1.Bundesliga Women Germany 2024/2025

[Tony's Table Tennis]

Terrible final match of the season. Kolbermoor only showed up with three players and Berlin despite having the biggest roster used two back-ups that don't even have 1400 TTR (one for doubles and for singles) and are not even close to the pros' level so Kolbermoor still managed to win.

I dug up some info from the German women's Bundesliga site. Kolbermoor's other players were not available because of WTT and a family matter. Berlin's manager on the other hand had some harsh words to say about the match: "Abysmal performance from our team today. Sabina played terrible and Kathrin couldn't use her big lead. It has been like that the entire season. I'm just disappointed. [...] We will present us differently in four weeks and Kolbermoor will regret having us beaten today. [...] It's not surprising, it was obvious she could play perform like that". This was in reference to Griesel's matches. Neumann was also not available because of a WTT youth event, but the manager had nothing to say about that and their weak line-up.


Final scores:


Berlin vs Kolbermoor 3-6

Surjan/Griesel vs 3-0 WO
Mühlbach/Komarova vs Kaufmann/Lang 1:3
Surjan vs Lang 1:3
Griesel vs Kaufmann 2:3
Mühlbach vs 3-0 WO
Krüger vs Tiefenbrunner 0:3
Surjan vs Kaufmann 1:3
Griesel vs Lang 3:0
Mühlbach vs Tiefenbrunner 1:3
Krüger vs


Play-off start in about three weeks.

EDIT: Added some further information.

with 14 players on there 1st team roster, and having needing to use 2 players from the 2nd team previously, they now using 2 from the 3rd team.
I guess 18 players is just not enough

 

[backspacer]

with 14 players on there 1st team roster, and having needing to use 2 players from the 2nd team previously, they now using 2 from the 3rd team.
I guess 18 players is just not enough

The other clubs weren't already happy that they are not using their best players and now this. Absolutely ridiculous.

 

[backspacer]

The play-offs start tomorrow with four teams competing for the remaining two semi-finals spots as Dachau and Weinheim already qualified by finishing in the top two this season. Berlin is facing Kolbermoor and Weil is up against Langstadt. The rematches happen on Sunday and there will be a golden match right afterwards if the score is 1:1. All matches should be streamed.

Schedule for tomorrow's matches and links for livestreams (I will most likely be at practice and won't be able to share line-ups):

Berlin vs Kolbermoor 6PM German time, table 1, table 2
Weil vs Langstadt 7PM German time, livestream

 

[backspacer]

The first match is live. Livestream links are in the post above. Since Mittelham and Shan didn't fulfill the mandatory quota of matches in the season they are not allowed to play the play-offs.

Berlin vs Kolbermoor 5-5

Kaneyoshi/Griesel vs Ghosh/Lang 3-0
Surjan/Neumann vs Kaufmann/Arapovic 3-1
Kaneyoshi vs Arapaovic 3-1
Surjan vs Kaufmann 2-3
Griesel vs Gotsch 3-1
Neumann vs Ghosh 0-3
Kaneyoshi vs Kaufmann 3-1
Surjan vs Arapovic 1-3
Griesel vs Ghosh 0-3
Neumann vs Gotsch 2-3

 

[backspacer]

The second match is about to start in half an hour. Stream is already live if you wanna watch the warm-up.

Weil vs Langstadt 5-5

Ortega/Riliskyte vs Paranang/Klee 0-3
Hursey/Sozoniuk vs Mantz/Lupulesku 2-3
Hursey vs Mantz 3-2
Sozoniuk vs Paranang 0-3
Ortega vs Klee 3-0
Lachenmayer vs Lupulesku 0-3
Hursey vs Paranang 1-3
Sozoniuk vs Mantz 3-2
Ortega vs Lupulesku 3-1
Lachenmayer vs Klee 3-2

 

[pongfugrasshopper]

I didn't know Yuka Kaneyoshi was in Europe. I do remember her beating Sakura Yokoi at one of the domestic tournaments. Very nice to see her get the opportunity in Europe, and looks like she's doing great with a win over Annett Kaufmann!

 

[backspacer]

Today's matches have both concluded and couldn't have been more nerve wrecking. Berlin was up 5-2 against Kolbermoor, but the latter pulled off the comeback to achieve the tie. Neumann was leading multiple times against the chopper Gotsch, but frustration comes to her quickly being only 15 and it affected her visibly losing the match in the decider. The same basically happened in the other match. Langstadt was up 5-2 against Weil, but they won the remaining matches resulting in another tie. Klee started out well against Lachenmayer, another chopper, winning the first game, but she seems to be cursed almost always losing to choppers. This match also went into the decider and Klee lost it 9-11. She actually forced the decider after receiving some silly yellow card in the fourth game, but Lachenmayer always got her by attacking the push after being driven away from the table. Final scores added above.

The rematches take place this Sunday at 2PM German time. Whoever wins their match is in the semi-final. Another tie would lead to a golden match.

 

[JackJohnson]

I think it’s ridiculous that if you do not play enough matches in the season you can’t play the playoffs. A player may have been busy attending WTT events or suffered an injury.

 

[NextLevel]

I think it’s ridiculous that if you do not play enough matches in the season you can’t play the playoffs. A player may have been busy attending WTT events or suffered an injury.

Maybe it is a mechanism for preventing a team from keeping mercenaries on the roster during the regular season without using or paying them and then unleashing them during the playoffs.

 

[Tony's Table Tennis]

I think it’s ridiculous that if you do not play enough matches in the season you can’t play the playoffs. A player may have been busy attending WTT events or suffered an injury.

this is fair,
else, you would just have an all star line up showing up for playoffs
and don't care about league matches.
while the hard workers to get team to playoffs, don't feature

 

[JackJohnson]

this is fair,
else, you would just have an all star line up showing up for playoffs
and don't care about league matches.
while the hard workers to get team to playoffs, don't feature

I can understand that as well.

How many matches do you have to play to be able to play in the playoffs. Imagine a player plays 3/4 of matches of the season then gets injured and the replacement player plays 1/4 of matches of the season and is barred from playing the playoffs since they did not play enough games therefore unable to utilise the replacement player for the playoffs.

 

[backspacer]

I can understand that as well.

How many matches do you have to play to be able to play in the playoffs. Imagine a player plays 3/4 of matches of the season then gets injured and the replacement player plays 1/4 of matches of the season and is barred from playing the playoffs since they did not play enough games therefore unable to utilise the replacement player for the playoffs.

Three matches per season are mandatory to be eligible for the play-offs. Berlin deliberately let Nina and Nana not play to focus on the Champions League while the younger players could get experience in the Bundesliga, but the clubs weren't happy that THE German top club didn't play with their strongest line-up. Nana also played in the Spanish league in February which is not allowed by the German federation and disqualified her that way for the play-offs.

 

[Tony's Table Tennis]

I can understand that as well.

How many matches do you have to play to be able to play in the playoffs. Imagine a player plays 3/4 of matches of the season then gets injured and the replacement player plays 1/4 of matches of the season and is barred from playing the playoffs since they did not play enough games therefore unable to utilise the replacement player for the playoffs.

as backspacer said, it is only 3 matches.
there is a total of 12 league matches, which is only a 25% ratio.
I know many other league have way higher ratio and does create some headache for me with international scheduling too. The 25% is a gift to be honest.

injury is just bad luck.
but in this case, it is bad planning.
you need to find places to get your 3, and then you can do what ever you want.

some matches, they had to bring in reserves from 5 or 10 divisions lower just to fill the spot
the reserve was how old @backspacer? 11 years old or?

the problem with the Germany 1BL womens is that, there is only 7 teams, and 6 make the playoffs.
top 2 in the semi
3~6 in the quarters.

if they were firm and just make it top 4 make semis, I am sure teams like Berlin won't be crazy and fielding younger players as their main priority.

Berlin was 6th place with 3 wins, 1 draw and 8 losses.
They made use of 11 players (to fill 4 spots), Yuka just made the 3rd match to qualify for playoffs - imagine if she didn't.
Nina, Shan, only played once. Shan's one was on 25 Jan, just before she went to play in Spain - so it isn't like she was busy to play in Germany...

Here is the team roster.

 

[backspacer]

some matches, they had to bring in reserves from 5 or 10 divisions lower just to fill the spot
the reserve was how old @backspacer? 11 years old or?

Yeah, she is 11 (Anastasia) and the youngest player to ever play in the women's 1. Bundesliga. Of course they sold it like it's an achievement when it was just the result of mismanagement. Talea, the girl who got to play singles, is 13. I was live in Weinheim once when Böblingen had to play with two back-up players that didn't even have 1300 TTR. There was no clapping, just everyone waiting for those matches to be over. Those girls in Berlin at least had the crowd supporting them.

 

[backspacer]

Sorry, I was at a tournament the whole day and couldn't tune in. Pretty clear results today after Friday's tied matches. Anyone watched them?


Langstadt vs Weil 3-6

Mantz/Lupulesku vs Hursey/Sozoniuk 3-1
Paranang/Klee vs Ortega/Lachenmayer 1-3
Paranang vs Sozoniuk 3-0
Mantz vs Hursey 2-3
Lupulesku vs Riliskyte 3-0
Klee vs Lachenmayer 1-3
Paranang vs Hursey 1-3
Mantz vs Sozoniuk 2-3
Lupulesku vs Lachenmayer 1-3
Klee vs Riliskyte 0-0


Kolbermoor vs Berlin 2-6

Ghosh/Lang vs Surjan/Neumann 1-3
Kaufmann/Arapovic vs Kaneyoshi/Griesel 2-3
Kaufmann vs Surjan 3-0
Arapovic vs Kaneyoshi 2-3
Ghosh vs Neumann 3-0
Gotsch vs Griesel 2-3
Kaufmann vs Kaneyoshi 1-3
Arapovic vs Surjan 2-3
Ghosh vs Griesel 2-1
Gotsch vs Neumann


This means that Weinheim will face Weil and Dachau has to play against last year's champion Berlin.

Dates for the semi-finals:
May 30
June 1

 

[pongfugrasshopper]

Sorry, I was at a tournament the whole day and couldn't tune in. Pretty clear results today after Friday's tied matches. Anyone watched them?


Langstadt vs Weil 3-6

Mantz/Lupulesku vs Hursey/Sozoniuk 3-1
Paranang/Klee vs Ortega/Lachenmayer 1-3
Paranang vs Sozoniuk 3-0
Mantz vs Hursey 2-3
Lupulesku vs Riliskyte 3-0
Klee vs Lachenmayer 1-3
Paranang vs Hursey 1-3
Mantz vs Sozoniuk 2-3
Lupulesku vs Lachenmayer 1-3
Klee vs Riliskyte 0-0


Kolbermoor vs Berlin 2-6

Ghosh/Lang vs Surjan/Neumann 1-3
Kaufmann/Arapovic vs Kaneyoshi/Griesel 2-3
Kaufmann vs Surjan 3-0
Arapovic vs Kaneyoshi 2-3
Ghosh vs Neumann 3-0
Gotsch vs Griesel 2-3
Kaufmann vs Kaneyoshi 1-3
Arapovic vs Surjan 2-3
Ghosh vs Griesel 2-1
Gotsch vs Neumann


This means that Weinheim will face Weil and Dachau has to play against last year's champion Berlin.

Dates for the semi-finals:
May 30
June 1

Thanks. I watched some Kolbermoor vs Berlin Eastside matches. Mia and Yuka make a really strong doubles pair. Their roles are very clearly defined with Yuka setting up Mia. And a number of times their opponents are having trouble reading how much spin is coming from Yuka giving the pair direct points. I watched Mia vs. chopper Gotsch. Wasn't easy, but clearly having Yuka as a practice partner helped her there. And of course Annett seems to have tons of trouble with chopper Yuka Kaneyoshi who has already established herself as one of the best in the league. Kaufmann needs help though. Hana Arapovic has talent, but she failed to step up her game against Surjan.

 

[Airoc]

Mia and Yuka make a really strong doubles pair. Their roles are very clearly defined

I thought so, too.
Often it seems doubles are put together rather casually, because you have to play, but then they don´t really know how. Kolbermoor might want to think about this, going out 0-4 in both matches.

Also, it is difficult to watch Gotsch, the best player in the league for many years, being dominated by Griesel, with all due respect to Mia´s performance. From hardly losing a single match as number 1 or 2 for Böblingen to an average performance as number 3 - it seems she hasn´t full recovered from some health problems she had earlier this season and I hope she can do so and not end her career with a season like this.

"Next big hope" Neumann has a few more things to learn, but that just seems normal at 15.

 

[Tony's Table Tennis]

I thought so, too.
Often it seems doubles are put together rather casually, because you have to play, but then they don´t really know how. Kolbermoor might want to think about this, going out 0-4 in both matches.

Also, it is difficult to watch Gotsch, the best player in the league for many years, being dominated by Griesel, with all due respect to Mia´s performance. From hardly losing a single match as number 1 or 2 for Böblingen to an average performance as number 3 - it seems she hasn´t full recovered from some health problems she had earlier this season and I hope she can do so and not end her career with a season like this.

"Next big hope" Neumann has a few more things to learn, but that just seems normal at 15.

Hopefully Asian reinforcement can help a bit

 

[backspacer]

The first matches of the semi-finals take place this evening.

Weil vs Weinheim 6PM German time livestream

Berlin vs Dachau 6.30PM German time table 1, table 2

Unfortunately I will have a match and a long trip back home and won't be able to post line-ups and scores like I usually do.

 

[backspacer]

Weil for some reason didn't stream again. Not sure why and disappointing to see. Final scores are:


Weil vs Weinheim 2-6

Ortega/Riliskyte vs Harac/Jeger 2-3
Hursey/Sozoniuk vs Chien/Wan 1-3
Hursey vs Wan 3-2
Sozoniuk vs Chien 1-3
Ortega vs Jeger 3-0
Lachenmayer vs Harac 0-3
Hursey vs Chien 2-3
Sozoniuk vs Wan 2-3
Ortega vs Harac
Lachenmayer vs Jeger


Berlin vs Dachau 6-4

Kaneyoshi/Griesel vs Byun/Itagaki 2-3
Surjan/Neumann vs Winter/Pranjkovic 3-1
Kaneyoshi vs Winter 0-3
Surjan vs Byun 0-3
Griesel vs Pranjkovic 3-0
Neumann vs Ho 3-2
Kaneyoshi vs Byun 3-2
Surjan vs Winter 0-3
Griesel vs Ho 3-1
Neumann vs Pranjkovic 3-1


While it seems Weinheim won comfortably four matches went the full distance and in their favour so the match could have gone either way. Chien still hasn't lost a match in this season.
Berlin won a very close match. I was able to see the end when Pranjkovic at 1-2 and 9-9 dumped a backhand loop against backspin into the net and overshot a backhand counter at match point against her. The lower pair pulled through for Berlin.

The re-matches both start tomorrow at 2PM German time. Berlin will be in Dachau, hopefully with their portable streaming equipment because Dachau doesn't stream. Weil will visit Weinheim and I will be watching in person. Streaming links to follow. If Dachau and Weil win the matches tomorrow a golden match will decide the finalists right afterwards.