Extreme Table Tennis Training with weights and UFC masks!

[Archosaurus]

Carl, that's interesting. The holding breath being an unconscious response to stress.

Is he trying to quite literally calm himself down with the whole holding breath method? Is it a reaction to stress caused by the situation?

 

[UpSideDownCarl]

Carl, that's interesting. The holding breath being an unconscious response to stress.

Is he trying to quite literally calm himself down with the whole holding breath method? Is it a reaction to stress caused by the situation?

Oh gosh, Archo. You are too funny. It is common for people to freeze when stressed or to hold their breath. There is not a conscious reason for an unconscious response. And the response has the exact opposite effect of what you suggest and of what the guy wants. It makes him more stressed and more likely to mess up. So it is like a vicious cycle.

But the off comment someone made about imitating Ovtcharov's grunting wasn't actually a bad suggestion even though it was not meant as a suggestion. Getting the guy to vocalize during the stroke would definitely ensure he was breathing during the stroke and it also would usually ensure that the exhale was timed properly to the stroke. I know for sure I definitely use my voice when I take a power stroke. What I do isn't a loud grunt. But the sound is there. And that does help the power, the stroke and the timing of the hips and core.

 

[Suga D]

Oh gosh, Archo. You are too funny. It is common for people to freeze when stressed or to hold their breath. There is not a conscious reason for an unconscious response. And the response has the exact opposite effect of what you suggest and of what the guy wants. It makes him more stressed and more likely to mess up. So it is like a vicious cycle.

But the off comment someone made about imitating Ovtcharov's grunting wasn't actually a bad suggestion even though it was not meant as a suggestion. Getting the guy to vocalize during the stroke would definitely ensure he was breathing during the stroke and it also would usually ensure that the exhale was timed properly to the stroke. I know for sure I definitely use my voice when I take a power stroke. What I do isn't a loud grunt. But the sound is there. And that does help the power the stroke and the timing of the hips and core.

Now this is getting really interesting.
It's quite hard to break a vicious cycle, and hence maybe that could be a reason why Eli chose such an "unorthodox" method. Nice.

But your reasoning about the breathing is also makin' a lot of sense IMHO.
This sounds quite similar how breathing is used in some martial arts, like ving tsun e.g.
Maybe our martial arts expert OSPH knows more about this and can elaborate a bit.

Wow. Now all of a sudden Ovtcharov's grunts do make sense (in a way).

Thanks for enlightening, Carl.

 

[hopper]

Just do a little experiment: inhale from the lower stomach, hold your breath and do a forward Swing. You'll notice that the resulting tensioning of the abdomen stabilizes the core. Strong inhalation/tensioning even stabilizes the elbow positionering. Just before hitting the ball, you have to breath out to release the tension/power.
This is recent personal experience from my side but also recently read some backup in an article about stabilizing the core by breath control.

 

[UpSideDownCarl]

Now this is getting really interesting.
It's quite hard to break a vicious cycle, and hence maybe that could be a reason why Eli chose such an "unorthodox" method. Nice.

But your reasoning about the breathing is also makin' a lot of sense IMHO.
This sounds quite similar how breathing is used in some martial arts, like ving tsun e.g.
Maybe our martial arts expert OSPH knows more about this and can elaborate a bit.

Wow. Now all of a sudden Ovtcharov's grunts do make sense (in a way).

Thanks for enlightening, Carl.

Yep. I almost mentioned martial arts, or tennis players who make sound while they swing. Definitely part of the power of their stroke. But, it has everything to do with the mechanics of how our bodies exhale. Take a forced exhale like you are trying to get as much air out as you can as fast as you can where the speed of the breath forces some sound. See if you can feel how many muscles contact for you to make that forceful, fast exhale. Notice how your abdomen has to pull in for you to exhale all the air out fast like that.

When I went to watch Marvelous Marvin Hagler train, before he was a champion, from 3 feet away, you could hear how, with every single punch there was a one of those forced exhales. Was Hagler thinking about that? No. It was necessary for the force of his punches. All boxers do that. We might not think about it, but when we do certain actions, our breath is timed to our movement because that is how the body works.

When you hold your breath on an action like a stroke and inhibit that natural response of the body working how it is supposed to, you will mess with your timing and power.

And yes, it sounds to me like Eli Baraty was being creative in trying to figure out a way to make it so the student had to breath on the stroke. That the mask was an attempt to make it so he could not accidentally hold his breath since the mask made it so holding his breath would put him at even more of a breath deficit. That is how I read the passage I quoted earlier and am quoting again below:

This exercise was specific to this young man. Because when he gets a weak ball he holds his breath and tenses up and generally misses a relatively weak ball. This particular exercise forced him to breath while playing a weak ball.
I hope that makes sense!

 

[Baal]

I'll reserve judgement on whether or not the mask could increase VO2 max.

As for the ankle weights: ankle weights could actually cause injury due to an excessive load capacity on smaller muscles in the legs.

I teach physiology to medical students. For the reason I mentioned above, I very much doubt this mask is going to increase VO2max. Unless you wear it all the time, you really aren't going to get an increased in number of red blood cells or hemoglobin content, which is the underlying mechanism. Kidneys take some time to respond with increased in erythropoietin production. It would take more than one very well designed study to convince me that these things work that way. Another possibility is that they increase diaphragm and intercostal muscle strength. But again, I wonder if that can really happen much.

But I want to echo strongly the comments about the leg weights and effects on ankles and hip. Trust me, the last thing you want is to induce damage to Achilles tendon if you are free of any problems there at the moment, so if you use the wieights do it with caution and not for very long at a time. (I have seen Chinese coaches here do some things to students that are almost guaranteed to cause injuries, which is the way they were trained, so I would say that not all of their training methods are equally well informed in terms of modern sports medicine and exercise science).

A valsalva maneuver may be part of the reason some people hold their breath, but I doubt it is the main reason in TT. I think psychological reasons related to stress are a better explanation most of the time -- in this sport anyway. The reason I think that is people will sometimes hold breath almost throughout the rally, or at very lest over a period of time that covers several shots. You really do need to sometimes remember to breathe, and again, the grunting or vocalization during a shot is one way to make sure it happens. It also helps with timing. It is also really annoying to everybody else who has to listen to it. Always a downside.

 

[congbk02]

people can refer to this video
Table Tenis Japan Traning-Backhand-Forhand

 

[wtachetna]

This is called extreme. Thanks for sharing. I think players who are dedicated towards their career must practice their game like this. Only hard work with dedication can help you succeed in the sport's world.