Simon Gauzy was right or wrong in that point?

[Tony's Table Tennis]

No, that's stupid. This is the type of situation I'm referring to that is possible. The curve is a bit exaggerated, but I think you get the point.

View attachment 29366

I'm glad you agree the whole thing is stupid.

you saw the ball curve outside the table??
it was a straight line where the ball was only outside the white line of the table moments before contact.
your diagram showed it curve around the net post, it obviously didn't happen.

I'm still waiting for someone to show me how to curve back in, since there is no distance, no flight and all this in fast pace.
with a frisbee, maybe yes, but you still need a flight to curve.
I like to see it with a table tennis 40+ ball.
until then, its stupid indeed

 

[ShoutGuy]

The ball would cross over the net, not around it.

If the ball would go over the net, it would be impossible for the ball to only hit the side of the table IMHO

 

[Lazer]

If the ball would go over the net, it would be impossible for the ball to only hit the side of the table IMHO

Not if it is at the same time curving OUTSIDE of the table, if not I agree,
This is difficult to see from the umpires angle.

Cheers
L-zr

 

[Tony's Table Tennis]

Not if it is at the same time curving OUTSIDE of the table, if not I agree,
This is difficult to see from the umpires angle.

Cheers
L-zr

based on video evidence, there was not enough distance to do such.
the ball at most was travelling around the white line mark when it went past the net.

It was a faint edge, so the ball drops after contact the edge.

The amateur circuit has a rule that drop down out, bounce up in.
But if you hit from inside the table, and drops out, it is in (edge ball).
Some how, logic is different when on international scene....

 

[Metaxa]

I have a hard time to understand why, in this type of situation, they don't simply replay the point.

If the umpire is not sure and the players are confused as well.. replay the point like we do in our amateur leagues.

It is not allowed. You are playing ping pong? No table tennis?

 

[Metaxa]

Movement of his racket, hand, arm and the curve of the ball shows that the ball hit the rim but, the ball in my opinion does not jump back up but falls down, there was slight forward effect in it. In my view, the ball did hit the side but since there was no upward movement of the ball, no touch ball.

 

[dingyibvs]

I'm glad you agree the whole thing is stupid.

you saw the ball curve outside the table??
it was a straight line where the ball was only outside the white line of the table moments before contact.
your diagram showed it curve around the net post, it obviously didn't happen.

I'm still waiting for someone to show me how to curve back in, since there is no distance, no flight and all this in fast pace.
with a frisbee, maybe yes, but you still need a flight to curve.
I like to see it with a table tennis 40+ ball.
until then, its stupid indeed

My diagram is a bit exaggerated, the ball goes over, not around the net. It would be something more like this:

I stated pretty clearly that I think this was an edge, not a side. But the way I read the OP's question is if it's possible to hit the side when the ball is struck from the position it was struck. My answer to that is that it should be possible. In this specific case, with the way El-Beiali hit the ball, however, that's not possible. It was a bad demand from Gauzy and a bad call from the umpire.

It was perhaps hard for the umpire to see from her angle, but Gauzy should've known. He should've known that with the stroke El-Beiali used that it's impossible to create enough sidespin to make that ball hit the side. In fact, if anything El-Beiali's shot would've contributed to the opposite sidespin, and we see that in action as his sidespin cancels out Gauzy's sidespin service to create a pretty straight ball.

 

[longle]

very hard to decide, even if I was Simon I could not tell whether it's edged or not

 

[blahness]

Clear edge. Not sure why but the umpires were blind.

 

[Loop Lob Smash]

Not even Wang Liqin can curve the ball that much!

 

[Lazer]

Clear edge. Not sure why but the umpires were blind.

The umpire don't see things as clear as the players...

And since these things can always happen it is better as a player to eat it and let go rather than bringing Yourself to an emotional unbalanced state...

The umpires are humans too...

Cheers
L-zr

 

[Metaxa]

Clear edge. Not sure why but the umpires were blind.

No it is not clear. It is not because the ball hits the table that it is also edge. As far as I can see from that angle, that ball does not jump up at all but falls down from the side of the table (point of contact is on the right side of the ball). You can only speak of an edge ball if that ball makes an upward movement and I don't think that is the case here.

 

[Tony's Table Tennis]

In Chuang’s instant
The umpire called sides (so admit to contact)

I would love these genius umpires to be part of post match interviews

 

[dingyibvs]

Clear edge. Not sure why but the umpires were blind.

To be fair, from the umpire's angle it's hard to see a ball's left-right movement. We get the benefit of seeing it from an easier angle.

No it is not clear. It is not because the ball hits the table that it is also edge. As far as I can see from that angle, that ball does not jump up at all but falls down from the side of the table (point of contact is on the right side of the ball). You can only speak of an edge ball if that ball makes an upward movement and I don't think that is the case here.

From our angle it's pretty clear. The ball was pretty straight, it was hit from within the side boundaries of the table, so it can't be a side. I think you're thinking about a ball hit from outside the boundaries of the table. In that instance, if the ball doesn't bounce up then it's probably a side.

 

[Tony's Table Tennis]

The umpire don't see things as clear as the players...

And since these things can always happen it is better as a player to eat it and let go rather than bringing Yourself to an emotional unbalanced state...

The umpires are humans too...

Cheers
L-zr

yes, they are humans, just with a lot of powers and make the same mistake over and over and over again.
we should be greatful and stop moaning, because they are using digital scoreboards now, to keep up with the technology trend and no, other sports have no advance technology and we have improved based on our umpires from this video:

 

[Tony's Table Tennis]

To be fair, from the umpire's angle it's hard to see a ball's left-right movement. We get the benefit of seeing it from an easier angle.


From our angle it's pretty clear. The ball was pretty straight, it was hit from within the side boundaries of the table, so it can't be a side. I think you're thinking about a ball hit from outside the boundaries of the table. In that instance, if the ball doesn't bounce up then it's probably a side.

umpires should be able to see and hear the sound.
the trajectory of the ball was affected, so that confirms contact.

the first thing you should judge is the flight of the ball and from there to judge evidence of up and in, or down and out.
With the trajectory, you can decide if the up or down factor comes into play.

If an umpire is not skilled enough to judge contact,
or makes the wrong call,
then such umpire should only be in feeder events.

some times umpires should listen and then question themselves and maybe even make corrections to their own call.
but, a lot of times, umpires won't get demerit for making wrong calls, so why even bother showing the world their made a mistake, since no one will question them in media interviews post match.

 

[Tony's Table Tennis]

My diagram is a bit exaggerated, the ball goes over, not around the net. It would be something more like this:

yes, your first diagram is the same level as the bird diagram and that is what Chuang's umpire said would happen.
So stupid as you say, does exist out there.

View attachment 29375

I stated pretty clearly that I think this was an edge, not a side. But the way I read the OP's question is if it's possible to hit the side when the ball is struck from the position it was struck. My answer to that is that it should be possible.

In theory, it is possible, but practically, you need to be far from the table, and give flight and swing. It needs a lot of space and time to curve the ball.
Chuang's example was mid rally, but he was from center of the table.
OP's example is a dead at the table, service return. but he was from BH corner.
Both examples, the ball did not go around the net, and it was a top down approach and not left to right approach.

There is no space to do it. One will need harry potter magic to do it.
and Chuang's umpire admitted it touch, and it was side.
The same umpire probably believes in the tooth fairy too.

 

[Table-Tennis-All]

Imagine if they invested in Hawk-Eye technology instead of WTT. So many years of side/edge + illegal service controversies and nothing has improved. What a joke.

Totally agree with your idea

 

[Metaxa]

Eerlijk gezegd is het vanuit de hoek van de scheidsrechter moeilijk om de links-rechtsbeweging van een bal te zien. We hebben het voordeel dat we vanuit een praktische hoek kunnen bekijken.


Vanuit onze hoek is het vrij duidelijk. De bal was behoorlijk recht, hij werd getroffen binnen de zijgrenzen van de tafel, dus het kan geen kant zijn. Ik denk dat je denkt dat een bal die van buiten de grenzen van de tafel wordt geraakt. Als het geval niet omhoog stuitert, is het waarschijnlijk een kant.

Nee, niet van buiten de tafel. Van binnenuit de tafelafmetingen.
1°) Simplistische weergave van wat we zagen.

Zoals ik hierboven schreef, raakte de bal de tafel, maar springt niet meer omhoog en valt gewoon naar beneden vanwege de zwaartekracht (en/of effect).

2°) De bal raakt echt de hoek van de tafel en springt omhoog.

Ik denk niet dat we situatie 1° vanuit onze ooghoeken kunnen beoordelen, maar de scheidsrechter aan de zijkant heeft dit misschien wel gezien. Hij had de bal op het contactpunt om openspringen te zien. Als dit niet het geval is, is er sprake van een situatie 1° en dus deze kant, dus punt voor Simon.

 

[backspacer]

Totally agree with your idea

The hawkeye is coming. There are no details yet though as to when and which events will feature it.