Looking for a coach for an advanced chopper

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I wonder what prompted a 10-year-old child (who probably started even earlier) to play SP?
I guess the dad is an SP player.
SP Chopper and SP player (predominately attacking players) is quite different.

SP chopper has the advantage of add spin variations and can attack more.
 
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SP Chopper and SP player (predominately attacking players) is quite different.

SP chopper has the advantage of add spin variations and can attack more.
Yes, I know that, but: why on that age with SP? Why? Give me one good reason. Why do you let a child start SP? That's why I'm curious to know the answer. It’s only a simple question.
 
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Yes, I know that, but: why on that age with SP? Why? Give me one good reason. Why do you let a child start SP? That's why I'm curious to know the answer. It’s only a simple question.
its a good age to start? :)
 
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I didn’t ask for a question on my question. That’s not a reason.
I would be surprised if your position is not already known to @mamedium but you continue your campaign against pips with your argument that they are only used by players who cannot execute the correct technique as of it is impossible for a young player to want to play that style even if they have or could have had decent success with inverted.
 
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I would be surprised if your position is not already known to @mamedbut you continue your campaign against pips eith your argument that they are only used by players who cannot execute the correct technique as of it is impossible for a young player to want to play that style even if they have or could have had decent success with inverted.
Indeed, that’s true. I just wonder if she tried with inverters at an even younger age. Did she train long enough with regular rubbers? Who pushed the kid to start playing with SP. I suspect it is always forced on you by others. When you are that age, you can surely master all your strokes, both FH and BH with a regular rubber.
So don't you find that strange at that age? Because apparently she is good with SP, regardless of whether she is a defender or could also play offensively with it.
 
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Indeed, that’s true. I just wonder if she tried with inverters at an even younger age. Did she train long enough with regular rubbers? Who pushed the kid to start playing with SP. I suspect it is always forced on you by others. When you are that age, you can surely master all your strokes, both FH and BH with a regular rubber.
So don't you find that strange at that age? Because apparently she is good with SP, regardless of whether she is a defender or could also play offensively with it.
10 years old is the right age to be focusing on SP chopping - based on the Asian calendar of starting early.
in fact, even better is 8 years old.

There are of course many factors in play on why kids will start specific styles at a young age.
It could be parents, coach and more.
 
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10 years old is the right age to be focusing on SP chopping - based on the Asian calendar of starting early.
in fact, even better is 8 years old.

There are of course many factors in play on why kids will start specific styles at a young age.
It could be parents, coach and more.
Your last sentence is important to me. If she is already good with SP at the age of 10, she certainly started earlier. So the question remains, why did she start doing that. Who or what prompted her to abandon regular rubbers on her BH.
I think only the topic starter can answer this.
To be clear, I am not against SP/LP, I am just not in favour of it because I think anyone can achieve a VERY good level with regular rubbers and especially if you start at that age (or earlier).
 
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Your last sentence is important to me. If she is already good with SP at the age of 10, she certainly started earlier. So the question remains, why did she start doing that. Who or what prompted her to abandon regular rubbers on her BH.
I think only the topic starter can answer this.
To be clear, I am not against SP/LP, I am just not in favour of it because
to be honest, I don't think what ever the reason is applicable at all.
OP is asking about coaches, and its up to him if he wants to turn it into a Q&A session - you need to ask him those questions.

starting with SP or LP at 10 years old or younger is great.
many of the top choppers all start at ages younger than that.
choppers is very much part of table tennis and you don't have to start being 2 wing attackers.
chopping is an art, and if you have a coach that can teach you that, bonus.
I think anyone can achieve a VERY good level with regular rubbers and especially if you start at that age (or earlier).

there are 10s of thousands that start at a young age with inverted on both sides, and most of them fail.
Its only a few that makes it.
 
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Hi OP - I am a short pips chopper who trains with Li Jian and wanted to offer my testimonial / a few notes, because I found this post to be somewhat alarming at what likely is an important stage in your daughter's athletic development. I'm in part posting all this because I am fairly sure I've seen you and your daughter at training and as such you are part of our community.

For context, I started table tennis 10 months ago (rated at 700 in my first tournament), and have progressed up to a 1900 level under Jian's guidance and have a decent chance at breaking 2000 in under a year of playing. I can assure you with regards to short pips defence that two things are true:

1. As a player, Jian would be above 2500 using short pips tomorrow with no training (I have played against him with them on, he openly admits to chopping better with them than long pips but cannot adjust to minor tempo differences versus his normal game).
2. As a coach, he almost certainly knows more than any short pips chopper you will meet about development of this type of player including most at the professional level - this is likely because he has direct interaction with + access to the best players in the world using this style and talks with them often (e.g. Hou Yingchao). He not only understands the techniques for / nuances of the most difficult shots with the rubber, but also the expected sequences stemming from those shots and the appropriate tempo/footwork. It bears highlighting that he was not only a Chinese provincial team player, but actually a provincial team coach and may actually be a stronger coach than player.

I am as such relatively stunned that you would be trying to find someone else when you have a coach who would be the envy of, for example, many top European and even native Asian juniors wanting to pursue this style.

More importantly - and I could be misinterpreting something you said, but this was what I took away from it - your daughter's rating/ranking at this age and trying to find various people who can give little tips to help her progress against 1500-2000 rated players is misguided and perhaps irrelevant. I think this is really important to understand and I'm speaking from experience here: since age 8, I was top 5-10 in the country in my age group up to u19 for a racket sport (not table tennis) and was fully recruited to a strong school for this sport, and watched many players succeed up to the professional level and also watched many fail to become professionals - including, ultimately, myself. There were two and only two large determining factors predictive of success at a very young age: a very strong base of technique and footwork, and continued passion + enthusiasm for the sport. Winning or finding ways to win does not matter at this age nearly as much as having a kid who learns the right way and most importantly enjoys table tennis and will continue to do so. I have seen so many "winners" at the age of 11 go by the wayside by age 16 because they neglected technical development in favor of finding little ways to win in ultimately insignificant junior tournaments. So please think to prioritize those two things above all when selecting a coach. That is a really high bar and a coach who is a peak 2200 or below player probably won't cut it.

I obviously respect if it's just the case that this particular coach is not the right fit for your daughter (e.g. communication differences, totally valid), but I wanted to outline the above principles so you don't waste your time going in an unproductive direction. As an aside, I am more than happy to hit with your daughter for a bit or talk to you in person (if you mention my rating and playstyle to Jian, he will know who you're talking about and reach out to me). All the best.
Hi AuxPicotsCourts,

Many thanks for your detailed and thoughtful advices.

To be honest, I don't mean to find a replacement for Jian. He is excellent as a player and as a coach, my daughter has learned a lot from him and definitely still can learn more from him. However, over the recent months leading to my post, I observed some diminishing progresses. This is not due to his ability to coach. (I would speculate that it is more a question of coaching emphasis.) And here comes the challenging part: a high caliber coach like Jian is that we(my daughter and I) can only take it or leave it, because, for him, I don't know anything about table tennis and any of my occasional opinion regarding where the emphasis should be put is not welcome, whereas my daughter of course is too young for any opinion. Consequently, we would have to adapt to this situation. This leads us to search some coach(es) to supplement Jian's emphasis.

I was hesitating a lot before I chose this solution. I could choose to follow Jian's coaching blindly, but I would run the risk of finding out one day that we missed a big part or headed in the wrong direction and by then my daughter would have passed her best age. If this happened, I would have no one but myself to blame.

As Jian is already an expert in LP, we would like to be exposed to a coach who masters some unique new techniques in short pips (chopper/attacker style).

Thanks for the friendly invitation. I would love for Zoe to meet and play some table tennis with you. We are at WTTC on Sundays' afternoon if there is no tournament.

Cheers!
 
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Your last sentence is important to me. If she is already good with SP at the age of 10, she certainly started earlier. So the question remains, why did she start doing that. Who or what prompted her to abandon regular rubbers on her BH.
I think only the topic starter can answer this.
To be clear, I am not against SP/LP, I am just not in favour of it because I think anyone can achieve a VERY good level with regular rubbers and especially if you start at that age (or earlier).
My daughter started with inverted rubber for 8 months then switched to LP for 4 months and finally switched to SP. She seems to like it since then and we just loved the chopping style... :)
 
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My daughter started with inverted rubber for 8 months then switched to LP for 4 months and finally switched to SP. She seems to like it since then and we just loved the chopping style... :)
Enjoyment is the most important thing. And the great thing is that your daughter is still young so she can grow into any equipment, really. She should have fun and develop her own style over time including how she likes to mix attacking v.s. chopping. Let her explore! :)
 
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I was hesitating a lot before I chose this solution. I could choose to follow Jian's coaching blindly, but I would run the risk of finding out one day that we missed a big part or headed in the wrong direction and by then my daughter would have passed her best age. If this happened, I would have no one but myself to blame.

I think another option is finding out other choppers and find out who they coaches are and go that route.
 
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If you are in the NY/NJ and are already taking lessons with Li Jian, then stick with him. He might use LP when he plays but of course he understands how to play and use SP. If you want your kid to improve faster, then play more hours everyday until they are playing 8 hours a day, 6 days a week.

If you want to ruin your child's progress, then hire some random 2000-2500 player who uses short pips. I guarantee they will know less about SP than Li Jian. The only other coaches who might be at the same level of Li Jian are Wang Wei or Li KeWei but they are in CA/TX respectively.

Stick with the same coach, increase the hours of practice.
 
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