Is it bad to mainly focus on the weight transfer while having a fixed arm for doing a forehand drive?

[DaN3]

I am mainly focused on feeling my left leg when I finish my shots as a right-handed player, and when I'm doing a forehand drive, my arm is almost fixed, and I hit the ball with the power that goes into my left leg, and I can do it very fast, and the ball always lands on the other side, and some people see me and tell me, "Good job," but there is an old guy who watches me and smiles and tells jokes behind me and laughs behind me with others and then tells me to use the opening and closing of my forearm and not to use my waist and that I look like a robot when I do my forehand drive.

I really don't understand his point; I don't know if he is complimenting or telling my problems. While I'm doing my forehand drive as I described above, I can easily open and close my forearm, and that's when I can create topspin. But he keeps telling me not to make myself tired. He is making me feel like I'm wasting something. People could do a forehand drive with not much weight transfer by using their arm, and I already can do this, but do you not think storing more power on the right leg and hitting the ball when you feel the left leg causes more power and fast shots?

I believe he is jealous and wants me to forget my technique.
My leg's starting and ending position for a forehand drive looks like this:

I can create topspin with the same leg movement by opening and closing my forearm, except I intentionally want to do a forehand drive and not generate that much topspin, but he seems like it is critical for the forearm to open and close.

 

[Persistence TT]

I am mainly focused on feeling my left leg when I finish my shots as a right-handed player, and when I'm doing a forehand drive, my arm is almost fixed, and I hit the ball with the power that goes into my left leg, and I can do it very fast, and the ball always lands on the other side, and some people see me and tell me, "Good job," but there is an old guy who watches me and smiles and tells jokes behind me and laughs behind me with others and then tells me to use the opening and closing of my forearm and not to use my waist and that I look like a robot when I do my forehand drive.

I really don't understand his point; I don't know if he is complimenting or telling my problems. While I'm doing my forehand drive as I described above, I can easily open and close my forearm, and that's when I can create topspin. But he keeps telling me not to make myself tired. He is making me feel like I'm wasting something. People could do a forehand drive with not much weight transfer by using their arm, and I already can do this, but do you not think storing more power on the right leg and hitting the ball when you feel the left leg causes more power and fast shots?

I believe he is jealous and wants me to forget my technique.
My leg's starting and ending position for a forehand drive looks like this:


View attachment 34940View attachment 34941
I can create topspin with the same leg movement by opening and closing my forearm, except I intentionally want to do a forehand drive and not generate that much topspin, but he seems like it is critical for the forearm to open and close.

bitter old guys are adorable, they play sports for all the wrong reasons.

Don't even pay attention, a quality shot always involves weight transfer and footwork, playing with your hand is easy and anyone can do it. Besides falling to your left leg is the best way because you store energy in order to jump back easily for the next shot without losing any balance and momentum at the same time

You keep doing what you feel right.

Besides every optimal shot requires for you to get into position first, if you don't have the perfect/optimal position against every different ball then your shot will not be good

 

[McSmasher]

A forehand drive is typically done with less weight transfer than what you're doing, as it's designed to be used when you're closer to the table, therefore you'll have less time to activate full weight transfer. Your footwork looks more like a forehand topspin / loop, which is designed to have more power and spin. In saying that, judging by the photos, the weight transfer looks good for the purpose of topspins a metre or so away from the table.

So to answer the question in the title of this thread, the answer is "it depends" lol:

• If you're just warming up before a match, maybe give a few "simpler" forehand drives with less weight transfer so that you and your opponent can get a feel for the ball. After that, feel free to step away from the table and use more weight transfer for launching heavier topspins (and maybe let them do the same thing by going back closer to the table and driving for them to topspin)
• If you're training for topspins with full weight transfer, ignore the old man and keep doing what you're doing. Weight transfer is one of the most important things in topspins
• However, if you are training topspins, then using a little bit of forearm, wrist and fingers will add to your spin quality and power (but then it won't be a forehand drive anymore).

An example of this is in this training session between Ma Long and Fan Zhendong. They both start closer to the table, with only a little bit of weight transfer, then once they get the feel for the ball, one of the players will stand further back and start launching topspins with more weight transfer.

 

[RefereeNumber2]

Do you have enough power for your level? If yes, then you're doing fine according to your own description.

If you want more power or find that you're lacking power against stronger opponents (running out of steam bc your stroke requires a lot of force, not being able to recover quickly enough, etc.), you will want to learn how to use your forearm movement (+ wrist/hand) to get power. Holding your forearm completely fixed will prevent you from using the force generated by your lower body as efficiently as possible.

See if you're able to do continuous away from the table topspin to topspin rallies in practice without getting tired.

 

[pingpongpaddy]

I am mainly focused on feeling my left leg when I finish my shots as a right-handed player, and when I'm doing a forehand drive, my arm is almost fixed, and I hit the ball with the power that goes into my left leg, and I can do it very fast, and the ball always lands on the other side, and some people see me and tell me, "Good job," but there is an old guy who watches me and smiles and tells jokes behind me and laughs behind me with others and then tells me to use the opening and closing of my forearm and not to use my waist and that I look like a robot when I do my forehand drive.

I really don't understand his point; I don't know if he is complimenting or telling my problems. While I'm doing my forehand drive as I described above, I can easily open and close my forearm, and that's when I can create topspin. But he keeps telling me not to make myself tired. He is making me feel like I'm wasting something. People could do a forehand drive with not much weight transfer by using their arm, and I already can do this, but do you not think storing more power on the right leg and hitting the ball when you feel the left leg causes more power and fast shots?

I believe he is jealous and wants me to forget my technique.
My leg's starting and ending position for a forehand drive looks like this:


View attachment 34940View attachment 34941
I can create topspin with the same leg movement by opening and closing my forearm, except I intentionally want to do a forehand drive and not generate that much topspin, but he seems like it is critical for the forearm to open and close.

Hi dan,
from your photos it seems that you have a good notion of power from the use of your legs.
however imho your fh will improve if you learn to combine relaxed arm wrist and fingers with the effort from your legs. It's called timing - synchronising them all the moment of impact so that you can achieve more power with a shorter swing.
If you think deeply about it you'll see there is a place for big strokes and small quick strokes (often enabling you to borrow power from your opponent).
your would be advisor says you are a bit robotic, and this is often associated with over rotation of the waist, and over emphasis of the beginning and ending of your strokes. In our club we have a young improver, who was just using his arm and he was informed that he needed to use his body and legs more. Following week he was over rotating like mad across the line of the shot, and thinking of nothing but raw power but he had lost the good timing he was exhibiting with his arm only style. so we had to rein him in and explain that its more efficient to get all the bits working together .
So I suspect it may be worth while to try and understand where this guy is coming from.
of course if you have a video that might clarify things
good luck

 

[blahness]

Quite excessive for a FH drive. With FH drive you should have a much more compact movement and rotation than a loop. It is a warmup after all to get the feeling of good ball contact. If you do all that body rotation and intentionally not create that much spin it is a bad habit imo, if you rotate to that extent, you should always be aiming for a spinny af loop (either slow or with power) to create a lot of quality to put a lot of pressure on the opponent.

The reason why you still want to practise the FH drive is that it is the fundamentals and you need those to be very good at blocking to countering to counterlooping.

 

[Tony's Table Tennis]

how many can you do in a row?
care to share a video?

 

[dingyibvs]

Quite excessive for a FH drive. With FH drive you should have a much more compact movement and rotation than a loop. It is a warmup after all to get the feeling of good ball contact. If you do all that body rotation and intentionally not create that much spin it is a bad habit imo, if you rotate to that extent, you should always be aiming for a spinny af loop (either slow or with power) to create a lot of quality to put a lot of pressure on the opponent.

The reason why you still want to practise the FH drive is that it is the fundamentals and you need those to be very good at blocking to countering to counterlooping.

I wouldn't focus on that, I think he me at something different with FH drive. I think he's referring to a loop that hits into the blade rather than a brush loop.

As for whether the motion looks robotic or not, oftentimss it's not a matter of how much you're rotating, but how well are you using the activation sequence. A video would be more helpful here.

 

[blahness]

I wouldn't focus on that, I think he me at something different with FH drive. I think he's referring to a loop that hits into the blade rather than a brush loop.

As for whether the motion looks robotic or not, oftentimss it's not a matter of how much you're rotating, but how well are you using the activation sequence. A video would be more helpful here.

Usually FH drive is like warmup and basic countering without much spin, then what he wrote would make more sense.

If he meant drive loop (think that is more a Korean term), then yeah what you said makes sense.

I have met quite a few players who only practice looping and never countering - it is a bit annoying to warmup with them but then usually these players have major weaknesses in defence and counterattacking.

 

[Gozo Zyreruna]

Asian Ojisan play with pips out rubber all day long, cannot do proper top spin.

Do the proper weight transfer, the whole nind yard, even if you suxs, you still look super cool and get tonnes of body workout.

Meanwhile ojisan stand like a tree in one spot and just block with his pips, after five minutes goes outside and lit a ciggie.

 

[Vicke]

If I'm not mistaken, the pictures in your post is actually Harimoto playing, right?

 

[Jslick89]

Since forehand is my money shot, i can tell you that this shot it is important to focus on the full kinetic chain of movement. From your feet, to your legs, to your hips, to your core, to your elbow to your wrist. Only then will you unlock the true power of your forehand.

 

[pingpongpaddy]

If I'm not mistaken, the pictures in your post is actually Harimoto playing, right?

well spotted!

 

[McSmasher]

If I'm not mistaken, the pictures in your post is actually Harimoto playing, right?

well spotted!

Yep, very well spotted

 

[DaN3]

Can somebody clarify that in weight transfer in table tennis, players should rotate on their toes, or do heels matter?
When I showed the pictures from Harimoto and said I do that kind of weight transfer for my forehand drive, I now have to clarify that I am on my toes and am able to just rotate on my toes and not use my heels. That makes me able to easily hit the ball without worrying if the ball will land on the table.
I like Harimoto's weight transfer because it seems there is a logic behind him using his toes and heels, but I don't really know what is a good weight transfer and what is a kind of weight transfer that is used when you are out of position.
For me, what feels safer for my knees is the kind of weight transfer that I rotate on my toes when I'm crouched from right to left.

Here I would think Harimoto was out of position and he had to be on his right heel; correct me if the correct weight transfer has to start from storing power only on your right heel rather than the toe or if it has to start from both of them touching the ground:

And when he finishes the stroke, his left foot lands like it seems he is on both the toe and the heel; I wanted to know if it is better to not land on the heel when you are in position and you want to do the correct technique and not to reinforce things, which then could mean players have to be on their left toe when the weight transfer finishes.

This is the kind of weight transfer that I want to know if it is the correct one among all; I couldn't find a single player doing it like this, so I had to demonstrate it with a 3D model; as you can see, the toes are on the ground without heels touching the ground:

 

[RefereeNumber2]

Can somebody clarify that in weight transfer in table tennis, players should rotate on their toes, or do heels matter?
When I showed the pictures from Harimoto and said I do that kind of weight transfer for my forehand drive, I now have to clarify that I am on my toes and am able to just rotate on my toes and not use my heels. That makes me able to easily hit the ball without worrying if the ball will land on the table.
I like Harimoto's weight transfer because it seems there is a logic behind him using his toes and heels, but I don't really know what is a good weight transfer and what is a kind of weight transfer that is used when you are out of position.
For me, what feels safer for my knees is the kind of weight transfer that I rotate on my toes when I'm crouched from right to left.

Here I would think Harimoto was out of position and he had to be on his right heel; correct me if the correct weight transfer has to start from storing power only on your right heel rather than the toe or if it has to start from both of them touching the ground:

View attachment 34962
And when he finishes the stroke, his left foot lands like it seems he is on both the toe and the heel; I wanted to know if it is better to not land on the heel when you are in position and you want to do the correct technique and not to reinforce things, which then could mean players have to be on their left toe when the weight transfer finishes.

View attachment 34963
This is the kind of weight transfer that I want to know if it is the correct one among all; I couldn't find a single player doing it like this, so I had to demonstrate it with a 3D model; as you can see, the toes are on the ground without heels touching the ground:

View attachment 34964View attachment 34965

IMO, you are over-thinking/over-complicating this. From first principles: the muscles in your legs and core are the largest and strongest in your body, and they can easily generate the most power. Doing "weight transfer" is simply the way to activate those muscles. It's a universal principle of movement in any sport that involves swinging or throwing something.

It seems that you like to study the technique of top players, which can definitely be helpful. My recommendation would be that instead of hyper-focusing on the minutiae of what a particular top player's technique looks like, you may want to look for the common factors in the techniques of all top players (there are many), and then apply those general principles to your technique. Any particular player's technique is specific to his/her brain and anatomy so is unlikely to be the best for you.

Another tip is -- while practicing/playing -- to focus on how a movement feels, rather than on details like the exact positioning of your body. It may be counterintuitive, but your brain is better at reproducing a movement based on a feeling compared to trying to consciously control every muscle. If you want to get into details, record footage of yourself and watch it back afterwards, and iteratively try out different movement feelings to see how they translate. Another way to do this quickly is to do shadow swings in front of a mirror.

 

[pingpongpaddy]

Can somebody clarify that in weight transfer in table tennis, players should rotate on their toes, or do heels matter?
When I showed the pictures from Harimoto and said I do that kind of weight transfer for my forehand drive, I now have to clarify that I am on my toes and am able to just rotate on my toes and not use my heels. That makes me able to easily hit the ball without worrying if the ball will land on the table.
I like Harimoto's weight transfer because it seems there is a logic behind him using his toes and heels, but I don't really know what is a good weight transfer and what is a kind of weight transfer that is used when you are out of position.
For me, what feels safer for my knees is the kind of weight transfer that I rotate on my toes when I'm crouched from right to left.

Here I would think Harimoto was out of position and he had to be on his right heel; correct me if the correct weight transfer has to start from storing power only on your right heel rather than the toe or if it has to start from both of them touching the ground:

View attachment 34962
And when he finishes the stroke, his left foot lands like it seems he is on both the toe and the heel; I wanted to know if it is better to not land on the heel when you are in position and you want to do the correct technique and not to reinforce things, which then could mean players have to be on their left toe when the weight transfer finishes.

View attachment 34963
This is the kind of weight transfer that I want to know if it is the correct one among all; I couldn't find a single player doing it like this, so I had to demonstrate it with a 3D model; as you can see, the toes are on the ground without heels touching the ground:

View attachment 34964View attachment 34965

DAN
You are going about this the wrong way, focusing on tiny details of your movements, which in practice are dealt with by the unconscious mind. You just need look at videos of Harimoto, Ma Long, Xu Xin, KTS, whoever and do practice swings in front of a mirror. imagine throwing your weight forward from the Bh Corner and then the Fh corner. A term that comes up often in discussing technique is your 'Lizard Brain'. You make conscious decisions to send different shots to different places at varied speeds to defeat your opponent. That is complicated enough. Fortunately your Lizard Brain will deal with the position of your heel and toe so you can concentrate on winning matches!