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Ma Lin has never won a world championship. Waldner won two. WLQ has three (2001, 2005, 2007) and in his prime beat Ma Lin several times when it mattered most. Waldner also won an Olympics and World Cup. Wang Hao was ranked #1 in the world for 27 straight months recently. Sorry, Ma Lin cannot even be in the discussion. Yeah, he beat Waldner a few times, but their ages are very different. Ma Lin choked away big matches many times, and never really did anything significant till the 2008 Olympics.
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RSM never won a world championship or a world cup. Cannot be mentioned in the same sentence as Waldner or WLQ. Not the greatest penholder, both Ma Lin and Wang Hao accomplished more. What you are arguing is as best as I can tell that he is the greatest player of all time who basically has no real backhand.
By the way you may be interested to know that Eric Owens played RSM once at the US Open just before RSM made it big on the world stage (I am thinking this was around 2004). He lost in straight games but they were all reasonable games, in the realm of 11-7 and 11-8. Eric (who was around 2600 at that time) told me that RSM was the quickest player he had ever played.
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I have 3 names: Waldner, WLQ, and Guo Yuehua.
Since Waldner got so many votes already, and I am a penholder, I've voted for "others".
Guo was in 4 World singles finals, winning 2 of them. Although Guo and Waldner played in different eras, Guo had a perfect winning record playing Waldner. When Waldner was asked which player he respected the most, he gave one name: Guo Yuehua.
I can't say which of the 3 is the best. I would put Waldner and Guo together, slightly above WLQ.
Since Waldner got so many votes already, and I am a penholder, I've voted for "others".
Guo was in 4 World singles finals, winning 2 of them. Although Guo and Waldner played in different eras, Guo had a perfect winning record playing Waldner. When Waldner was asked which player he respected the most, he gave one name: Guo Yuehua.
I can't say which of the 3 is the best. I would put Waldner and Guo together, slightly above WLQ.
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( some people call him the prince of table tennis )There's something about how waldner plays. hahahaha. he makes it looks so easy, and it's like he's just playing around with the guys he's playing with. It's just sad that his age finally caught up with him. hahahaha. but he's still the mozart of table tennis :>
I am going to have to agree with some of the people in this thread, and say Wang Liqin is the greatest player ever. His level of dominance from 1998 or so to 2007 was unbelievable. There was a period of 3 years where he and Ma Lin reached the finals of every tournament they went to, with Wang Liqin winning the majority. He had 2 incredibly long periods at number 1, and has won three world championships.
Waldner is good, but I think during the period he was good, the competition level just isn't what it is now. The level of play, level of skill, level of spin has progressed so much, that frankly, its impossible to do the kind of stuff he did when he was younger, because the level of spin in todays professional game just allows so little room for error that you can't execute the kind of stuff he use to do. I think a big reason why people love Waldner is because he is the greatest white player. I mean just look at this thread, there are people voting for Boll as the greatest ever, and yet he hasn't won any world championships or olympics yet. All he has done is win the world cup, which occurs every year. He shouldn't even be in the conversation right now. And yet, because he is currently the best white player right now, he is super popular
Plus the argument that he has lasted throughout the ages, I don't really think should apply, because frankly, the only thing keeping Wang Liqin from doing the same thing is that the Chinese National Team gets new talent so quickly. If WLQ represented any other country he could play for the next decade and still be top notch. Especially when you consider that he probably is in better shape than any other table tennis player. He looks like freaken bruce lee, when he doesn't have a shirt on. And he has maintained that shape for the past decade. He could easily play for another 10 years, and be able to beat most non-Chinese players still.
WLQ is probably also the most athletically gifted table tennis player ever. There is no one with his combination of size and speed. People like Samsonov who have his size and reach look like turtles in comparison. Their movement speed and reaction rate are so much slower. And then people who are faster than WLQ don't have his long reach. So in my opinion, WLQ had an unbelievable combination of talent that made him so good. The Chinese national team has become so good with training methods, that in the future I think the only thing that will make a difference between who becomes the best on the team is born talents. ie, height and arm length etc.
Waldner is good, but I think during the period he was good, the competition level just isn't what it is now. The level of play, level of skill, level of spin has progressed so much, that frankly, its impossible to do the kind of stuff he did when he was younger, because the level of spin in todays professional game just allows so little room for error that you can't execute the kind of stuff he use to do. I think a big reason why people love Waldner is because he is the greatest white player. I mean just look at this thread, there are people voting for Boll as the greatest ever, and yet he hasn't won any world championships or olympics yet. All he has done is win the world cup, which occurs every year. He shouldn't even be in the conversation right now. And yet, because he is currently the best white player right now, he is super popular
Plus the argument that he has lasted throughout the ages, I don't really think should apply, because frankly, the only thing keeping Wang Liqin from doing the same thing is that the Chinese National Team gets new talent so quickly. If WLQ represented any other country he could play for the next decade and still be top notch. Especially when you consider that he probably is in better shape than any other table tennis player. He looks like freaken bruce lee, when he doesn't have a shirt on. And he has maintained that shape for the past decade. He could easily play for another 10 years, and be able to beat most non-Chinese players still.
WLQ is probably also the most athletically gifted table tennis player ever. There is no one with his combination of size and speed. People like Samsonov who have his size and reach look like turtles in comparison. Their movement speed and reaction rate are so much slower. And then people who are faster than WLQ don't have his long reach. So in my opinion, WLQ had an unbelievable combination of talent that made him so good. The Chinese national team has become so good with training methods, that in the future I think the only thing that will make a difference between who becomes the best on the team is born talents. ie, height and arm length etc.
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Spin and more spin.
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It is worth looking at the fact that Waldner was a force to be reckoned with in the table tennis world from 1983 until almost 2004. In '83 he had not hit his prime yet but still was up there, and in '04 he was old and starting to fade but still able to be 4th in the Olympics. When you look at someone like Wang Liqin, who was unstoppable in his prime, he is 8 years younger than Waldner was in '04 and his game has faded as much as Waldner's had. He cannot really compete at that level anymore. And when Waldner won the world Championship in 1997 he was unstoppable in that tournament.
Your argument only works because table tennis is way more competitive now, and has reached a whole new level of skill. People praise Waldner for his innovative style, and his unorthodox and unexpected shots. But frankly, no one can do most of those shots anymore, because the level of spin in today's game is so much greater that the room for error is too small do really do the kind of stuff Waldner did. And your statement what Waldner dominated from 83-04, isn't really accurate. Waldner was famous for losing to lowly players, when he wasn't motivated. It takes a lot of work to reach the top and stay at the top, because everyone is gunning for you and noticing how you play and adapting to your style. Wang Liqin had two periods at ranked number 1, that far surpasses what Waldner ever accomplished.
Plus, you call WLQ's decline in skill, but in reality, he can still beat every non-Chinese player probably 80 percent of the time at least, and 65 percent of the time for Boll. WLQ is in a totally different training setup, the Chinese rush in new talent all the time, so of course he is getting less time to compete, and thus his skills have fallen a bit. WLQ is one of the most dedicated players in terms of keeping in tip top shape, his body hasn't barely changed at all in the past decade, if he represented a different country instead of China, he could compete for the next 15 years probably and still be pretty competitive. Just because Sweden has failed to bring out any kind of talent for the past 20 years, and thus Waldner is still competing, really isn't a good reason to play Waldner over WLQ based on an argument of how long he has been playing professionally.
Plus, you call WLQ's decline in skill, but in reality, he can still beat every non-Chinese player probably 80 percent of the time at least, and 65 percent of the time for Boll. WLQ is in a totally different training setup, the Chinese rush in new talent all the time, so of course he is getting less time to compete, and thus his skills have fallen a bit. WLQ is one of the most dedicated players in terms of keeping in tip top shape, his body hasn't barely changed at all in the past decade, if he represented a different country instead of China, he could compete for the next 15 years probably and still be pretty competitive. Just because Sweden has failed to bring out any kind of talent for the past 20 years, and thus Waldner is still competing, really isn't a good reason to play Waldner over WLQ based on an argument of how long he has been playing professionally.
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