What is the technical reason Ma Long and top pros love W968?

[Vrael]

Even bigger head than normal w968? As expected of Korean Ma Long. Havent seen him do a forehand he couldn't hit.

I didn't play with any other w968, from quick search the head size is the same(161mm length), which is longer than bty liu shiwen, korbel etc

 

[Gozo Aruna]

The is all of us. We all are... we all are...

 

[rbtitco]

Even this one, half viscaria, half w968

He's right. Theres code W968-9. Fh inner DHS ALC and butterfly ALC bh. CNT custom blade.

 

[TensorBackhand]

He's right. Theres code W968-9. Fh inner DHS ALC and butterfly ALC bh. CNT custom blade.

That sounds pretty cool. Who was it made for?

What is difference dhs and bty alc?

How about those blades with inner carbon and outer carbon on opposite sides? Do those play well?

 

[rbtitco]

That sounds pretty cool. Who was it made for?

What is difference dhs and bty alc?

How about those blades with inner carbon and outer carbon on opposite sides? Do those play well?

The one I saw was made for CNT player, but this stuff is all questionable and you really have to personally know everyone involved to buy something like that....I've never played those ice cream type blades, but heard some feedback that they do not truly play like 2 different blades, probably because the core being either kiri or ayous and that screws up one of the sides. I know the colors are different on the different company's ALC fibers and there's a slightly different feel, but I can't say what's in them or why, maybe other people here know about that.

 

[TensorBackhand]

The one I saw was made for CNT player, but this stuff is all questionable and you really have to personally know everyone involved to buy something like that....I've never played those ice cream type blades, but heard some feedback that they do not truly play like 2 different blades, probably because the core being either kiri or ayous and that screws up one of the sides. I know the colors are different on the different company's ALC fibers and there's a slightly different feel, but I can't say what's in them or why, maybe other people here know about that.

Ive always felt butterfly blades feel stiffer than dhs. But i dont know if its because of the blue alc

 

[Scarfed Garchomp]

Ive always felt butterfly blades feel stiffer than dhs. But i dont know if its because of the blue alc

DHS blades have larger surfaces with a longer designed headshape, there's just more blade to flex that way

 

[andzejgolot]

I want to see multiball of TB just to judge how to help him and of course laugh...
I remember one batch from commercial DHS Long 5.....
Slow, very hard and the spinniest blade I ever had with my rubber of choice Fastarc G1 which was used on every blades...but the equipment requires from myself a lot of strenght and the spin sensivity was high too. For me IT looks like someone put wrong alc from National to commercial but nevermind...So Ma Long blade would be hard but after full swing penetration IT would be soft.
Hard slow blade= grip

That's why players use slower blades
Hard slow blades are dead
National rubbers are bouncy because it has fabricated Booster
I received national Japanese dignics( The white package if you didnt watch Adrianna Diaz stories on Instagram you dont know Sh*)
And the funny part of rubber was
- bouncy
- not very spinny
- super topsheet quality
- short sponge lifespan
The tension between topsheet and sponge was enormous but after 3 weeks the rubber requires booster that's why yall dont need National rubber from anybody because their sponges are fragile. Topsheet after 9 months looks like brand new but sponge... lack of bounce... their process of National players is gluing playing another one and didnt even compare/ combine
...
That's why yall shouldnt compare anything from Ma long equipment to some opinion

 

[banbekas]

I'd assume because of how dead it is at low impact, touc shots. As you can see, I'm using Pro 05 which is supposedly similar to 968 or its siblings, Q and S. and I can say I appreciate the touch game of this blade. At the same time, it's able to spin the ball so well with incredible control and yet still more than enough power to end the point on the forehand.
Viscaria and Pro 01 are awesome too but their touch is a bit harder to control and it feels like it's harder and it doesn't spin as good as Pro 05. It really is better for player looking for quick backhand attack. Of course I'm not saying that Viscaria and Pro 05 are bad in terms of backhand and forehand, it's just how I feel it. Who knows, maybe ma long shares similar opinion as mine?

 

[Tony's Table Tennis]

I'd assume because of how dead it is at low impact, touc shots. As you can see, I'm using Pro 05 which is supposedly similar to 968 or its siblings, Q and S. and I can say I appreciate the touch game of this blade. At the same time, it's able to spin the ball so well with incredible control and yet still more than enough power to end the point on the forehand.
Viscaria and Pro 01 are awesome too but their touch is a bit harder to control and it feels like it's harder and it doesn't spin as good as Pro 05. It really is better for player looking for quick backhand attack. Of course I'm not saying that Viscaria and Pro 05 are bad in terms of backhand and forehand, it's just how I feel it. Who knows, maybe ma long shares similar opinion as mine?

how equipment works is, its all paring and then zone positions when hitting the ball
TB will never talk about zones, because he doesn't play all the zones

fast or speed is all relative to the pairing, zone and level of opponent (ie incoming ball speed and spin).

for someone who is complete, like the Ma Long's of the world that TB is trying to figure out, all have technique first and thousands of level points over him.
granted, TB level very near Harimoto's 1800.

Back to zones and speed, if the ball is coming at a snail pace, no matter what "speed" blade he uses, the speed after contact with be very minimal when he is standing far away from the table.

So, it is very difficult to talk speed, TB himself have acknowledge it so many times, but he is too stuck with measuring blades based on the word speed.

you can have a blade that is fast by the table, and slow away from the table and vice versa.
its all relative to the context and until one really test all those variables, the quality of conclusion will always open room for scrutiny.

W968 is pretty fast, and even some times too fast from some pros.

 

[Migzkulit]

how equipment works is, its all paring and then zone positions when hitting the ball
TB will never talk about zones, because he doesn't play all the zones

fast or speed is all relative to the pairing, zone and level of opponent (ie incoming ball speed and spin).

for someone who is complete, like the Ma Long's of the world that TB is trying to figure out, all have technique first and thousands of level points over him.
granted, TB level very near Harimoto's 1800.

Back to zones and speed, if the ball is coming at a snail pace, no matter what "speed" blade he uses, the speed after contact with be very minimal when he is standing far away from the table.

So, it is very difficult to talk speed, TB himself have acknowledge it so many times, but he is too stuck with measuring blades based on the word speed.

you can have a blade that is fast by the table, and slow away from the table and vice versa.
its all relative to the context and until one really test all those variables, the quality of conclusion will always open room for scrutiny.

W968 is pretty fast, and even some times too fast from some pros.

Heck I'm scared to see how much faster w968 numbers is to w968 provincial, but I will likely end up trying a q968 national or letters eventually. Despite the weight being 196g on my w968 letters, it feels agile.

Zone 1 - Close to table, Zone 2 - Mid Distance, Zone 3 - Away from table (lobbing distance)
That's how it was presented to me. Many inner carbons excel in Zone 1-2. Outer carbons, mostly Zone 1.5 to 2.5.
The w968 has more power that it works better comparatively to HL5 at Zone 3.

 

[Tony's Table Tennis]

Heck I'm scared to see how much faster w968 numbers is to w968 provincial, but I will likely end up trying a q968 national or letters eventually. Despite the weight being 196g on my w968 letters, it feels agile.

Zone 1 - Close to table, Zone 2 - Mid Distance, Zone 3 - Away from table (lobbing distance)
That's how it was presented to me. Many inner carbons excel in Zone 1-2. Outer carbons, mostly Zone 1.5 to 2.5.
The w968 has more power that it works better comparatively to HL5 at Zone 3.

I use Yinhe Pro 02, or Viscaria now.
I tried Super Viscaria and a couple of ZLC samples, it was way too fast for me.

for me, it is always a balance of the kick, the spin, the arc and the control.
Its silly to just use/rate one of them to decide the blade.

I rallied with some OB players recently at a new center I'm trying to help out at by raising club numbers by me being there.
The player said when they block my incoming balls, their racket vibrates due to the force and they haven't felt it before.
They said the kick after the ball landed on there side of the table is so fast, they can't see it (this is a trait of H3 rubbers) and then upon contact on the racket, the vibration after vibration does feel discomfortable.
The H3 i am using is long past its sell by date, so the spin ratio is way lower too than normal and I was probably only using 60% power on those shots.

I will probably say, TB will feel the same thing when really strong shots come into the scenery with even me or Ma Long using allround 5 ply blades.

For most of my younger playing career, I used Yasaka Extra and from there to YEO and the equivalent in Stiga and now ALC carbon during the 40+ era only.

 

[rbtitco]

Heck I'm scared to see how much faster w968 numbers is to w968 provincial, but I will likely end up trying a q968 national or letters eventually. Despite the weight being 196g on my w968 letters, it feels agile.

Zone 1 - Close to table, Zone 2 - Mid Distance, Zone 3 - Away from table (lobbing distance)
That's how it was presented to me. Many inner carbons excel in Zone 1-2. Outer carbons, mostly Zone 1.5 to 2.5.
The w968 has more power that it works better comparatively to HL5 at Zone 3.

They're not that far off, the law of diminishing returns starts setting in when u try the numbers blade. The one I tried might have felt a bit more clear, but it was kind of splitting hairs. To me, they felt pretty close.

 

[Marc]

What is the technical reason Ma Long and top pros love W968?

I suspect the answer unfortunately isn't simple and I don't claim to have all the answers but I recently played with a DHS301 and Long 5 and would like to share some information that might help answer this question.

I'd like to start by sharing my post and the reply I received below on the TTGearlab.com website which I think is great by the way.

Hello,

Your graph shows the H301 being faster than the long 5 (both versions).

I also saw two popular online stores with ratings that say the long 5 is faster.

Please let me know what you think.

Thank you.

Reply
TTGearLab
November 18, 2024 at 02:05
What the Performance Indices show is pure elasticity of blade. H301 is more elastic than HL5. That is mainly because of its harder Koto top layer.

However, in table tennis the more elastic blade can’t always make the faster ball. Elasticity does affect the speed of ball, but that isn’t everything that decides the speed.

If the player attaches fast rubbers and play mainly with smash, H301 will be faster than HL5. However, topspin is more related with the characteristics of rubber. And, sometimes less elastic blade can make faster ball than more elastic blade because it can utilize the ability of rubber more effectively. Of course the result differs by player and combination.

And, that is the reason why I value Ec/Ep over the single values of Ec or Ep. The player can easily ‘adjust’ the impact to suit the difference in elasticity. But, if the Ec/Ep of the new blade is much different from that of old blade, the adjustment is not easy.
_-----------------_-----------------------------------------------------

Note: I know the W968 isn't in this TTgearlab write up or graphs but I suspect the Long 5, 2022 current model is close enough for a relative comparison to let's say the Viscaria on the far right of the graph with high elasticity.

Based on that response where he/she said "sometimes less elastic blade can make faster ball than more elastic blade because it can utilize the ability of rubber more effectively," I think part of the reason is that Ma Long simply prefers less elastic Limba outer surface blades since that's what he's used to and is comfortable with.

I think the less elastic blade with Limba helps to get the most out the Chinese rubbers when someone prefers brushing and looping the ball from years of playing with blades similar to the Acoustic MaLong used previously, my daily blade, where it encourages this style since it's a strength of that blade.

Dan said
using a Chinese rubber you have to brush the ball more to produce the spin and accuracy on the table. Whereas a Euro rubber you can go more forward and the rubber naturally grabs the ball producing spin as you contact. This is what I have found when I go from a Japanese rubber to a Chinese Tacky rubber.

Oh no, this is probably to long.

Hopefully this helps us work towards the answer.

Source

DHS Hurricane 301 series [Lab Test Report]

Table of Contents1. Overview2. Performance Indices3. Comparison by Performance Indices……. 3-1. Elasticity Indices……. 3-2. Vibration Indices4. Summary DHS ‘Hurricane 30…

ttgearlab.com

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