Butterfly Zhang Jike ALC or Stiga Carbonado 145

[lawrence.monsieurr]

Hi there, all.

I am a kind of new member of this forum (this is my first post). What I wanted to ask of you guys is which blade I need to chose:

a Butterfly Zhang Jike ALC or a Stiga Carbonado 145.

My blade for almost a year has been the Butterfly Viscaria in FL handle. I like the blade, a lot, but I don't like his lack of control.
Sometimes, even just a slight miss-hit let me lose the point outright. Therefore, I am looking for a blade which offers the same great characteristics as the Viscaria (dwell, short game, spin,...), but with a bit more control and speed.

I also add that I am a developing player, with a very offensive minded game who likes to win the point with heavy topspins from both wings.
I hope you guys can help me out. Thanks in advance, I would really appreciate it.

 

[UpSideDownCarl]

This is what I think: if you want more control you should go with a Butterfly Timo Boll ZLF or an Innerforce ZLF. The TB ZLF is a bit faster with great dwell time and good control. It will feel closer to the Viscaria than the Innerforce ZLF but the Innerforce ZLF has more control.

The amount more control you will get from a ZJK ALC or the Carbonato 145 will be almost non-existent in comparison to the Viscaria. The ZJK ALC is really not any different from the Viscaria. And the Carbonato, given that it is also a Carbon blade, probably does not have much more control than the other two even if it did have a small amount more. Where as those two ZLF blades are close in speed to the Viscaria (a little less) but have much more dwell time, control and spin. A very noticeable amount given the slight difference in speed.

I guess it might be fun to try the Carbonato 145. But I have a feeling the amount more control you would get from a ZLF blade would be more worthwhile.

 

[lawrence.monsieurr]

Thank you for the information, I will definitely try the Timo Boll ZLF. Do you have some other ideas as well regarding blades who feel closely related to the Viscaria, but with a bit more control?

 

[raazzz]

Sorry I read your topic totally wrong in my first post that I now have deleted, I just got my minds on the Viscaria since I'm doing a review on it. However like UpSideDownCarl wrote the Viscaria and the ZJK ALC are pretty similar and what I have noticed when I have done my review and comparison between the Viscaria and the Carbonado 145 is that the 145 got more control. I think the Viscaria is a bit faster and harder to handle at least for me. I will try to be finish with my review as soon as possible so you can get some more information.

 

[lawrence.monsieurr]

That would be great, I am looking forward to it. Cheers!

 

[Giangt]

Hi there, all.

I am a kind of new member of this forum (this is my first post). What I wanted to ask of you guys is which blade I need to chose:

a Butterfly Zhang Jike ALC or a Stiga Carbonado 145.

My blade for almost a year has been the Butterfly Viscaria in FL handle. I like the blade, a lot, but I don't like his lack of control.
Sometimes, even just a slight miss-hit let me lose the point outright. Therefore, I am looking for a blade which offers the same great characteristics as the Viscaria (dwell, short game, spin,...), but with a bit more control and speed.

I also add that I am a developing player, with a very offensive minded game who likes to win the point with heavy topspins from both wings.
I hope you guys can help me out. Thanks in advance, I would really appreciate it.

This is what I think: if you want more control you should go with a Butterfly Timo Boll ZLF or an Innerforce ZLF. The TB ZLF is a bit faster with great dwell time and good control. It will feel closer to the Viscaria than the Innerforce ZLF but the Innerforce ZLF has more control.

The amount more control you will get from a ZJK ALC or the Carbonato 145 will be almost non-existent in comparison to the Viscaria. The ZJK ALC is really not any different from the Viscaria. And the Carbonato, given that it is also a Carbon blade, probably does not have much more control than the other two even if it did have a small amount more. Where as those two ZLF blades are close in speed to the Viscaria (a little less) but have much more dwell time, control and spin. A very noticeable amount given the slight difference in speed.

I guess it might be fun to try the Carbonato 145. But I have a feeling the amount more control you would get from a ZLF blade would be more worthwhile.

Hi lawrence and welcome to The forum.

I have to disagree on your statement of your comparison of the Viscaria and 145 here Carl. It is probably right that the Viscaria and ZJK ALC are pretty similar blades, but the 145 has more control and is a nudge slower than the Viscaria. The amount of dwell from the 145 is greater due the limba outer ply and somehow the contribution of the TeXtreme Carbon. Feedback is also better IMO with 145. Pls read my review .... Otherwise just ask

 

[lawrence.monsieurr]

Hi there Giangt, thank you.

I have read your review several times up till now. What I want to know is how the Carbonado 145 plays with the new poly ball and whether I can play the Rasant Powergrip on FH. Also you stress that the 145 is a tad slower than the Viscaria, is it really noticeable or is it just a tiny bit? My playing style is based on power with spin rather than just the spin. Thanks in advance.

 

[lawrence.monsieurr]

zhang jike alc is more powerful than viscaria.
zhang jike alc has less control than viscaria.

You say that the Zhang Jike ALC has less control than the Viscaria. Can you tell me in which areas that is?

 

[raazzz]

Hi lawrence and welcome to The forum.

I have to disagree on your statement of your comparison of the Viscaria and 145 here Carl. It is probably right that the Viscaria and ZJK ALC are pretty similar blades, but the 145 has more control and is a nudge slower than the Viscaria. The amount of dwell from the 145 is greater due the limba outer ply and somehow the contribution of the TeXtreme Carbon. Feedback is also better IMO with 145. Pls read my review .... Otherwise just ask

Agree with you Giangt I could really feel the difference in control and also that the Viscaria was a bit faster.

 

[Cornel]

Hi there Giangt, thank you.

I have read your review several times up till now. What I want to know is how the Carbonado 145 plays with the new poly ball and whether I can play the Rasant Powergrip on FH. Also you stress that the 145 is a tad slower than the Viscaria, is it really noticeable or is it just a tiny bit? My playing style is based on power with spin rather than just the spin. Thanks in advance.

I think rating on how smth. will perform on the poly ball will be too subjective. The poly balls are in development, so they are very different. I also think that if it is something that will make an impact on playing with a poly ball it will be the rubber, not the blade. I have played with the Nittaku 3*** SHA and to me, it felt very similar to Celluloid balls, the only difference i noticed was that it was a little bit harder to spin the poly ball.

 

[lawrence.monsieurr]

all areas.
but really they have exactly the same composition and thickness so it's not worth changing from one to the other one.
if you want to change, change to something where you will feel the difference.
just grab the blade chart from butterfly, look for your viscaria and go for blades that are below that in speed.

Alright, I think I have made up my mind then.

 

[lawrence.monsieurr]

Agree with you Giangt I could really feel the difference in control and also that the Viscaria was a bit faster.

How much faster is the Viscaria on a scale of 10 compared to the Carbonado?

 

[raazzz]

Hard to tell in a scale to ten but of course there ain't a tremendous difference.

ttstuff, it's always very individual how easy it is to control a really fast blade since we all play with different game styles and on different levels but of course the more you train the easier it gets.

 

[TareqPhoto]

Control, oh control! what are you really? what blade are you built in or are you coming with practice?

Because of control some may buy different blades, so is it really an equipment issue or the player issue?

I use JM ZLC [not super] blade, and it is really fast, and it has acceptable control, sure if i am a better player then i can increase the control ratio, but i use also N-11 with 9000E rubbers and the control with that is really tremendous over my BTY JM ZLC and Tenergy rubbers.

I bought a defensive blade and 2 different rubbers hoping that will be slower and more control than my BTY one, but who knows, i have 3 already in less than 2 months, so i should take all my time using those 3 and see which one i feel more confident and i can grow up with or improving with.

 

[lawrence.monsieurr]

but honestly, viscaria is not a hard blade to control at all.
I would just keep it and train.
eventually control will come.

Maybe, yeah, I just thought that after a year of playing with it, I would be able to control it, but sometimes, I really can't. I will play with it for another couple of months and will then decide whether or not I will make the change to the Carbonado.

 

[lawrence.monsieurr]

Hard to tell in a scale to ten but of course there ain't a tremendous difference.

ttstuff, it's always very individual how easy it is to control a really fast blade since we all play with different game styles and on different levels but of course the more you train the easier it gets.

That is good to hear, for now I just think that my technique isn't suited for the Viscaria, read: not good enough. Therefore, I am looking for a blade with a more forgiving nature.

 

[UpSideDownCarl]

Hi lawrence and welcome to The forum.

I have to disagree on your statement of your comparison of the Viscaria and 145 here Carl. It is probably right that the Viscaria and ZJK ALC are pretty similar blades, but the 145 has more control and is a nudge slower than the Viscaria. The amount of dwell from the 145 is greater due the limba outer ply and somehow the contribution of the TeXtreme Carbon. Feedback is also better IMO with 145. Pls read my review .... Otherwise just ask

Okay. I have not tried the Carbonato. So I don't know more than the fact that it has carbon and weighs 93 or so grams. I guess I should read your review. How would you compare the speed, dwell time, control and feeling between the Carbonato 145 and the TB ZLF?


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[Baal]

This is what I think: if you want more control you should go with a Butterfly Timo Boll ZLF or an Innerforce ZLF. The TB ZLF is a bit faster with great dwell time and good control. It will feel closer to the Viscaria than the Innerforce ZLF but the Innerforce ZLF has more control.

The amount more control you will get from a ZJK ALC or the Carbonato 145 will be almost non-existent in comparison to the Viscaria. The ZJK ALC is really not any different from the Viscaria. And the Carbonato, given that it is also a Carbon blade, probably does not have much more control than the other two even if it did have a small amount more. Where as those two ZLF blades are close in speed to the Viscaria (a little less) but have much more dwell time, control and spin. A very noticeable amount given the slight difference in speed.

I guess it might be fun to try the Carbonato 145. But I have a feeling the amount more control you would get from a ZLF blade would be more worthwhile.

If anything the ZJK-ALCs I have are slightly faster than most of my Viscarias.

I think the ZLF might be better given your complaint.

 

[UpSideDownCarl]

That is good to hear, for now I just think that my technique isn't suited for the Viscaria, read: not good enough. Therefore, I am looking for a blade with a more forgiving nature.

Based on this you should try something like the

Butterfly Primorac Off-
Stiga Allround Evolution
Nittaku Acoustic
Nexy Peter Pan
Stiga Offensive Classic

 

[dannyreventon]

Based on this you should try something like the

Butterfly Primorac Off-
Stiga Allround Evolution
Nittaku Acoustic
Nexy Peter Pan
Stiga Offensive Classic

These are great blades! Might as well try Stiga Clipper, OSP Virtuoso. Related to that, you can try the Innerforce or rather the "Innerfiber" series of butterfly. Innerforce/fiber ALC.