good record against the top tier CNT players at this time. When he meets them, they are usually able to get into his head and he implodes or lose in not close games. When I say top tier, I do not include LSD in the list at this time. The good thing is that he is quite consistent against none CNT top tier players which explains his current highest ranked non CNT player.

I do believe that if he can control is temper/temperament slightly better, he would improve that little bit more. But I guess it could backfire and make him lose that drive as well. I do notice in a number of games that he is noticeably nervous and his hands are shaking when he is serving. Some other players do that as well at certain points of the game. But I noticed it more in him. Maybe coz I watch alot of his game. But hey, I do watch alot of WCT and DQ games as well and I never noticed so many occurrence.

 

[Choosikick]

While I am rooting for Felix Lebrun. He does not have a good record against the top tier CNT players at this time. When he meets them, they are usually able to get into his head and he implodes or lose in not close games. When I say top tier, I do not include LSD in the list at this time. The good thing is that he is quite consistent against none CNT top tier players which explains his current highest ranked non CNT player.

I do believe that if he can control is temper/temperament slightly better, he would improve that little bit more. But I guess it could backfire and make him lose that drive as well. I do notice in a number of games that he is noticeably nervous and his hands are shaking when he is serving. Some other players do that as well at certain points of the game. But I noticed it more in him. Maybe coz I watch alot of his game. But hey, I do watch alot of WCT and DQ games as well and I never noticed so many occurrence.

At 17 years old it is still very difficult to control your emotions with your mind.

 

[quanghuysk]

While I always apologies to my opponent when I get a lucky ball and I do get frustrated some times, I do not get why some people are angry and throw tantrum or become a poor loser when a opponent wins after one or a few lucky ball. At the end of the day, it is in the rules that a "lucky" ball via the net or edge of the table still counts. It work boths ways. If you always aim right at the edge, you will probably get more lucky ball as well as shots that go out of the table and you immediately lose a point. So it evens out in the end.

Yes it can be frustrating/angry especially if it is the last and winning point for your opponent. But it is in the rules and does not diminish the fact that you lost not because of this one or even 3 or 5 lucky balls over the 3/5/7 matches or your opponent won the match because he or she was lucky. So why belittle it?

No, I didn't belittle it, not sure why you understand that way. I think my point was clear, because I was in the similar situation, I feel sorry for FZD and understand his feeling and mentalness. But a win is a win.
I've played 100+ matches this season in 3 different leagues, sometimes I got more lucks than my opponents, sometimes not. I obviuously understand that luck is a part of the game, we have to accept and cope with it

 

[IB66]

Felix Lebrun is the 'more consistent player' at the moment, this is backed up by his world ranking.

T Harimoto & F Lebrun have played each other twice now (according to the commentator) both have been quite surprising results, in that they were both 3-0 wins and pretty one sided. Both players have a win and a loss in the head to head matches. I watched both of these encounters and was expecting FL to beat TH in their 1st match, but FL seemed to have an 'off day' and TH an 'on day'. Yesterdays match was the reverse, FL looked powerful, fast and controlled, TH just wasn't in it, confused and definitely out of sorts.

I'm looking forward to them meeting when they are both playing at the top of their form!!!

 

[zeio]

The second link is completely off topic, just like this entire post.

It's interesting you chose to ignore the first link. If Mittelham had this to say, it begs the question...

Regardless, the issue surrounding the lineup is more than just that and Franziska never stood a chance from start to end.
https://forum.tt-news.de/showpost.php?p=3608589&postcount=141
https://forum.tt-news.de/showpost.php?p=3608672&postcount=156

 

[Tony's Table Tennis]

While I am rooting for Felix Lebrun. He does not have a good record against the top tier CNT players at this time. When he meets them, they are usually able to get into his head and he implodes or lose in not close games. When I say top tier, I do not include LSD in the list at this time. The good thing is that he is quite consistent against none CNT top tier players which explains his current highest ranked non CNT player.

I do believe that if he can control is temper/temperament slightly better, he would improve that little bit more. But I guess it could backfire and make him lose that drive as well. I do notice in a number of games that he is noticeably nervous and his hands are shaking when he is serving. Some other players do that as well at certain points of the game. But I noticed it more in him. Maybe coz I watch alot of his game. But hey, I do watch alot of WCT and DQ games as well and I never noticed so many occurrence.

on paper, Felix has better advantage, especially he isn't Asian (no China for continental points)
he has the seeds to avoid wr1 and wr2 now in many tournaments, so he better cherish his points that are expiring as the months go by. He needs to replace his expiring points with same or higher.... and that is the tough part.

Felix does have a mental issue too, not as bad as his brother, but he does have issues and would need help, otherwise, he would just become LGY number 2.

I do route for more players beating CNT, especially CNT is so frail now.
Who would thought that FZD might be gone earlier than Ma Long, depsite the age gap.
we would thought that Ma Long will depart in 2024 and FZD will be solid WR no1 and undefeatable, with WCQ the new champion and Lin Shidong the next in line.
Well, that is why Qin retired, as my Beijing source told me, Qin is protecting his own life when he retired from the men's head coach position.

 

[quanghuysk]

on paper, Felix has better advantage, especially he isn't Asian (no China for continental points)
he has the seeds to avoid wr1 and wr2 now in many tournaments, so he better cherish his points that are expiring as the months go by. He needs to replace his expiring points with same or higher.... and that is the tough part.

Felix does have a mental issue too, not as bad as his brother, but he does have issues and would need help, otherwise, he would just become LGY number 2.

I do route for more players beating CNT, especially CNT is so frail now.
Who would thought that FZD might be gone earlier than Ma Long, depsite the age gap.
we would thought that Ma Long will depart in 2024 and FZD will be solid WR no1 and undefeatable, with WCQ the new champion and Lin Shidong the next in line.
Well, that is why Qin retired, as my Beijing source told me, Qin is protecting his own life when he retired from the men's head coach position.

Agree, Felix does have mental issue, if he could improve it, there might be some upset against CNT players soon.
Btw, Felix, Tomo and Lin Yun Ju are my favorite youngsters, but I didn't expect Flex could bully Tomo and Lin that much on their recent matches up. Looks like Tomo and Lin haven't had answers yet for Felix's super fast tempo.

 

[pongfugrasshopper]

I am all for the keep play continuous, but multiple times during the Lebruns vs. Togami/Shinozuka the Lebruns were not waiting for the Japanese to finish or just finished their signals. I believe it was 1-0,6-6 that the umpire had to stop the French players because it was getting too brazen and an argument ensued with the French coach. It's common courtesy especially in doubles to check that the other pair are finished with their signals. I did not see any excessive delay from the Japanese. There's got to be a happy medium between continuous play and time for giving signals.

 

[Tony's Table Tennis]

Agree, Felix does have mental issue, if he could improve it, there might be some upset against CNT players soon.
Btw, Felix, Tomo and Lin Yun Ju are my favorite youngsters, but I didn't expect Flex could bully Tomo and Lin that much on their recent matches up. Looks like Tomo and Lin haven't had answers yet for Felix's super fast tempo.

Lin has been injured all year, sadly
I said that he will be so injured by Paris, because its big tournaments every 2 to 3 weeks....
being super ill and not able to rest for Saudi Smash is also very crazy....

so the solution is rock up and loose, its better than getting penalties

 

[Robin0910]

OMFG, Kallberg missed 2 serves in a row at such a crucial moment

 

[d3nium]

My guy Cho D takes the second set against Lin Shidong.

I'm becoming a Cho fanboy after seeing his exploits at the Manchester WTT Feeder

 

[pongfugrasshopper]

Anyone know the name of Manika Batra's coach?

I heard the commentators mention coach Kirill, but he might be her training partner. Her personal coach she mentions in this article is Aman Balgu:

https://www.sportskeeda.com/table-tennis/news-this-biggest-achievement-singles-career-manika-batra-win-world-no-2-wang-manyu

 

[NextLevel]

on paper, Felix has better advantage, especially he isn't Asian (no China for continental points)
he has the seeds to avoid wr1 and wr2 now in many tournaments, so he better cherish his points that are expiring as the months go by. He needs to replace his expiring points with same or higher.... and that is the tough part.

Felix does have a mental issue too, not as bad as his brother, but he does have issues and would need help, otherwise, he would just become LGY number 2.

I do route for more players beating CNT, especially CNT is so frail now.
Who would thought that FZD might be gone earlier than Ma Long, depsite the age gap.
we would thought that Ma Long will depart in 2024 and FZD will be solid WR no1 and undefeatable, with WCQ the new champion and Lin Shidong the next in line.
Well, that is why Qin retired, as my Beijing source told me, Qin is protecting his own life when he retired from the men's head coach position.

I get the fact that Felix isn't Asian helps with continental points but in terms of recent consistency in getting to Chinese opposition or losing only to quality opponents, Felix is also better. While he has gotten better this year, Harimoto has R64 losses in the last 12 months. Felix's lowest loss is usually R16 and he is just more consistent - he might even do reasonably well if he was in Asia, just won't have the bonus points - if we remove bonus points for continental (500), Felix would drop from 5 to 7, behind LGY and LYJ, but still ahead of Calderano, Harimoto and others.

 

[NextLevel]

I heard the commentators mention coach Kirill, but he might be her training partner. Her personal coach she mentions in this article is Aman Balgu:

https://www.sportskeeda.com/table-tennis/news-this-biggest-achievement-singles-career-manika-batra-win-world-no-2-wang-manyu

Yeah but there is clearly something going on there, whether as training partner, he is currently her coach. It would be interesting to know more about him.

 

[Tony's Table Tennis]

I get the fact that Felix isn't Asian helps with continental points but in terms of recent consistency in getting to Chinese opposition or losing only to quality opponents, Felix is also better. While he has gotten better this year, Harimoto has R64 losses in the last 12 months. Felix's lowest loss is usually R16 and he is just more consistent - he might even do reasonably well if he was in Asia, just won't have the bonus points - if we remove bonus points for continental (500), Felix would drop from 5 to 7, behind LGY and LYJ, but still ahead of Calderano, Harimoto and others.

that drop is actually huge
it means he either meets seeds earlier (top 4) or not.

 

[NextLevel]

that drop is actually huge
it means he either meets seeds earlier (top 4) or not.

Since the top 5 seeds are Chinese and the 6th would be from Taiwan, he would still be seeded top 4 at the Olympics for example and likely get to play a top seed in QF at the WTTC (in either spot 5 or spot 7) so no difference there. I suspect that removing 500 points is not entirely fair to him, it is probably more realistic to replace it with 90 for QF or 175 for a semi-final spot, but I will leave that aside for now.

So no, the drop is not large, it is clear the boy is playing special and it is not driven by continental points.