ITTF/WTT problems reported from players

[NextLevel]

Keep in mind this wouldn't have happened had the players not whined about team events carrying no points. Now that points are allocated, players are accountable for any consequences. With rights come responsibilities.

https://www.tabletennisdaily.com/fo...ld-cup-2023-chengdu-12-4-10.31810/post-432525

Points have been allocated in the past for team events before WTT ever existed but this is one of those things where I will just let people determine for themselves whether the existence of ranking points has any bearing on whether a country should be able to field a full team or not and whether individual players should be sanctioned by the ITTF/WTT rather than the country when players fail to play. Do note that all play is/was done with approval by specific national associations.

 

[Tony's Table Tennis]

Points have been allocated in the past for team events before WTT ever existed but this is one of those things where I will just let people determine for themselves whether the existence of ranking points has any bearing on whether a country should be able to field a full team or not and whether individual players should be sanctioned by the ITTF/WTT rather than the country when players fail to play. Do note that all play is/was done with approval by specific national associations.

if Nigeria had more players, Aruna wouldn't have this problem
that is why he was so upset.
he self funds himself to teams, and then when the sxxx hits the fan, he is the culprit.
it is like you are not allowed to breakdown and get sick.

ITTF should of never allowed the penalty to happen in the first place, and should of fined the team for it, since the team did not bring an extra player.

In some sports, if your team don't have enough players, then you just play, 1 man short.

 

[zeio]

Points have been allocated in the past for team events before WTT ever existed but this is one of those things where I will just let people determine for themselves whether the existence of ranking points has any bearing on whether a country should be able to field a full team or not and whether individual players should be sanctioned by the ITTF/WTT rather than the country when players fail to play. Do note that all play is/was done with approval by specific national associations.

The ZPP on Abiodun for being late to WTTC 2024 is still in effect yet Aruna gets away with his, with both violations of the same nature in essence. Where is the racial discrimination argument? Where is the incompetent NTTF argument?

If NTTF can't gather a team, then that spot should be given to another association. Simple as that. Don't hang on to it and complain.

 

[NextLevel]

The ZPP on Abiodun for being late to WTTC 2024 is still in effect yet Aruna gets away with his, with both violations of the same nature in essence. Where is the racial discrimination argument? Where is the incompetent NTTF argument?

If NTTF can't gather a team, then that spot should be given to another association. Simple as that. Don't hang on to it and complain.

Bode cares more about his son playing for Portugal than anything related to his career but I am sure he could and would have have contested this had it made a difference to him. He doesn't play tour events for the most part so he doesn't care. But yes, if he cared, the same arguments should be made for him as well. Which is why it would be nice to know what the arguments behind the issue are so that the case as precedent can be established.

And yes, countries can be suspended or replaced as people see fit. Not sure the relevance to the main point, just make the rules make sense in the context of the nations. I suspect Nigeria qualified as runners up out of African competition so there might have been other countries willing to take their place if they didn't want to attend.

 

[zeio]

So you're implying Aruna does not care about his family as much, which was also one of his arguments for not playing WTT CS Incheon 2024? As I noted in that link, you can't have it both ways.

 

[NextLevel]

So you're implying Aruna does not care about his family as much, which was also one of his arguments for not playing WTT CS Incheon 2024? As I noted in that link, you can't have it both ways.

No, but if that is what you seriously got from my post, so be it. Going through a mildly tough time, can't really get into stuff that isn't fun.

 

[Tony's Table Tennis]

Bode cares more about his son playing for Portugal than anything related to his career but I am sure he could and would have have contested this had it made a difference to him. He doesn't play tour events for the most part so he doesn't care. But yes, if he cared, the same arguments should be made for him as well. Which is why it would be nice to know what the arguments behind the issue are so that the case as precedent can be established.

I can't believe there is a argument or comparison between Bode and Aruna.
I agree, doesn't care for one, and care for the other.

And yes, countries can be suspended or replaced as people see fit. Not sure the relevance to the main point, just make the rules make sense in the context of the nations. I suspect Nigeria qualified as runners up out of African competition so there might have been other countries willing to take their place if they didn't want to attend.

I agree, if anything, Nigeria national federation must get they act together.
ITTF targeting players are just soft targets

again, zeio isn't answering me if the there are 5 players (3 pitch), would the penalty still have happened?

teams is loosing a lot of value and ittf isn't doing anything constructive to bring back the value of going after players.

especially all this happened while NO one got paid out by ITTF/WTT, for months.

 

[Tony's Table Tennis]

So yesterday I found out and it was confirmed that Lin Yun-Ju is getting punished for withdrawing from WTT Zagreb - due to personal reasons.

WTT has acknowledge LYJ's withdrawal by
1) annoucing it on social media
2) not having his name on the players list.

Each player has 2 allowances of withdrawal a year.
The withdrawal request was sent in early May already.
here is the post

here is the punishment.

Lin isn't the only player being punished, but he is the most famous.

It becomes a huge admin nightmare when EVERYONE (seeds/top players, qualification players) are all automatically entered and then each player/MA would need to withdraw the players....

Well, waiting for ITTF to see who is at fault now....
Unnecessary stress for players to face.

 

[zeio]

Read and UNDERSTAND the rules for once. Free withdrawals do not apply to late withdrawals. And has it ever crossed your mind the possibility that he's withdrawn more than twice this year? That's why I don't answer your asinine questions anymore.

https://www.tabletennisdaily.com/fo...blems-reported-from-players.33539/post-462339

 

[Tony's Table Tennis]

Read and UNDERSTAND the rules for once. Free withdrawals do not apply to late withdrawals. And has it ever crossed your mind the possibility that he's withdrawn more than twice this year? That's why I don't answer your asinine questions anymore.

https://www.tabletennisdaily.com/fo...blems-reported-from-players.33539/post-462339

so you saying Lin doesn't know whats going on and that he didn't know he withdraw more than twice?
between you and Lin, I think I would trust Lin more, haha

and z, you are stuck with the rules.
The purpose of the thread is that the rules are the problem! no matter if Lin is right or wrong here.
20+ participation a year and only 2 free withdraw a year? that is cool hey?

why you being a ITTF/WTT fan club member now all of the sudden. Did someone high up tell you to be a fan?

star contender going on now is another withdrawal from him + many others
if you are blinded, then really, that is shocking to say the least

 

[Tony's Table Tennis]

So I guess that is why granny Ni lost the match on purpose, as WTT didn't allow her to withdraw on-site else she would need to serve some punishment in the event city......

 

[Tony's Table Tennis]

Q&A:

1) Who said Lin had a late withdrawal?
answer: zieo??

really?
okay, so this is the rules:

2) so what date did WTT acknowledge Lin's withdrawal to the public?
answer:13 May

3) What is the commence date of WTT Zagreb?
answer: 3 June 2023

 

[Tony's Table Tennis]

Mandatory events consists of what events?
Zeio said
As posted during Saudi Smash 2024, only WTT GS main draw, WTT F, and WTT CS are mandatory events, and each player is entitled to 2 free withdrawals per year from ITTF events, and WTT GS qualifying draw, WTT SCT, CT and FEE events.


My response,
1) what is Automatic entry? here is WTT's definition.

2) What even has Automatic Entry other than GS, F, CS? and who does it affect?

AER or Automatic Entry includes that of SC, C and Feeders too.
in both main and qualifying rounds.
you get entered and it is YOUR JOB to withdraw.

herewith the rule book on the AER

3) how many free withdrawal do you get a year?

The answer is 2 for the whole year.
thereafter, other than fines (money), there are penalties.

Fact remains:
1) Lin withdraw from WTT Zagred according to his knowledge of within the 2 allowed + within the required time frame
2) Lin got punished for no show to an event he is no longer on the players list

Zeio said Contender is not mandatory... well, tell that to who even triggered the punishment on a Contender

 

[backspacer]

View attachment 30316
So I guess that is why granny Ni lost the match on purpose, as WTT didn't allow her to withdraw on-site else she would need to serve some punishment in the event city......

Sounds like WTT is running a prison. Unbelievable.

 

[zeio]

Withdrawing on 5/13? The entry deadline for 2024 has been changed to 5 weeks (4/30 in this case) ahead instead of 4 (5/7). Self-inflicted.

https://sports.ltn.com.tw/news/breakingnews/4701933

不過，林昀儒團隊表示，退出札格瑞布挑戰賽早依照規定在5月13日就向桌球協會提出，且每名球員每年有兩次免責退出球星挑戰賽及以下比賽的機會，實在不明白為何會被賦予0分懲處，已委請桌協像國際桌總提出申訴。

 

[zeio]

A misinterpretation of 4.1.1.(b) is one possible explanation for withdrawing on 5/13, which was almost 2 weeks after 4/30 (4/29 to be exact).

https://wttwebcmsprod.blob.core.windows.net/technicaldocuments/WTT Series & Feeder Handbook 2024.pdf

4. PLAYER CODE OF CONDUCT
4.1 Entry/Withdrawal Offences
4.1.1 Withdrawal - Singles:
a) For all Main Draw automatic entries, awarded Host Wildcards, awarded WTT Nominations and/or
Youth Nominations, a withdrawal fine, specified in clause 4.1.1 (d) will be applied unless the player
is on maternity providing the necessary documentation or the player provides signed certificate that
he/she is retired from any International competition or a medical certificate is submitted and
approved by WTT, and the player does not compete in other non WTT events during the period of
the entered event.
b) A player who is entered into Qualifying Singles at the time of the singles entry deadline has two
(2) weeks to withdraw from the event. If the player withdraws after the two-weeks cancellation
period, a withdrawal fine, specified in clause 4.1.1.(d), will be applied unless a medical certificate is
submitted and approved by WTT, and the player does not compete in other events during the period
of the entered event.

 

[Tony's Table Tennis]

Lin didn't enter into qualifying singles, he was entered into main draw.

there is now talks that his first withdraw of 2024 (2nd if you include star contender slovenia) is his 3rd withdraw in a 12 month cycle (slovenia being 4th)
the question is ask, how does the 12 month work? because it doesn't say it in black and white
is it 12 month cycle, or calendar year??

even based on 4.1.1b it is just a fine and not penalty.
the whole thing is a mess and you have 2 x withdrawal over 10 ~ 20 events that are forced entries.
and no one knows how the 12 months work.

The fact is, WTT accepted the withdraw and didn't warn Lin's team of the repercussions of over 2 or what not.
the penalty came as a total surprise
and his 2nd withdrawal of Star contender Slovenia followed suite... and WTT following its rules of "in time" withdrawal, was able to "bump" up players for both events to fill in the spots (a sign that withdrawal was within the allowed time)

clearly innocence, misunderstanding or unclear WTT rules?
or one of those, you are guilty and you need to go lodge an appeal with ITTF - aka Aruna's Case.

As I said before, you need a law degree to follow WTT rule book. And not to mention, there isn't one in Chinese.
I have been called upon a few times to help my friends at CTTTA with reading of the rules.
I was amazed there isn't other languages available - you would think WTT would have at last few other languages.

The troubles behind the scene for a world body, to me, shouldn't really even happen.

 

[Tony's Table Tennis]

Never the less, if this blunder can't be fixed before OG draw
then Japan will move up to teams 4th spot, and Taiwan will drop to Japan's 5th spot giving Japan the WIN of this whole incidence.

 

[Tony's Table Tennis]

Sounds like WTT is running a prison. Unbelievable.

I asked few players if they read the whole handbook before signing - the answer is no, because they can't read English.

so, before they play WTT, they need to sign a WTT Group document/form, basically signing their rights away.
So legally, the players are prisoners and are required to pitch for 10~20+ events a year, or face harsh withdrawal penalties.

I wonder if any on-site withdrawal - penalty has surfaced, that we don't know about.
What "event" would WTT force the player to do? I assume go into some local club or school to do a talk on TT (at least that is productive)

 

[quanghuysk]

So yesterday I found out and it was confirmed that Lin Yun-Ju is getting punished for withdrawing from WTT Zagreb - due to personal reasons.

WTT has acknowledge LYJ's withdrawal by
1) annoucing it on social media
2) not having his name on the players list.

Each player has 2 allowances of withdrawal a year.
The withdrawal request was sent in early May already.
here is the post

View attachment 30304

here is the punishment.
View attachment 30303


Lin isn't the only player being punished, but he is the most famous.

It becomes a huge admin nightmare when EVERYONE (seeds/top players, qualification players) are all automatically entered and then each player/MA would need to withdraw the players....

Well, waiting for ITTF to see who is at fault now....
Unnecessary stress for players to face.

Lin is probably having problem with his wrist and elbow according to the tape. These kind of injuries usually take long for treatment and revover. I'm thinking he should have done the withdrawn with injury reason, then would there be penalty or not?
Do players allow to choose what tournament they want to play? Or if wtt send the invitation, they're forced to play? That's shitty to see how wtt is doing with players now.