Long Pimples

[YosuaYosan]

@Rhydian
Less passive reversal, more active reversal, more potential to wobble a ball, more attacking potential, more speed, more/less control depending how you see it..

Thats sponged lp in a nutshell

 

[azlan]

I don't use LP or any pips rubber for that matter. By the way you described sponged LP, I would think it's all very +tive. So why some resort to doing something which is illegal? Go figure....coz I can't.

 

[YosuaYosan]

They just want to have a shortcut to win against average players..
Or maybe they are too frustated to learn and understand what spin is on the ball..

Or maybe they are rebellious by nature, or maybe 'innovative'..

I dunno, but I will stick to fair play..

 

[vietcongOX]

by some pips that are very common, the ones that your players are most likely to face sometime in the future...

Feint Long 2 & 3 or Tibhar Grass

Maybe Dr.Neubauer Boomerang Classic

y not try long pips vietcong ox..

 

[YosuaYosan]

y not try long pips vietcong ox..

I wanna buy it

 

[vietcongOX]

shy if sell it to u who that great as pip player...worried if pimple never be as in video.

 

[YosuaYosan]

Oh come on sir
I am a natural pimple player. I use Grass D.Tecs on my backhand now

 

[moriguchi2]

eww long pips...designed and for old men and old women

 

[vietcongOX]

 

[moriguchi2]

where did ur friend get his national team shirt???

 

[vietcongOX]

 

[UpSideDownCarl]

eww long pips...designed and for old men and old women

I sort of agree with this. There are places for it. There are purposes for it. I love hitting against long pips and antispin. Nothing helps my game improve more than hitting with a good trick rubber player. But what I see from people who use these rubbers, a lot of the time, it is because they just want an easy shortcut to winning. And the end result is that the people who use rubbers like that who are not higher rated players, often do not develop good strokes, good form, good habits, because the trick rubber does so much of the work for them. The trick rubber can actually slow down your development of the more important fundamental skills of Table Tennis. I read somewhere that it is a good idea for a player who wants to learn to use these kinds of rubbers for their game, not to do it until they have reached a certain level and have developed good strokes for all the basic shots of Table Tennis: pushes, chops, blocks, counter-hits, drive shots, loops and serves. And any good player should be able to do all these shots proficiently even if he specializes: an offensive player uses more offensive strokes; a defensive player uses the defensive strokes more. But you should be able to do all of them.

The higher level players who use these rubbers could use smooth rubber, because their technique is solid. However, it is also worth looking at the fact that, in the top 100 in the world there are very few pips players.

All this does not change the fact that using long pips and antispin as a training tool to help develop the skills of a player and to help them be able to deal with facing these kinds of rubbers is an excellent idea.

 

[WiWa]

I sort of agree with this. There are places for it. There are purposes for it. I love hitting against long pips and antispin. Nothing helps my game improve more than hitting with a good trick rubber player. But what I see from people who use these rubbers, a lot of the time, it is because they just want an easy shortcut to winning. And the end result is that the people who use rubbers like that who are not higher rated players, often do not develop good strokes, good form, good habits, because the trick rubber does so much of the work for them. The trick rubber can actually slow down your development of the more important fundamental skills of Table Tennis. I read somewhere that it is a good idea for a player who wants to learn to use these kinds of rubbers for their game, not to do it until they have reached a certain level and have developed good strokes for all the basic shots of Table Tennis: pushes, chops, blocks, counter-hits, drive shots, loops and serves. And any good player should be able to do all these shots proficiently even if he specializes: an offensive player uses more offensive strokes; a defensive player uses the defensive strokes more. But you should be able to do all of them.

The higher level players who use these rubbers could use smooth rubber, because their technique is solid. However, it is also worth looking at the fact that, in the top 100 in the world there are very few pips players.

All this does not change the fact that using long pips and antispin as a training tool to help develop the skills of a player and to help them be able to deal with facing these kinds of rubbers is an excellent idea.

I think up to a certain level you can really lift your game using pips. It is true that in order to reach the world top you need a good allround game. But for example in national divisions (top competitions not counted) it can make a 2-3 classes difference to camouflage a weak side with pips and learn to use them well. For some people it means that their max level they can achieve can be raised using different material rubbers.

So I think pips can really improve someones level to where he/she wouldn't get with 2 smooth rubbers, but usually not up to world class level.

 

[UpSideDownCarl]

I think up to a certain level you can really lift your game using pips. It is true that in order to reach the world top you need a good allround game. But for example in national divisions (top competitions not counted) it can make a 2-3 classes difference to camouflage a weak side with pips and learn to use them well. For some people it means that their max level they can achieve can be raised using different material rubbers.

So I think pips can really improve someones level to where he/she wouldn't get with 2 smooth rubbers, but usually not up to world class level.

Yes, your "level" goes up but your skill in playing has not really changed. That is sort of what I am talking about. For some people that is fine. For me, I would rather my skill and abilities go up and I don't care about ranking.

I have seen some players who use pips develop some bad habits from the fact that the pips do a certain amount that does not have to do with them. Things like developing bad stroke habits or footwork habits, or receiving serve habits. And the area of receiving serves, their level goes up instantly and dramatically. They do not even really need to know much about what spin is coming at them to return serves. But their level goes up.

I do also know, it does take some skill to use those rubbers. It is not just a natural transition. So I don't want to downplay that. I am just saying that there is a potential for someone who uses pips or anti-spin, to not develop certain skills because all of a sudden they are seemingly playing at a higher level because of what the rubber does to the other person rather than it being so much about them playing at a "higher level" because of what they can now do.

In some of the videos that vietcongOX has posted in a few of the threads and above, you can see that the person who is using the pips is often awkward and clumsy and is winning points because they simply blocked the ball back without having good footwork or good positioning, or bent knees or their weight balanced.

All this being said, a good player is a good player.

 

[WiWa]

Yes, your "level" goes up but your skill in playing has not really changed. That is sort of what I am talking about. For some people that is fine. For me, I would rather my skill and abilities go up and I don't care about ranking.

I have seen some players who use pips develop some bad habits from the fact that the pips do a certain amount that does not have to do with them. Things like developing bad stroke habits or footwork habits, or receiving serve habits. And the area of receiving serves, their level goes up instantly and dramatically. They do not even really need to know much about what spin is coming at them to return serves. But their level goes up.

I do also know, it does take some skill to use those rubbers. It is not just a natural transition. So I don't want to downplay that. I am just saying that there is a potential for someone who uses pips or anti-spin, to not develop certain skills because all of a sudden they are seemingly playing at a higher level because of what the rubber does to the other person rather than it being so much about them playing at a "higher level" because of what they can now do.

In some of the videos that vietcongOX has posted in a few of the threads and above, you can see that the person who is using the pips is often awkward and clumsy and is winning points because they simply blocked the ball back without having good footwork or good positioning, or bent knees or their weight balanced.

All this being said, a good player is a good player.

I know what you mean, BUT

I agree that pips are used to compensate for example a weaker FH or BH. On higher levels it is not done to distract opponents or give crappy balls to them during the rally, but more like a help. If you are no good at FH looping, you can use short pips for 'slapping' if you are good at that. I think especially female players would benefit from it considering their playing style. This can actually reach a pretty high level and is very difficult to master.

I know that a lot of players 'abuse' the fact that their opponent isn't used to play against their materials and therefore lose, but there are certainly players who up their game because their skills with pips are better than with smooth rubbers. And with skills I mean for example long push or 'slapping'. It doesn't necessarily develop bad strokes, since u need proper technique to work with pips on a high level. But like I said, on lower levels it is 'abused' every now and then and on the highest level the skill of other players is almost impossible to match when u play with pips. But in between those levels is a very fair and good use of pips I think.

 

[UpSideDownCarl]

I know what you mean, BUT

I agree that pips are used to compensate for example a weaker FH or BH. On higher levels it is not done to distract opponents or give crappy balls to them during the rally, but more like a help. If you are no good at FH looping, you can use short pips for 'slapping' if you are good at that. I think especially female players would benefit from it considering their playing style. This can actually reach a pretty high level and is very difficult to master.

I know that a lot of players 'abuse' the fact that their opponent isn't used to play against their materials and therefore lose, but there are certainly players who up their game because their skills with pips are better than with smooth rubbers. And with skills I mean for example long push or 'slapping'. It doesn't necessarily develop bad strokes, since u need proper technique to work with pips on a high level. But like I said, on lower levels it is 'abused' every now and then and on the highest level the skill of other players is almost impossible to match when u play with pips. But in between those levels is a very fair and good use of pips I think.

I agree with you.

I do also know, it does take some skill to use those rubbers. It is not just a natural transition. So I don't want to downplay that.

And what I was talking to was the people who change to pips and in a very short time their "level" has gone up without them having to do the work.

I know enough people who can play with pips or without pips, and they can play multiple styles. They have one way they most like to play and that is their game, that is what they do when they are being serious or in tournaments but they can do everything. And a player who is good, who has good technique has good technique regardless of what kinds of rubbers he/she uses. And of course the technique for playing with long pips is different than with smooth rubber.

Learning to loop with a penhold grip has definitely improved my shakehand forehand. I am sure that learning to play with pips and learning good technique with pips would be valuable from a few perspectives for a modern offensive player. Learning to do some of the things that a pips player can do with their rubber might help an offensive player see certain things including technique and tactics.

And, I have said this in many places, I love practicing against long pips and anti-spin. This helps my game improve more than anything else I do. And I am comfortable admitting that I have a hard time against people with short pips. So if I got a chance to practice against short pips more often I would take it.

 

[azlan]

How true. I find that the lower ranking players who use these long pips rubbers have a problem whenever they proceed further in tournaments, coz they will be facing technically better players. These better players don't make silly mistakes, and since long pips players have restricted offensive options, they will find that it is difficult for them to earn points.

I believe that they may block looping topspins, but against fast speedy attack, with good placements, I don't think any human would be able to react that fast to block close to the table. It's humanly impossible.

 

[fongchengloy]

Long pips...it's either you love playing against them, or loathing it. Intermediate and novice players have torrid times facing them.
Here in Malaysia we have a serious problem in our hands. Pimple players who modified their rubbers, such as dunking them in gasoline and etc. Some even to great length in combining 2 different rubbers on 1 side. More often than not, they get away with it. I am utterly against these cheats. But, as long as the association does not act upon this, the cheats will continue to participate in the local tourneys. It's embarrassing to admit, but that's the truth.

Agreed with you (Azlan)/ I was also told that someone even place a piece of brand new Chinese short pimple in a rice cooker and steam it before applying glue and it works; the shots are weird and not uniform. Totally cheating.

 

[ttmonster]

I agree with you Carl , there are players who reach an USATT rating of 1900-2000 with pips and then get stuck there. My rating is currently a little bit over 1500 , probably I can play around 1750-1800 ...given how good I am on that day ... but I have beaten such players 3-0 just because I had a colleague with long pips and I have practised a considerable amount or time with him. With such practice the initial awkwardness with long pips goes and you kind of start to know the limitations of long pips. However, there are players at the USATT 2300 level who are very good with their long pips and have developed a lot of pips specific skills , like chop block off the bounce on loops etc which are pretty difficult to do and deal with ... so yes I guess its a mentality or approach to the game....but like the saying goes ... like you sow so you reap

 

[azlan]

Agreed with you (Azlan)/ I was also told that someone even place a piece of brand new Chinese short pimple in a rice cooker and steam it before applying glue and it works; the shots are weird and not uniform. Totally cheating.

That is new to me Fong. But it seems now, they're doing a clamp down on these illegal rubbers. Though, we are still a long way to create a system to abolish these illegal set ups once in for all.