Daily Table Tennis Chit Chat

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More brilliantly fake than the Bruce Lee video! ;)

I didn't make it, but I will say thanks in stead of the guy who did. I Was basically messing around on another forum on April Fools day about switching to short pips, and then the guy just links to this footage of me playing with Zhang Jike that just made everyone's day.
 
says Spin and more spin.
says Spin and more spin.
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Says the rich man!

Us poor guys got to get into the trenches and gut it out with the common folk :)

It is worth understanding that, someone who makes $30.00 an hour at a job when a standard work week likely makes a lot more than a coach who charges $60.00 an hour and has to rely on clients who mostly can take lessons when they are not working or when their children are not in school.

So, it is true, not everyone can afford coaching. In a way it is a luxury service. But if you think about it, those great coaches who really worked amazingly hard to amass the TT skillz they have, why should they be forced to live on the fringe of poverty to offer their services for a price that is less than a meal for two at a decent restaurant?

I have been shopping for my family for the past year+ because, these days, I am the only one who can. Twice a week I shop. A small shop at the Park Slope Food Coop, which is one of the least expensive places to shop in NYC, comes to about $80.00. A normal sized shop, for 3 people is usually about $120.00. In a week, I spend about $250.00-$300.00 on groceries.

One lesson is not even enough for the honored and esteemed coach to get food for his family for two days. How is coachie supposed to pay rent?

With my clients, I do have a sliding scale. I have taught people for as little as $30.00 because I knew they really needed my help. But truthfully, these days I am way too busy for that.

When you legitimately can't afford coaching there are ways around it where you figure out how to train and people to train with where you can work on things that will help your progress.

Guys like Michael Landers, Mark Croitoroo, Paul David, Matthew Khan, Matthew Suchy and Rocky Wang have all showed me a bunch of things for me to work on with training partners. And guys like Paul, Mike and Mark have all been kind enough to barter what I do for what they do.

There are ways around it. But the point I am trying to make is that, if anything, these guys deserve more than what they get. And think about what I said about playing guys worse than me. That is an unavoidable part of their job.

[Edit: I do know your are joking about. But it is worth understanding how valuable these guys' time is.]


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It is worth understanding that, someone who makes $30.00 an hour at a job when a standard work week likely makes a lot more than a coach who charges $60.00 an hour and has to rely on clients who mostly can take lessons when they are not working or when their children are not in school.

So, it is true, not everyone can afford coaching. In a way it is a luxury service. But if you think about it, those great coaches who really worked amazingly hard to amass the TT skillz they have, why should they be forced to live on the fringe of poverty to offer their services for a price that is less than a meal for two at a decent restaurant?

I have been shopping for my family for the past year+ because, these days, I am the only one who can. Twice a week I shop. A small shop at the Park Slope Food Coop, which is one of the least expensive places to shop in NYC, comes to about $80.00. A normal sized shop, for 3 people is usually about $120.00. In a week, I spend about $250.00-$300.00 on groceries.

One lesson is not even enough for the honored and esteemed coach to get food for his family for two days. How is coachie supposed to pay rent?

With my clients, I do have a sliding scale. I have taught people for as little as $30.00 because I knew they really needed my help. But truthfully, these days I am way too busy for that.

When you legitimately can't afford coaching there are ways around it where you figure out how to train and people to train with where you can work on things that will help your progress.

Guys like Michael Landers, Mark Croitoroo, Paul David, Matthew Khan, Matthew Suchy and Rocky Wang have all showed me a bunch of things for me to work on with training partners. And guys like Paul, Mike and Mark have all been kind enough to barter what I do for what they do.

There are ways around it. But the point I am trying to make is that, if anything, these guys deserve more than what they get. And think about what I said about playing guys worse than me. That is an unavoidable part of their job.


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Those coaches need to move out of NY city...
 
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In sweden its called a "Stilleben".. [emoji7]
c0b94668b02e79b2b75d968e41378fcd.jpg
 
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Carl,

Agree with what you posted (as well as NL lol) ... however, for me ...

All players have different priorities/focuses... although I want to improve, i'm mainly into TT at this stage of my life for exercise. Add in that the first of our 3 children just started college and she went away ... dorm and meals are killing us (25k a semester, 50k a year, 200k for 4 yrs --- UGH). We also are house-hunting. Will $60 a week here and there or even 1-3x a wk kill us, probably not, but Mrs OSPH is watching expenses like a hawk and we've always sacrificed our desires for our 3 kids and their futures.

Can i barter with some coaches? Sadly, i got nothing to barter with, the 'best' thing i got is my TT and that is subpar at best ... LOL at me. No disrespect to the TT Coaches, but at some point during their 'career', they must've realized there's no money in TT no matter how talented/skilled/great a coach they are.
 
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Carl, agree with you on the wages part, I am not saying they should charge less but for the money they can give more ... and once you become a coach you pretty much give up the choice of whether you want to play somebody lower than you or not , kind of like a doctor, a sick person should be a sick person , rich or poor ...
It is worth understanding that, someone who makes $30.00 an hour at a job when a standard work week likely makes a lot more than a coach who charges $60.00 an hour and has to rely on clients who mostly can take lessons when they are not working or when their children are not in school.

So, it is true, not everyone can afford coaching. In a way it is a luxury service. But if you think about it, those great coaches who really worked amazingly hard to amass the TT skillz they have, why should they be forced to live on the fringe of poverty to offer their services for a price that is less than a meal for two at a decent restaurant?

I have been shopping for my family for the past year+ because, these days, I am the only one who can. Twice a week I shop. A small shop at the Park Slope Food Coop, which is one of the least expensive places to shop in NYC, comes to about $80.00. A normal sized shop, for 3 people is usually about $120.00. In a week, I spend about $250.00-$300.00 on groceries.

One lesson is not even enough for the honored and esteemed coach to get food for his family for two days. How is coachie supposed to pay rent?

With my clients, I do have a sliding scale. I have taught people for as little as $30.00 because I knew they really needed my help. But truthfully, these days I am way too busy for that.

When you legitimately can't afford coaching there are ways around it where you figure out how to train and people to train with where you can work on things that will help your progress.

Guys like Michael Landers, Mark Croitoroo, Paul David, Matthew Khan, Matthew Suchy and Rocky Wang have all showed me a bunch of things for me to work on with training partners. And guys like Paul, Mike and Mark have all been kind enough to barter what I do for what they do.

There are ways around it. But the point I am trying to make is that, if anything, these guys deserve more than what they get. And think about what I said about playing guys worse than me. That is an unavoidable part of their job.


Sent from the Subterranean Workshop by Telepathy
 
says Spin and more spin.
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Yep:

@ Monster: yes. What I do is different. And there are guys who are coaches who are sheisters. Who will scam you and are not trying to teach you.

If you are taking coaching, you do need to be an educated consumer and find a coach who can TEACH YOU what YOU NEED. A guy who is a REALLY good coach should be able to coach any level IN THEORY. But that is rare. And NextLevel has made great posts about how certain guys who don't look great can be a great coach for an adult learner.

That process is still the same, a guy who can get you from where you are to being able to do things you were not able to do so you improve is a good teacher for you in this sport.

Not all coaches are looking to do that. But a good coach will. It is sad that these guys have to hustle to get by. But an educated consumer learns how to avoid the charlatans.

@ OldSchool. We are in similar boats. I can't afford much of anything aside from health insurance and the $$ to pay for dr bills to take care of my wife at this point. But just because I catch my play, my fitness and my fun however I can, it is worth respecting the coaches who are real deal.

I liked your phrase: Iron sharpens Iron. The real guys are going to help people sharpen.

For us, we catch our training any way we can.

"My style is no style is no style." --Bruce Lee


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You guys are completely stupid dumbs. Way wrong about paying for lessons. Look at Archosaurus and his first 6 months on the forum. Prior to any lessons, he was a chinese super league level player. And then as soon as he posts video to get some advice, his skill level dropped immensly!

Never get a lesson= Save money and be Super Good.
Get Lessons= Spend money, and be worse.


Should add something constructive:

the rates aren't expensive compared to other sports sure. Especially if you're paying for a child that will develop quickly and ingrain that muscle memory for life. They'll be able to play the rest of their lives if they get coached early on. Adults getting lessons is a different story, develop much slower so if the coach teaches them the same way they teach others then that's wasted money. That's why NL would make a good coach for adults. He got to what a late starter would consider a very high level, and he was a late starter himself. Most other coaches at that level or higher actually developed correctly at a younger age, and they teach the way they were taught.
 
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says Spin and more spin.
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And that is where the teaching definition I gave comes into play, if the coach, if the teacher, isn't doing the problem solving of what will get YOU, whoever you are, from what you don't understand or can't do, to understanding it and being able to do it, he is not actually teaching. So, Ideally, you want to find a coach who can do that for you.


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says what [IMG]
@Shuki

Quite the way to think about it. Clearly the advice given here has been but a detriment to my game! I should probably stop asking for advice lest my game get worse... :rolleyes:



Today, or well, yesterday, (My sleeping/waking hours are screwed up right now) I did some drills with the guy I usually play against in the videos.

I had basically not slept and wasn't in my best form myself, but I could move well enough for near-top performance. He was getting tired and inconsistent.

Somehow up to now I hadn't really understood that there's a 5+ or so level difference between us. I'd just kept taking him to 8 or 9 points, sometimes 10 without any thought, but now when I tested him a bit, he fell apart. We did some drills but the level difference was too apparent here for me to put some effort in and have him not miss, so I decided I could teach him to feed multiball and do some falkenberg.

I fed him some, and he sucked initially which is understandable, mostly because my feed is pretty bad anyway, but I quickly made my feed more tight and he started hitting balls at a good pace.

He picked up the basic technique of feeding very fast, but I think his ball control in general is not good enough for a tight feed. I had to deal with net balls, balls short on the table, balls very deep, first ball coming off the backhand sideline etc.

They were flying everywhere: up, down, left, right, in my face, into my left rib, off wide. I told him to slow down a tad, and it tightened up a little, but it didn't get much better. I had maybe a 67% success rate in looping them, but that's pretty good with what kind of inconsistency I had to deal with I guess. For one it really trained moving to the ball with my legs first because I really had to move to get to half of them and I didn't know where the hell they were gonna end up. Lately I've been feeling a difference between *really* moving to the ball legs first, and between kinda moving but reaching. More of this should help make the feelings more apparent.

What are some things I could tell him or show him to get his multiball feed more consistent? Mainly he can't place the shots consistently laterally, and his feed gets shorter as we go on. I told him to apply a bit more power to the 2nd and 3rd ball and that helped a bit. But there could be something more I can do. I told him to stand on the side of the table and bounce the ball first and he did get the basic idea down in the first few balls, we just didn't practice it for more than an hour or so.
 
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And that is where the teaching definition I gave comes into play, if the coach, if the teacher, isn't doing the problem solving of what will get YOU, whoever you are, from what you don't understand or can't do, to understanding it and being able to do it, he is not actually teaching. So, Ideally, you want to find a coach who can do that for you.


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For instance, when you explain things over the Internet to me. You know that I'm a bad learner through reading as my mind will wander or just ignore some things you write.

Like how with what I just quoted you had to write the exact same thing and bold some words for me.

Carl is a rockstar coach, even with being limited through only text, he was able to get his point across to me once he had it aimed at me


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says Spin and more spin.
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For instance, when you explain things over the Internet to me. You know that I'm a bad learner through reading as my mind will wander or just ignore some things you write.

Like how with what I just quoted you had to write the exact same thing and bold some words for me.

Carl is a rockstar coach, even with being limited through only text, he was able to get his point across to me once he had it aimed at me.

You have made me laugh several times today. Not sure which the funniest. But since it sounds like Archo didn't get your comment about how joining the forum caused him to drop from CNT superstar level, I'm gonna say, that may be the best one yet.

Hahahahahahaha.



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