How to see the ball early ?

Archosaurus · Jul 31, 2017

Going in before the contact after a small shuffle has helped me with receiving short serves, but what if a very fast long serve comes?

When I look at slow-mo of pros, it seems that they take a very small step forward before contact, and if it's long, they just use footwork to stop the momentum a bit so they don't impact it too early. Is this really what's happening? How much are you supposed to commit to the movement before you see the depth?

NextLevel · Jul 31, 2017

Baal said:
Here is something I have discovered, it is quite interesting about how we perceive things. The start was that I recently had one of those hallmark number birthdays and didn't like feeling old.

So, I have almost compulsively spent the entire spring and summer getting fitter. I have lost weight and even more body fat (~8 lbs since early June, mostly not through diet), and through road cycling have strengthened both legs and more importantly balanced the strength between them more. This also increased aerobic fitness and endurance. I have also spent a lot more table tennis time drilling footwork; mainly because now I am physically capable of doing it without getting tired or injured. 2-2 drills, 2-1 drills, Falkenburg drills, etc. A partner and I have been really disciplined about this since April. I am now really curious about how far this will take me (although I have to say that I am enjoying the cycling as much as the TT now, which is over time going to cut into some of my TT training*).

All that to say that I am moving much better than I have in about 20 years.

And the interesting thing now is that I have the sensation that I am seeing the ball better and earlier!! And yet my eyes haven't improved. What has improved is that seeing the ball "late" doesn't matter because I can more easily get to it in time and then hit a nice balanced shot with good body rotation. But I have to note again that this makes it seem like I am seeing earlier.

I guess, then all this lengthy stuff is to say that one way to "see the ball earlier" is to make it not matter much if you don't see the ball early! I know not everyone will want to do this. I hope I can sustain it (although at some point I will probably have to reduce the intensity of what I am doing).

* By the way, if you think TT is equipment-obsessed and a quick way to burn through loads of money in ill-considered ways, take my word for it, cycling is orders of magnitude worse! And like in TT, anything with carbon composited materials in it ups the price dramatically.

This is an excellent post. Getting fitter is a part of it, as well as being able to take the ball at multiple timings, especially when you get to it late.

I remember that a huge part of my TT improvement began when I managed to loop the ball when I got to it late and put it back on the table. This allowed me to move the ball and not feel rushed and if I got there on time, I could drive it and it I got there late, I could loop it. OF course, this allows good players to put you under pressure, and it requires movement, but it is very easy to feel pressured to take every shot right off the bounce with good anticipation. I consider this a mistake at almost all levels and believe that the ideal playing distance against every opponent in every point is the one from which you can play strokes at the opponent and this is not always by playing at the table off the bounce (doesn't mean you should play 20 feet away, but that you should always move to the distance where you can see and launch the ball if your anticipation is under too much pressure).

Even if when back off the table, you are not rushing your opponent, you can fail to realize that your playing shots with late timing from distance can lead to balls that people don't train against often and that can handcuff them much more severely than you expect.

ttmonster · Jul 31, 2017

Here is what I found in terms of tennis , I will try to play around with the timing ... my idea is to get a standard timing where its not dependent on the other person , the time from the first touch seemed like the one that cannot change
http://www.tennismindgame.com/improving-anticipation.html

UpSideDownCarl said:
Perhaps the timing is different for some. I think a person may need to practice it and play around with it to see what works. But the idea is that you get yourself moving before the serve so that you are ready to move to the serve while you read the spin.

Baal · Jul 31, 2017

Another thing about seeing earlier is learning to watch your opponent more in between shots. Depending on their position at a certain point you can predict where they pretty much have to hit the ball (unless they are Waldner).

Baal · Jul 31, 2017

UpSideDownCarl said:
This post has really useful info.

Sent from The Subterranean Workshop by Telepathy

Completely off topic, the new set of wheels I just bought for my road bike cost ~$400 (fortunately I had "buyer points" because I had bought the bike at a special sale, and still have about $70 bucks). The money drain of cycling is intense compared to table tennis.

All of you, thank your lucky stars you chose TT!

The cycling really helps my TT more than I can say.

ttmonster · Jul 31, 2017

Great point , I think I can do this better in doubles since you can pretty much hand off the initiative to your partner in between points while you get ready for the next shot ... may be something that we need to transition off from doubles into singles ..

Baal said:
Another thing about seeing earlier is learning to watch your opponent more in between shots. Depending on their position at a certain point you can predict where they pretty much have to hit the ball (unless they are Waldner).

Audrey17 · Aug 1, 2017

No one can actually see the moment of force as she/he strikes the ball especially on ground strokes. I pay very close attention to the ball when it is 2 or 3 feet before I make contact. Then I look to see the blur of my racquet after contact. This action forces me to keep my head still through the shot.

ttmonster · Aug 2, 2017

we are not talking about tennis ...

Audrey17 said:
No one can actually see the moment of force as she/he strikes the ball especially on ground strokes. I pay very close attention to the ball when it is 2 or 3 feet before I make contact. Then I look to see the blur of my racquet after contact. This action forces me to keep my head still through the shot.

tropical · Aug 2, 2017

I once met a Chinese coach who said pro's look at opponent strike to anticipate direction and spin, then move foot/body in position to hit the ball, as body can't react fast enough once the ball leaves the opponent racket. Cheng Yinghua always said you must be in correct/good position to hit the ball. So footwork is the most important besides anticipation of ball direction/spin. Well, it is easier said than done, and requires a lot of practice. I mean A LOT!

ttmonster · Aug 2, 2017

What do you mean when you say "opponent strike" ? Isn't it the same thing as impact .. please help to explain ..

tropical said:
I once met a Chinese coach who said pro's look at opponent strike to anticipate direction and spin, then move foot/body in position to hit the ball, as body can't react fast enough once the ball leaves the opponent racket. Cheng Yinghua always said you must be in correct/good position to hit the ball. So footwork is the most important besides anticipation of ball direction/spin. Well, it is easier said than done, and requires a lot of practice. I mean A LOT!

tropical · Aug 2, 2017

The coach meant the opponent's body move and motion of the arm before he/she actually hit the ball. High level opponent still can change the ball direction at the last contact but doing so would slow down the ball so you will have more time to react.

Baal · Aug 2, 2017

tropical said:
I once met a Chinese coach who said pro's look at opponent strike to anticipate direction and spin, then move foot/body in position to hit the ball, as body can't react fast enough once the ball leaves the opponent racket. Cheng Yinghua always said you must be in correct/good position to hit the ball. So footwork is the most important besides anticipation of ball direction/spin. Well, it is easier said than done, and requires a lot of practice. I mean A LOT!

interesting. I used to travel to DC area a lot on business and would often take a lesson from Cheng. He emphasized that a lot, and he we would spend some time in kind of random topspin drills where he would try to get me to do that. Sometimes he would fool me by changing his body and hitting in a really unexpected direction to try to keep me from reacting too soon.

Eric Owens used to always tell me that I had a lot more time than I thought I did.

adolifadison · Aug 3, 2017

I am interested in this game and it will helpful for me in future . If i have need for any time type of information in this game then i will see your blog and take ideas from here

gtardy80 · Aug 4, 2017

nice thread..

adolifadison · Aug 4, 2017

I asked from you on yesterday but you didn't reply me about this game . Now i want to know deeply about this game please give me response .

ttmonster · Aug 4, 2017

Copyright to UpSideDownCarl :

Research studies show these traits are the most common in internet trolls:

1) The need to be in the spotlight: narcissism: wants to be center of attention, don't care about other people, need other people to look at you.
2) Antisocial; Psychopothy: lack of empathy.
3) Machiavellianism: manipulating people for personal gain.
4) Sadism, getting off on harming others.

These are known as the dark tetrad.

Why do trolls troll:

1) Seeking conflict/attention factor: they want attention and negative attention is better than none at all.
2) Viciousness/nastiness factor: Malicious; pure sadism.
3) Low self confidence factor: trolling to get status.
4) Amusement factor: trolling just for the LULZ.

Solutions for dealing with trolls:

1) Band together and self police.
2) Learn to ignore obvious trolling posts: don't feed the trolls.
3) See it for what it is. Don't get sucked into the trolls behavior.
4) You have to ignore trolls. If the troll doesn't get the attention he is seeking the troll can lose interest.

Well, some trolls have proved quite persistent over years and years.

adolifadison said:
I asked from you on yesterday but you didn't reply me about this game . Now i want to know deeply about this game please give me response .

UpSideDownCarl · Aug 4, 2017

adolifadison said:
I am interested in this game and it will helpful for me in future . If i have need for any time type of information in this game then i will see your blog and take ideas from here

adolifadison said:
I asked from you on yesterday but you didn't reply me about this game . Now i want to know deeply about this game please give me response .

What is your first language? Where are you from? Explain what you feel you have asked.

Sent from The Subterranean Workshop by Telepathy

Ilia Minkin · Aug 4, 2017

tropical said:
I once met a Chinese coach who said pro's look at opponent strike to anticipate direction and spin, then move foot/body in position to hit the ball, as body can't react fast enough once the ball leaves the opponent racket. Cheng Yinghua always said you must be in correct/good position to hit the ball. So footwork is the most important besides anticipation of ball direction/spin. Well, it is easier said than done, and requires a lot of practice. I mean A LOT!

Coaches in Russia that I know always emphasize the importance of footwork. Once they see that a student can play decent shots from a single point and is physically capable, they immediately encourage to play footwork over, and over, and over.

adolifadison · Aug 5, 2017

My first language is English . I am from USA . I want to get proper information about this game .

UpSideDownCarl · Aug 5, 2017

adolifadison said:
My first language is English . I am from USA . I want to get proper information about this game .

Why are you posting in a thread with a specific topic?

Why are you asking a vague question that makes it look like you cannot speak English when, in this comment, you seem to speak English just fine?

I recommend you make a thread where you can ask whatever questions about the sport you would like. But why are you derailing this thread with questions that don't even specify what information you want? And with questions that certainly ARE NOT ON TOPIC!

If you read and speak English well, you could be reading subject matter on information about different aspects of table tennis for days and days and weeks and weeks on this forum and never need to ask a question. But you have not even asked a question and then you are kind of rude about the fact that nobody answered a question you didn't even really ask.

So I am wondering what your game is.

How to see the ball early ?

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