Elbow getting very sore.... would a lighter racket help?

[dnelsen]

Agreed with the recommendations to rest.

I wouldnt say that weight is the main factor. Head heavy blades are the worst - you might want to look at blades with centre of gravity closer to the handle.

One thing is looking at your technique to use more body and less forearms.

The other possibility is to use a faster setup so that you can produce ball speed with less force (ie less impact on your body, you can hit more relaxed)

The Virtuoso AC is really well balanced and not at all head heavy. It's the small 157 head size, the rubbers are soft and light. and the handle is very solid feeling. The handle is of very high quality wood with a dense grain, probably heavier than most handles.

I'm not finding any blades that would fit the bill as being lighter while still performing as I would like. Balsa blades sound too stiff and not at all conducive to looping.

Perhaps I'll try Factive on the forehand as well as the backhand. This will save about 5 grams, but would probably slow down my forehand more than I would like.

 

[dnelsen]

I experienced the same problem.
I bought an Sanwei Feather carbon and glued AK47 blue on it.. both sides. 150-ish grams. and reduced the time of playing/training sessions,
I visited a physiotherapist who treated the elbow, dry needling therapy. needed 3 visits.
I took daily warm / cold 'baths' for my elbow. Two buckets with water, hot and cold.. it will increase blood flow
I used anti-inflamatory gel (Ibuprofen)
still took a few months until the inflammation was completely healed..

How do you like the Sanwei Feather Carbon?

Reviews of balsa blades are all over the place. Many say they are terrible for an offensive looping game and is really only for defensive players. Others claim that balsa blades are actually just fine for an offensive player, albeit lighter and they take some getting used to. Overall the reviews don't inspire confidence... hard to ignore the negative reviews.

 

[Airoc]

Perhaps I'll try Factive on the forehand as well as the backhand. This will save about 5 grams, but would probably slow down my forehand more than I would like.

My two cents: If 177 grams are a problem, 5 less wouldn´t solve it.
You have a light and as you say well-balanced setup and you love it. Changing one rubber and continuing to play, hoping the pain will go away, doesn´t seem like a good idea. Rest, doctor´s advice, treatment sound better to me.

As for Balsa, it really isn´t the material of choice for spin creation. Often preferred by "destructive" players because it seems to work well with pips, strong catapult effect. The only Balsa blades I ever liked were those that didn´t "play like Balsa" ;-)

 

[dnelsen]

The only Balsa blades I ever liked were those that didn´t "play like Balsa" ;-)

And which would those be? If I can find a balsa blade that loops well I might give it a whirl. The weight savings is huge with some of them.

 

[Wakkibatty]

Does anyone have a recommendation for a very light OFF rated blade?

I would probably want inner carbon, given how great the Virtuoso AC has been. The way it crackles on a solid hit is magic. Like stepping on a saltine cracker. The sound alone is so addictive.

Still has tons of feel, honestly not far behind my Virtuoso OFF-. With C1 on forehand it’s a spinny loop monster

Should I try… BALSA?!?!?!… is it really that bad?

Oh the horror!

The tibhar balsa 75 seems nice. 2 carbon layers, 75 grams.

Balsa gets a very bad rap in blades, underservedly so in my opinion. There's at least one 2000+ ranked national veterans champion I know of who's using a balsa blade, and amongst combination players they are immensely popular. Balsa can make a truly magnificent blade with outstanding power to weight ratios. The only thing it doesn't readily do is flex very much, but there are ways around that problem too.

The problem is partially that most of the balsa blades out there are cheap blades, and are correspondingly cheaply made. The manufacturers mix hugely different density pieces of wood together into one blade, they use cheap glues and cheap handle scales, and they then whack lower quality outer veneers on the top (usually koto as it allows the balsa effect to become accentuated).

People then buy and use these sub-standard blades and unsurprisingly have bad experiences with them or else they fall apart after a year or two, and as a result people blame the wood, not the maker.

I currently have three balsa blades in my line-up, two of which are actually currently my best sellers and are hugely popular, simply because I make them properly. I use consistent density balsa, I make them with care, I only use top quality handle woods and glues, and they have great balance, huge power and impressive performance. I use one myself in my own comp games and have no complaints.

Long story short, if you want a light and powerful blade, and don't care much about lower flex and a lower throw, then a balsa blade is definitely the go-to option. Just spend the money and get yourself a good one, so that it has consistent wood density In it. Just like with all blades, you get what you pay for -- cheap blades mean cheap wood, and when making a balsa blade, it's definitely garbage in, garbage out.

 

[TackyForehand]

Does anyone have a recommendation for a very light OFF rated blade?

I would probably want inner carbon, given how great the Virtuoso AC has been. The way it crackles on a solid hit is magic. Like stepping on a saltine cracker. The sound alone is so addictive.

Still has tons of feel, honestly not far behind my Virtuoso OFF-. With C1 on forehand it’s a spinny loop monster

Should I try… BALSA?!?!?!… is it really that bad?

Oh the horror!

The tibhar balsa 75 seems nice. 2 carbon layers, 75 grams.

You might want to try a nittaku tenaly blade. I had similar pain along my arm until I switched blades. The angle does make a difference

 

[UpSideDownCarl]

Still a bit sore but I didn’t make it any worse.

Is it better to really let it stop hurting before playing? I’m super hooked right now can’t help myself

Something to understand, regardless of whether it is "tennis elbow" or something else, if, when you don't play for a while the pain eases up and moves towards not being as much of an issue, and then after you play for over an hour, you notice the pain is notably worse, then it is not hard to connect dots and say, playing aggravates or even causes, the pain.

And if that is the case and it happens after each time you play for over an hour, the issue can be categorized as A REPETITIVE STRESS ISSUE. And with a repetitive stress issue, at a certain point, since it is caused by an action that stresses an area that is repeated over and over, it starts getting worse and worse IF YOU DON'T STOP DOING WHATEVER IS CAUSING THE STRESS that you keep repeating.

Is it the BH or the FH, is it your mechanics in one of your strokes.....you could probably do tests to find out. But the mechanics of one of your strokes, or both of your strokes, or how you are holding your racket, something you are doing while playing TT is causing that repetitive stress. And if you keep doing it and aggravating the condition, IT WILL GET WORSE. What exactly does that mean? There could be a point where any time you grab a fork or a pen to use your racket hand, your whole arm says "no way buddy". And if it gets to that level of stress in your arm, the amount of time you will need to rest it from the activities that cause that repetitive stress will be a lot longer (4-6 months of not using your hand in a way that causes those muscles that attach to that area of your elbow almost at all).

The pain is an indication that something is going wrong and has to change. Just making the racket lighter probably will not improve the mechanics of your stroke that are causing the issue, whether it is how you are holding the racket, or one of your strokes in particular, without finding what you are doing that is causing the stress and making it so you stop doing the thing that is causing the stress, the issue will slowly progress. And it sounds like you are at the point where you need to stop doing what is causing the stress and start figuring out what you can do to make the issue in the arm start getting better. Until it is better, continuing to do the thing that is causing the issue to get worse will only cause the issue to persist and/or progress.

It is worth doing some research on tennis elbow and ways to address it. Looking at several different approaches may give you better information that looking only at one or two.

 

[Airoc]

And which would those be?

Tibhar Illusion Killer and Tibhar Fortino Performance. But they are not amongst those you´ll see around with 60 grams, and like I said getting one with 80 would not help much in my opinion...

 

[firetack]

Rest and icing worked for me,a month off might do it before it gets any worse.
I ended up using a light def blade with ox lp's and it didn't come back, my match results improved and I prefer this style now.
Fot a light offensive blade without balsa Andro off/s has a compact head and there are light copies,I found one at 74g it's quick enough and not too much flex(used by Sabine Winter)

 

[Airoc]

Andro off/s

Novacell.
Specs indicate a range between 71 and 80. Might be worth a try, if resting and healing is no option ;-)

 

[dnelsen]

Thanks everyone. What an awesome place this forum is.

Carl you are an absolute treasure in this sport. Thanks again for your thoughts.

I'm stopping play until it stops hurting for at least a few days. Playing thru it is stupid. Roger that.

I just ordered a Donic Dotec AR (70 grams) and two sheets of nittaku factive. Low weight is the highest priority. I will probably miss the speed of G1 or C1 that I've been using for forehand lately. It will take some getting used to for sure. I expect it to be weird.... but I also expect it to be the best I can do with a balsa blade.

This setup should get down to 164 grams or so. Lately I've been really enjoying softer rubbers so this could be a really fun setup. Hopefully I'm not needing to swing too much harder to generate pace. By all accounts the blade is on the fast side for an ALL, perhaps more like an OFF-.

Also I'm going to simply take the backhand rubber off of my Stiga Arctic Wood (G1 forehand) just to see what an extreme loss of weight would do. It will get down to 135 or so.

If I have to shelve the Virtuoso AC that will be a total bummer. This is the racket I wanted to settle into and play for the next decade. It's that good. The "stomping on a saltine cracker" sound it makes on a solid hit is really addictive.

Not going to play at all until the new Donic setup is together. That's my forced break. Such a bummer because I'm currently playing the best I've ever played.

 

[Airoc]

Such a bummer because I'm currently playing the best I've ever played.

Don´t worry, that should come back, and hopefully the pain will not.
Best of luck with the new blade.

 

[dnelsen]

Rest and icing worked for me,a month off might do it before it gets any worse.
I ended up using a light def blade with ox lp's and it didn't come back, my match results improved and I prefer this style now.
Fot a light offensive blade without balsa Andro off/s has a compact head and there are light copies,I found one at 74g it's quick enough and not too much flex(used by Sabine Winter)

Nice to hear about some success with a lighter setup. Thanks

 

[Takkyu_wa_inochi]

a lot of good advice here already.
I've been myself suffering from Tennis elbow since Dec23.

it still hurts but ive recovered 75%. At the peak, i couldn't hit a single FH at all, i couldn't lift a heavy suitcase, or even a boiler full of water (around 3kg)

I think the cause wasn't just TT but also typing with computer all day or playing piano.

Rest was #1, i had to stop playing totally for 2 months and couldn't use a mouse for PC either.

I started to do stretching exercises, use cream, go to sento / spa, massage, acupuncture, electric short waves... When i played again, i would play less often, shorter sessions, and play with an elbow supporter. I learnt how to use more my body, and to be more relaxed because i had no other choice ! In that sense it helped. [In the past, i had also changed to a shorter swing to my BH to relieve my shoulder.]

in August 2024, i had recovered 40% but i made a wrong move using a rowing machine, and my elbow hurt in another spot (supination was hurting from the first injury, but now flexion was hurting even more). so i had to rest again, and I decided to start a new treatment in Autumn, based on regenerative therapy (PRP,...). Its a bit expensive and not reimbursed by social security here in Japan, but it worked quite well and i have now recovered 75%+. I feel I still need to be careful.

--
i don't know how old you are but you should listen to your body. REST before it gets worse.
and you should change your technique because you're probably doing things wrong. Racket weight has nothing to do with it. i haven't changed my setup during this episode.

 

[Tyce]

About weight, there are heavy metal (yes, metal) blades for training topspin strokes. This was common practice in the 90s/00s though I don't see it much anymore.
Anyway, the guys I know that used to train with those, under supervision ofc, never had an elbow injury to my knowledge.

So we're perfectly capable of executing a correct topspin movement with a 1kg racket, the problem arises when you stop doing it correctly. And those problems surface easier the heavier your setup is.
Getting a lighter setup could alleviate the symptoms, and make the whole thing a little more fault tolerant. But I can assure you it's just as possible to get these problems with a 160g racket if the underlying technical issue doesn't get resolved. I have been living proof of that last year.

 

[boretennis]

I just ordered a Donic Dotec AR (70 grams)

it's a beautiful looking blade, feels really nice in the hand and yes it's super light. unfortunately i just wasn't able to master it, even though it's classified as AR it was the fastest blade i ever played, but then again i might have had the wrong technique. good luck!

 

[dnelsen]

it's a beautiful looking blade, feels really nice in the hand and yes it's super light. unfortunately i just wasn't able to master it, even though it's classified as AR it was the fastest blade i ever played, but then again i might have had the wrong technique. good luck!

I just assembled the Donic Dotec AR with Nittaku Factive 2.0FH and 1.8BH. The grip feels incredible in my large hand. Not just the bulk and shape, but how it's positioned relative to the blade face. It just wants to rip forehands.

Hopefully the Factive keeps it slow enough, by all accounts it's very fast for an ALL blade.... why not just call it OFF-? All of my recent blades have been OFF (Virtuoso AC, Stiga Arctic Wood), so hopefully it's not too strange of a transition. I fully expect it to be weird and take some serious getting used to. Everything about it is totally different, not just the balsa core.

Total weight is 155. That's 22 grams less than what I was using. I expect this to help, much like the 100lb weight reduction on a 2000lb racecar makes a big difference. Every corner puts massive strain on the chassis, tires, and suspension, far beyond the 100lb due to centrifugal force and deceleration.... and it means that your brakes last 50 laps instead of 45.

I'm going to approach my first session back, with my coach, very carefully -- at least a week away still -- paying very close attention to my form. I want to precisely observe what motions are causing the pain to return, if it indeed returns.

Thanks to everyone for their help with this. I really want to play again. This sport brings me the sort of joy that I haven't felt since being 20 years old with a skateboard.

 

[Zwill]

The people whom I know had, have tennis or golf elbow usually grip the racket handle so hard all the time. Some don't even do any big hits, on the contrary actually, but they still grip the handle strongly like they wanna squeeze out the moisture...

Not sure if this applies to you or anyone mentioned it before. But if it does then stop doing that. And the racket handle matters a lot. I guess the Dotec handle you mention is as good as it gets for comfort and least slippage so you can just hold it like a feather.

Hope you get better.

 

[dnelsen]

Yes I’m definitely excited about the handle, and that I might be able to grip it more loosely.

What I fear is the feedback. I’m used to all wood blades with spectacular feedback, such as Yasaka Sweden Extra and OSP Virtuoso. Surely the cork will feel dull in comparison.

But whatever… all I really care about is being able to play again. If it means adjusting to a strange racket, with an even stranger sound, then so be it.

 

[dnelsen]

My elbow has been feeling a bit better, although still slightly sore, so I played for a few minutes the other day. I'm trying to reach a balance between "don't play thru it" and "I'm in my 50's and being athletic. Of course I'm going to have some aches and pains". Since playing the elbow doesn't feel any worse than before, so that's good. Also I'm doing tennis-elbow stretches and strength-building exercises.

Anyways, the Dotec AR is fantastic. I'm used to high-control all-wood blades, and it took me all of 5 minutes to get used to it. I really don't understand all of the resistance to these blades. It does everything well, including looping. Not too stiff or too fast. I think I nailed it with the slow Factive rubbers, which keep the dwell time up.

It's super light, very spinny, nice touch in the short game and plenty of power when you want it. Weird higher pitched and completely unique "tock" sound. Some have complained about this, I don't see the problem. Of course it's going to sound different, as it has a totally different construction.

Warning: the handle is so good that it instantly ruins all of your other blades. It's that good. It's big and has a lot of flare, and does indeed seem to help with a looser grip, which I will be focusing on. Every other handle now feels tiny and crude in comparison, and that includes Stiga Legend and OSP Elcon (the best large handles on the market).