China Smash 2024, Beijing, 9/26-10/6

[SFF_lib]

He started varying his placement in later games, but it was too late when he should've done so with those game points in G3.

If they were still playing with celluloid balls, many of those FH would've been killers, regardless of placement. In terms of strength, I'd argue XP's FH is stronger than ML's at that age, whose FH got countered a lot back in the celluloid days.

That’s why table tennis is a very sophisticated sport requiring fast thinking and smart strategy at a split second. Of course the physical strength is just as important.

FZD 8 years ago was like XP with supreme physical strength but lacking the strategy.

 

[zeio]

Like @blahness said, they did have a point at the time. If you watch his games from the early 2010's his play was pure technical perfection but nothing more. What people don't realize, or realize but don't care for, is that building a solid foundation then grow individually from that point onward is a valid pathway as opposed to fostering individuality at a young age.

After years of observation, most of those comments come from the West. I compare it to farmed vs wild salmon (nurture vs nature). East Asian players (other than JPN which has a philosophy closer to the European countries) have a long tradition of placing emphasis on fundamentals (everyone gets fed the same nutritious food and antibiotics) whereas European players stress individualism (the law of the jungle) and so are much less reluctant to play with a lot of free-flowing and non-standard strokes.

ZJK's dad talked about the importance of laying a solid foundation on CCTV in 2014.
https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV17p4y1c7as?t=428

 

[zeio]

That’s why table tennis is a very sophisticated sport requiring fast thinking and smart strategy at a split second. Of course the physical strength is just as important.

FZD 8 years ago was like XP with supreme physical strength but lacking the strategy.

I'd say FZD was like LSD, having the same BH-oriented style. Both of them lost some matches where they could've won due to a lack of experience. XP is actually akin to WLQ, losing tons at the beginning and only realizing their full potential later on due to a lack of TT quotient. Who still remembers Cai Zhenhua and other coaches calling WLQ a retard and WLQ didn't take offense and even concurred?

蔡振华怒斥王励勤“低能”
https://www.sina.com.cn/sports.sina.com.cn/others/9910/3110376.shtml

　　王励勤２８日在世界杯首场小组赛上１比２负于日本“削球机器”松下浩二后，中国队总教练蔡振华当着１０余名记 者把王励勤比作“低能儿”。“他打球不动脑子，木得很。”蔡振华摇头长叹。王励勤的主管教练李晓东的“口径”与总教练 一致。他说：“王励勤打球脑子不够使，比赛中不能及时调整战术，注意力不够集中。”“我脑子不够！”王励勤在赛后说。 曾给中国乒坛带入一缕清风的王励勤也变成了自怨自艾的祥林嫂。

...

　　蔡振华在评价有６年国家队队龄的王励勤时还说：“我们８月８日（在世乒赛上）发现了王励勤这个问题（不动脑子 ），但由于世乒赛后国家队没有集训，也没有参加重大比赛，所以现在你们问我有什么办法，我可以告诉你们，没有！”

　　也许是挨骂多了，王励勤有点怕教练，怕记者。一名外国记者得知王励勤的遭遇后感叹道：“Ｐｏｏｒ Ｂｏｙ（这 孩子，真可怜）。”

乒羽中心副主任发话：教练不该骂王励勤
https://www.sina.com.cn/sports.sina.com.cn/others/9911/0110503.shtml

　　曾被称为“世界冠军后选人”王励勤最近100天内4次败给3名法国选手。在本届世界杯男子乒乓球赛小组赛 上，王励勤先后负于日本的松下浩二和瑞典的瓦尔德内尔。世界杯赛第一天，中国队教练中一人称王励勤“低能”，另一人说 王励勤“脑子不好使”，“训练已不能解决他的问题”。杨树安认为，作为教练，这种话是不该说的。

　　1995年世界男单冠军孔令辉和世界职业巡回赛总决赛冠军王励勤昨天未能获得小组出线权。28日，王励勤 首战失利后，恨铁不成钢的中国队总教练蔡振华说王励勤是“木瓜脑袋”，“智商有问题”。今天，蔡振华“收回”了过激言 辞。他说：“我说这话是在气头上，媒体不能这么引导。”

[視頻]"兵乓球王子"王勵勤曾被痛斥為"低能兒"
http://big5.cctv.com/gate/big5/news.cctv.com/society/20080711/102609.shtml

由於性格內向，王勵勤經常在關鍵比賽中出現“短路”現象，暴露出心理素質上的弱點：1999年，第45屆世乒賽，他竟然在單打賽中敗給實力平平的法國選手埃洛瓦；在之後的比賽中，他出現一連串的低級失誤，氣得蔡振華當著眾多記者的面，痛罵王勵勤是“低能兒”。

 

[dingyibvs]

After years of observation, most of those comments come from the West. I compare it to farmed vs wild salmon (nurture vs nature). East Asian players (other than JPN which has a philosophy closer to the European countries) have a long tradition of placing emphasis on fundamentals (everyone gets fed the same nutritious food and antibiotics) whereas European players stress individualism (the law of the jungle) and so are much less reluctant to play with a lot of free-flowing and non-standard strokes.

ZJK's dad talked about the importance of laying a solid foundation on CCTV in 2014.
https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV17p4y1c7as?t=428

I think each approach has its pros and cons. Fundamentals are boring and time consuming, most kids even those with great potential won't do enough of it if left to their own devices. However, the parents/guardians can easily pick the wrong field to make the kid train in. Who knows how many great sportsmen were forced to spend all their time learning math, for example? OTOH, if kids were allowed to develop on their own, you can more easily match the talent to the field of study for the kids. But then they may be prevented from reaching their full potential because they never developed the most solid fundamentals as a kid.

 

[zeio]

I think each approach has its pros and cons. Fundamentals are boring and time consuming, most kids even those with great potential won't do enough of it if left to their own devices. However, the parents/guardians can easily pick the wrong field to make the kid train in. Who knows how many great sportsmen were forced to spend all their time learning math, for example? OTOH, if kids were allowed to develop on their own, you can more easily match the talent to the field of study for the kids. But then they may be prevented from reaching their full potential because they never developed the most solid fundamentals as a kid.

王大勇/Wang Dayong, who coached the Belgium team years ago, once touched on the aspect of 天生天養 (born by nature, raised by nature).

https://www.tabletennisdaily.com/fo...re-talented-in-table-tennis.23478/post-315495

　　European players are more talented?

　　It is not the Europeans that put forward this view, but Wang Dayong, a senior coach in China. The Chinese coach who has been coaching in Europe for many years once lamented: "Those table tennis players who can make a name for themselves in Europe are all geniuses. Reaching that kind of height in that environment only shows that they are really talented." According to Wang Dayong, the European table tennis environment simply cannot be compared with that in China. Some athletes still have to earn a living while playing. The state doesn’t pay attention to it and doesn’t support it. The cost of going abroad to play matches must be solved by themselves. It's exactly on such a barren land that these top athletes as Lao Wa, Schlager, Samsonov and Saive were born. It seems that the European talents for table tennis are truly not bad.

 

[dingyibvs]

The women's finals was kinda meh. Neither lady seemed to be in her best form, though WMY was in worse form, seems to have missed all her BH down the line shots. Hoping for some fireworks in the men's finals.

 

[Janard]

Based on ITTF, ATTC starts today/tomorrow...?

But we are still here at China Smash, and no draws for the group stages done even. Did I miss something?

 

[Tony's Table Tennis]

Based on ITTF, ATTC starts today/tomorrow...?

View attachment 32401

But we are still here at China Smash, and no draws for the group stages done even. Did I miss something?

yep, no breathing space

 

[Tony's Table Tennis]

Chop block was way easier in the 38mm days, hence you see it more often before, and into the 40.
At 40+ the bigger ball pops up higher, thus making it a much more higher risk shot than that of 40 and 38 days.

I used to love how Ma Lin will just chop block that ball and the ball can drop dead short on the table. control is incredible.

 

[Robin0910]

I guess rarely playing Lin Shidong shows itself here in the first game for Ma Long

 

[SFF_lib]

Wow ML really struggling with LSD's serves. Hook serve is nothing new I am sure ML has trained for it right?

 

[dingyibvs]

LSD showing what many of the younger Chinese players are missing these days, a short game that troubles even ML. ML manages to change up his receives and claw back a set though, now it's a best of 5.

 

[dingyibvs]

Interesting, ML just changed his racket.

 

[SFF_lib]

Interesting, ML just changed his racket.

When? I thought you must use the same racket throughout the whole match?

 

[dingyibvs]

When? I thought you must use the same racket throughout the whole match?

You're allowed to change if there's damage, he must've damaged it at some point of time. It was at the start of the 3rd set.

 

[AutomaticBackhand]

This is arguably the greatest WTT tournament so far.

 

[SFF_lib]

This is arguably the greatest WTT tournament so far.

The stadium, the top players and the number of spectators throughout is just insane. I feel like this is better than the Olympic.

 

[dingyibvs]

Ma Long's FH isn't nearly as on point as yesterday, but he's using great tactics to keep LSD from playing his game. A lot of short game to wrong foot LSD, left when he's expecting right, short even if floaty when he's expecting long and fast, long and even if floaty when he's expecting short. Then the FH shots are very focused on LSD's body or elbow, or very wide sidespinning FH.

 

[blahness]

LSD looks a bit lost against Ma Long's variations...

 

[AutomaticBackhand]

Fang Bo alongside Wang Chuqin and Liang Jingun in the crowd!