Backhand rubber

[NextLevel]

For someone who has a camera, TareqPhoto is pretty slow...

 

[NextLevel]

TareqPhoto,

Either you pay for coaching online or you pay for coaching in person or you find a better player, make him your friend, and then have him teach you stuff. Table tennis is hard to learn without coaching.

Since you have a camera, record all your matches and if you have good internet, store the videos on YouTube and make them private so only you can see them. Then just record your lessons and no one will care. That way, you can see what people were teaching you and remember it. Recording your lessons is the best way to make sure you are getting good value for your lessons.

 

[UpSideDownCarl]

Tareq, why don't you practice it ? I mean it seems you have mates able to put you in difficulties with their serves into your BH. Why don't you train with them ? This is the best way to improve.

Exactly.


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[UpSideDownCarl]

Tareq, based on your comments, one of the biggest things it seems is that you may actually need to learn how to train. Training is not just hitting the ball back and forth like when you warm up. And to do effective training you need at least one good training partner; ideally you would have several but starting with one is better than none.

The training partner, for the most part could be better or worse than you. The ones that are better than you, you ask them to help you get better by telling you things to work on, things to change, etc.

Training is a sustained process of working on technical skills. Some training are things like one person blocking while the other person loops. That is very basic. But still valuable. More advanced versions of that are that the person blocks the ball to different placements. They could be set placements: to wide forehand - to middle. They could be random placements: on each block the ball could go ANYWHERE. Those kinds of drills have their place. So do multiball drills.

But it sounds like you need to work on serve and receive drills. There are many kinds of serve and receive drills.

For now you would do well to find someone better than you who wants to work on his serves and get him to practice his beats serves where his goal is basically to try and make it so you cannot return the serves. But while doing that, he tells you what you are doing wrong and a few things you could do to return the serves better. The person would serve to you for an extended period of time: 20-60 min straight of that person serving to you.

In any case, this is just a drill that would help you but it sounds like you need to learn how to train effectively.


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[UpSideDownCarl]

Also, what happens if you are given similar serves to your forehand? What do you do when the serves come to your forehand? What is your success rate on the serves that do go to your forehand?

If you are returning them well with FH you may also want to analyze what is working for your FH.


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[Der_Echte]

Maybe Tareq is in a situation where it is difficult to do any meaningful practice. Still, he could practice serve impact and serving at least a little no matter how bad the situation is.

 

[UpSideDownCarl]

You may be right William, but not everyone realizes that there are ways of training. So hopefully that info helps about learning ways of training.

For me training is much more fun than matches most of the time.


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[Der_Echte]

It is because you MAKE the training fun.

Much like I make chicken and beer bet hustling in Korean clubs fun.

 

[UpSideDownCarl]

Good point.


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[UpSideDownCarl]

Or like doubles was fun when we were at that Korean club in Queens even though I usually don't like doubles.


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[Der_Echte]

I made the comment about possible difficult situation to train, because with the exception of my time in Korea and my last month+ being in Boston, my personal TT situation was like that or much worse. Even in Boston, if you come to the club at the "Wrong" time, all you can do is play matches, or get off the table, it is as simple as that. you COULD take lessons, but the standard lesson is a full hour long and $50 USD smackeroos. Think of all the pizza, beer, and training vids you can get for $50 and we know many think this before committing to lessons. You COULD wait until the crowds thin out by 10PM or so and play until midnight, but you will likely be on a path to divorce doing that on a consistent basis.

Lessons are less expensive than EJism, but not by much.

 

[NextLevel]

Lessons are less expensive than EJism, but not by much.

That's irrelevant - lessons make you a better player for sure. EJism does not!

 

[Der_Echte]

Or like doubles was fun when we were at that Korean club in Queens even though I usually don't like doubles.


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It was fun, because I gave you very good chances to succeed if you were brave enough to attack the chances given, which you were... to outstanding effect. I only had to clean up 1 out of 10 you attacked, most you spun them and they blocked out and long... enough to measure with the same tape they use to measure discus throw, or I got you high balls to smash at speed of sound barrier.

They were reluctant to attack serve, they lost points doing that. They lost points pushing it long to your ready FH. They soon lost all hope and then we tightened the tourniquet by talking just a little noise. The reaction of the opponents was prolly the funnest.

 

[Der_Echte]

That's irrelevant - lessons make you a better player for sure. EJism does not!

True, but look at it from the EJ's side... all that money freed up for unlimited pizza/beerz and all that gear to tote around and display proudly to TT friends at the club like it is show and tell... then they get to be a BOSS on the internetz forums with their stash. You know the type. I have seen only ONE dude have a huge collection that wasn't this kind of EJism... this dude simply liked TT and had money to spare on gear and not miss anything. You know who he is and he is good folk.

On the other side... how many EJs and wannabe players have you seen take lessons for two to three years starting out at USATT 1400 level and never really make it past 1600 level? I seen a LOT of 'em and I really haven't been in the sport that long.

 

[Suga D]

Ah ok, say game simulation so i can understand better.

Well, i play games simulations, but in those games no one teach others anything, sometimes they repeat some points or don't count 1 point or 2 just for fun, but none are willing to teach others anything either win or lose, even the coach when he plays with some players he doesn't teach what is right or wrong until they take coaching paid with him.

I hope i can find someone who is kind enough to teach me what's wrong if i play against him and lose, but my only chance that i will fight for is to find a more nearby club where they adopt only citizens like me and teach us either free or by paying, because i am registered to a table tennis academy which is open for all members any nationals with payment, while the official clubs some are having table tennis only for locals or citizens and they have coaches, and they try to train them to be in the national team or for some tours, in the club in my city, the coach teaches locals and non locals kids only, but adults he teaches only locals and he welcomes me to join but he is too busy teaching in different places in very short time.

Well, my other option is to use my other blades where i have different rubbers, maybe i will have few great for returning, if i will wait someone to teach me while i am playing with him i may wait very long, so better to do something now than to wait very long, or better i never play against those strong higher level or skilled opponents then.

Can you direct me to videos where someone serve very low spinney to the left side of BH and showing how the opponent return those kind of serves without pips out rubbers? serves to the left wing of the receiver low spinney or heavy spin, not the long fast ones.

Tareq, sometimes you make me think, you are a pro and you're just pulling our legs and makin' fun of us... :-D

Well anyway, maybe you should observe games more closely. Sometimes you can learn more watching others or yourself (on Video) and really try to understand what is happening exactly than just knocking balls around unconsciously.
So watching others (if possible in slow motion) how they return serves could also teach you a thing or two. But you need to understand what is going on.

For example: if your opponent spins the ball in a certain way, the ball is gonna fly in a certain direction if you just stick out your bat.
So a little adjustment of your motion is needed. And like NL wrote, you can even just try to spin the ball in the opposite direction. If you keep practicing on that repeatedly, you'll get confident more and more in returning and even try out different ways to return.

Just observe how others do it, not only the top players, but also the ones on your level or a little higher maybe, 'cause doing what the pros do will also recquire the Training time and intensity of a pro... So it'll make more sense tryin' to take step one before you take step two and first learn to return in a way that doesn't allow your opponent to kill your returned ball instantly and then go for other goals after you accomplished that...

 

[NextLevel]

True, but look at it from the EJ's side... all that money freed up for unlimited pizza/beerz and all that gear to tote around and display proudly to TT friends at the club like it is show and tell... then they get to be a BOSS on the internetz forums with their stash. You know the type. I have seen only ONE dude have a huge collection that wasn't this kind of EJism... this dude simply liked TT and had money to spare on gear and not miss anything. You know who he is and he is good folk.

On the other side... how many EJs and wannabe players have you seen take lessons for two to three years starting out at USATT 1400 level and never really make it past 1600 level? I seen a LOT of 'em and I really haven't been in the sport that long.

It's partly because of the nature of the coaching. Too many students like to take lessons from high level coaches rather than from coaches, no matter their level, with a good track record of teaching the kind of player that the student is.

Anyways, let's not derail this topic - I have seen 1100 - rated players waste their money on $50 per hour lessons with 2500 rated players despite the fact that they got their best results in stroke improvement working with a 2100 coach who costs $25 per hour.

So it's important to look for a coach who learned as an adult (if you are an adult) and who can talk you through the pains and process of improving. The alternative is a coach who has worked with adults and understands their pains - some track record of success or willingness to understand your goals is good evidence that a coach is a good candidate. Otherwise, you might as well hope to get lucky hitting multiball with someone who can't even speak your language.

 

[UpSideDownCarl]

You COULD wait until the crowds thin out by 10PM or so and play until midnight, but you will likely be on a path to divorce doing that on a consistent basis.

Funny, that tactic saved my marriage.

Lessons are less expensive than EJism, but not by much.

Why can't I get lessons and be an EJ? I want both.

Lessons are good but their is so much to work on in table tennis that lessons might not cover the entire need for improvement. If I could take 4 hour lessons 6 days a week I would be happy.

But having good training partners and figuring out how to make training possible is worth it.


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[NextLevel]

Funny, that tactic saved my marriage.



Why can't I get lessons and be an EJ? I want both.

Lessons are good but their is so much to work on in table tennis that lessons might not cover the entire need for improvement. If I could take 4 hour lessons 6 days a week I would be happy.

But having good training partners and figuring out how to make training possible is worth it.


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Which is why you tape your lessons and review them so that you can practice what you learned with your training partners.

 

[UpSideDownCarl]

Which is why you tape your lessons and review them so that you can practice what you learned with your training partners.

Hahaha. Yep. It is worth doing that.

Video is really a great way to help you improve. You think you are doing something and you see the video and realize you are actually doing something else. Very useful to be able to see what you really look like when you play.

All these types of things help you improve.

Changing equipment doesn't usually fix a problem. But a good setup for a person's level can help them work on stuff and improve better than using the fastest and spinniest blades and rubbers and thinking they feel great when you are ripping the ball but then when someone gives you crazy spin you have trouble hitting the table.


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[NextLevel]

Also helps to be able to compare what you did/do/are doing to what your coach does/did/is doing without the pressure of trying to do it at the same time.